Reno Advice on unit purchase?

Dear All,

My wife and I have exchanged contracts on a 2 bedroom unit in the Eastern Suburbs of Sydney. I'm after any advice and pointers people might like to offer regarding the reno. We'll be moving into this unit (Stamp duty exemption and FHOG) but it will become an IP in the near future and will be renovated with this in mind.

The basic info on the unit: approx 110sqm including the balcony. About 95sqm internal. Has separate dinning area which opens off the living area. Could be closed in to make a 3rd bedroom if so desired but we'll leave it as is. Kitchen off the living area has some potential to lose a wall (or part of the wall) to open it up to the living area (not load bearing). Two bathrooms, main bedroom has ensuite, internal laundry (it's own room off the kitchen). Has 20sqm LOG in addition. Total on title space of approx 130sqm (slightly under).

The unit is in liveable condition. Structurally everything is good, has been a rental for a while and needs some cosmetice reno work. I've negotiated access prior to settlement to enable us to paint as well as plan and get quotes for anything else we plan to do (eg floors).

What we're considering doing prior to moving in;
- Painting the whole place. I'd be interested in any advice on colour schemes, types of paints etc.
- Replacing the flooring which is currently carpet. Considering wooden floors and carpet. Possibly a combination of the two. Eg, carpet in bedrooms & lounge room, with floor boards in hall, dining and kitchen. Interested in opinions either way here.

Considering the option of buying materials from auctions and getting tradie to install for the floors. We'll probably paint it ourselves. Any advice on tradies in Sydney / Sydney East that would be good for this is also of interest.

Other stuff like fittings, and any fix up on the kitchen & bathroom we'll have to wait until we get access to decide on.

Thanks for your help,

MF

MF35 said:

Dear All,

My wife and I have exchanged contracts on a 2 bedroom unit in the Eastern Suburbs of Sydney. I'm after any advice and pointers people might like to offer regarding the reno. We'll be moving into this unit (Stamp duty exemption and FHOG) but it will become an IP in the near future and will be renovated with this in mind.

The basic info on the unit: approx 110sqm including the balcony. About 95sqm internal. Has separate dinning area which opens off the living area. Could be closed in to make a 3rd bedroom if so desired but we'll leave it as is. Kitchen off the living area has some potential to lose a wall (or part of the wall) to open it up to the living area (not load bearing). Two bathrooms, main bedroom has ensuite, internal laundry (it's own room off the kitchen). Has 20sqm LOG in addition. Total on title space of approx 130sqm (slightly under).

The unit is in liveable condition. Structurally everything is good, has been a rental for a while and needs some cosmetice reno work. I've negotiated access prior to settlement to enable us to paint as well as plan and get quotes for anything else we plan to do (eg floors).

What we're considering doing prior to moving in;
- Painting the whole place. I'd be interested in any advice on colour schemes, types of paints etc.
- Replacing the flooring which is currently carpet. Considering wooden floors and carpet. Possibly a combination of the two. Eg, carpet in bedrooms & lounge room, with floor boards in hall, dining and kitchen. Interested in opinions either way here.

Considering the option of buying materials from auctions and getting tradie to install for the floors. We'll probably paint it ourselves. Any advice on tradies in Sydney / Sydney East that would be good for this is also of interest.

Other stuff like fittings, and any fix up on the kitchen & bathroom we'll have to wait until we get access to decide on.

Thanks for your help,

MF

Click to expand...

Hi MF

It sounds great

A few thoughts....

what floor is the unit on? You might need to check with the Body Corp re what floor coverings are allowed. Some request a soundproofing barrier if you go with wood.

Re colours...depends on how much light you get in there. If it quite dark stick to white/off whites but paint is cheap! While you live there choose what you like. Just keep bathrooms and kitchens neutral if you redo them as they are more expensive to revamp and you don't want them to date.

Opening up part of the kitchen wall sounds good....will make it seem more spacious. You can just replace the kitchen cabinet doors or paint them if they are basically sound. A new benchtop can change the look for little cost.

Same with the bathrooms....if it is sound but just tired looking tile paint does wonders. Just retile the floors if they are old and ugly.

Update the light fittings and the switches if needed.

Post some pics so we can have a look

ani

Thanks for the reply Ani.

The unit is a top floor unit with almost no common walls. One small wall off one of the bedrooms is common. I'll be putting a BIR across that wall as well. The unit is reasonably well lit being top floor with about 80% of the wall space not joining anything and therefore with windows for light. I will post some before and after photos once we've sorted it all out. Don't have access for another three weeks or so and struggling to remember the fine detail of the place myself half the time.

I will be making inquires with the body corporate about the flooring issue in particular, but also about what is required in general for any reno work.

With the floors if we go with the wooden floors (floating floors) we've got a few woods in mind that are middle of the road in terms of how dark they are. Don't like the really white woods, and people say the really dark ones can make the space feel smaller. So going for one in between. Had a look around the show rooms and prices at these places seem to be in the $65 - $80 sqm for the wood and another $40 sqm to lay it. We'll be looking to do it cheaper than that because I don't want to be forking out 10k odd just for the floors (We'lll need to cover 75 - 90m2 of floor space depending on what we do with the kitchen floor). We'll look for a Tradie who can lay them and see what we can find at the Auctions. In this regard from what I've seen on the net carpet seems to be at least as expensive.

If anyone knows any good places to buy Floating Floors and Carpet, or any particular Tradies who lay such flooring (especially where you've got the materials yourself from elsewhere) we'd appreciate the info?

When we get in and can spend more time checking out the unit we'll consider the Kitchen & Bathroom more closely. I think a fix up rather than a completely new kitchen and bathroom is required. Maybe the new benchtops and paint or new doors for example.

Also read about the "resurfacing" offered by "Thermo-Gaze" and will consider that as an option in particular for the bathroom. Anyone had any experiences with resurfacing?

MF

I did floating floors a few years ago at $45 psm, when most other places were $60-$65. So they are around (this was in Canberra so I can't recommend a shop for you).

It is possible to lay floating floors yourself. I have done it, and I'm not a real hands on sort of person. You can see where I've made mistakes- though it's mostly a fair job. I've seen other people do quite a poor job.

If you can go to one of those hardware shop demos, it would be a help. And start off in an area where it won't matter as much.

As mentioned earlier, body corp unlikely to allow change of floors. They will also place restrictions on timing making DIY difficult (eg no noise after 12 saturday and all day sunday or public holidays). Generally hard surfaces only allowed in kitchen and bathroom due to noise transmission. They may allow you to use extra sound proofing underlay but if my unit was under yours I wouldn't. Updating powerpoints and switches will make a big difference. You probably worked this out but paint before changing the floors. Replace fittings in bathroom if possible.

Cheers
Pulse

I’m in the middle of renovating a 2 bedroom unit in Toowong – an inner city suburb in Brisbane, 3 km from the CBD. So I’ll give my two cents worth:

PAINTING
Yep, paint the whole sucker. Never under-estimate the power of a new paint job. It’s simply fantastic. It’ll give the unit an entirely new and vibrant ambience.

The paint scheme I used was white for the ceiling (naturally) and cornices (note - I have no skirting boards in the unit otherwise I would have used white also), and a DULUX colour called ‘China White’ for the walls. These two colours (ok, white is not technically a colour) contrast ever so subtly against each other. It looks real nice. This China White colour is from Dulux’s latest colour range called ‘White on White’. Just pop down to say Bunnings or any other major hardware store and they should know what your talking about.

For the architraves and doors I painted them white (matches nicely with the ceiling) using a DULUX product called Aqua Enamel, which is an acrylic (i.e. water-based) paint that mimics the hardwearing properties of an enamel paint. Why not use enamel to start with I hear you say? Because I can’t cope with the clean up process – its messy, it stinks and its undeniably frustrating. Acrylic paint is a god-send to clean up – simply run it under a tap. Anyway, Aqua Enamel is a pretty good product. A slight downside – it doesn’t self-level as well as enamel, but then again, its easier to apply and clean. Also, trick here is to apply many thin coats, as thick coats tend to show up grooves caused by the bristles in the brush.


Undercoat
When using undercoat, I used a sealer/undercoat combination product from a company called Nu-Tec. In fact, all my paint was Nu-Tec. I simply gave the Nu-Tec dealer the colour algorithm for ‘China White’ and off they went and made me 40 litres worth at $240. I was absolutely rapt at this price after constantly running to Bunnings to purchase 4 litre Dulux tins at $65 each. You do the maths! Bottom line - don’t be fooled into thinking you need to stick with the brand names – you don’t. When possible you want to keep your costs down and I found Nu-Tec a solid alternative. Btw, I am NOT affiliated with this company in any way.


Number of coats:
Ceiling – 2
Undercoat on walls – 2
Top coat on walls – 3 (yes I know the Industry standard used by most processionals painters is 2, but I wanted it done right. 3 layers is definitely the way to go if you want a beautiful, rich finish.)
Architraves – 2 undercoats + 4 thinly applied top coats of Aqua enamel.
Doors– 1 undercoat + 3 top coats of Aqua enamel.

Oh yeah, as I decided to strip the existing paint on my architraves back to the bare aluminium, I had to use a metal primer before applying the undercoats. This is very important as it gives a proper surface for the succeeding layers of undercoat to stick too.

Paint Tools
For the ceiling I used a standard 12mm roller brush (nice and fluffy to hold a lot of paint). For the walls I used an 8mm roller brush (brand = rokset) for flat finishes. For the door I used a 5mm roller brush (brand = rokset) for gloss finishes. Make sure you wash your rollers in warm soapy water before use, so as to get rid of any dust/fluff; this is especially true when rolling the doors as the littlest objects will cause imperfections to show up. When painting the architraves I used a 30mm synthetic bristle brush. I also used this same brush for cutting in between the walls and ceiling. As for cutting in between the walls and architraves I went the way of green painters tape (from Bunnings). Between wall and ceiling I used a steady hand, brush and good technique.

Preparation
As always, give the walls a good/thorough sanding (grip 80-120) and then wash down the ceiling and walls with Sugar Soap or a similar cleaning product.

2 good tips:

1) Invest in a quality, entry-level electrical sander. Last thing you want to be doing is sanding walls with a block of wood and sanding paper. Also get yourself some facial dust masks.

2) With cleaning I found those mops with the disposal sponges to work the best. They offer good coverage and ease-of-use when compared to wiping down walls and ceiling with just your hands and a cloth.

It’s all about being efficient.


FLOORING
I ended up installing Timber floating floors from Anderson’s Carpets (a well-known flooring franchise in QLD). I settled on a product called Tasmanian Oak by Unqiue. I got mine down to $74 m2, which included installation. I also looked at carpet, bamboo flooring (bloody expensive and over-rated!), tiles and acid stained polished concrete as options. In the end I settled on timber floors as they had the best balance between price, durability, maintenance and appeal.

As for checking with your Body Corporate for regulation on flooring, I didn’t bother. All timber floors can be installed with noise-reducing insulation – the neighbours below won’t here a thing.


LIGHTING
I replaced all the lights (crappy old bulbs and wierd looking lanterns/shades) in the bedrooms and living areas with downlights and replaced all power and light switches with new plates (though I stuck to the original configurations). Wow, what a dramatic improvement this gave. And it looks super in combination with fresh paint.

INTERNAL WARDROBE
I gutted the original – and disgusting – 1970’s internal wardrobe in the main bedroom (there wasn’t one in the 2nd bdr) and replaced this with new internals and dual sliding mirrored doors. Man, what a difference! Looks very professional and impressive. I got all of this done through Stegbar. Came to $1175. Now I’m sure this isn’t entirely over-priced, but my gut feeling tells me I could have purchased something a little cheaper had I looked around a bit more. But in the end, I choose Stegbar as they offered a sense of immediacy and customer service that I found lacking from other businesses offering similar products.

Now there’s are a few things you need to consider when looking into an item like this, though I won’t go into the full details here. But just quickly, make sure any quote specifies that you want the existing internals totally ripped out and the new internals installed against the original foundations – and NOT over the existing internals. Unbeknownst to me, this is what Stegbar had originally quoted for, but luckily the Stegbar chippy who came to do the installation, had a stack load of extra chipboard to cover for the additional surface area that was created after the existing internals were ripped out. Make sense? Put simply - don’t get them to install the new internals (ie drawers, clothes racks) over the existing framework – otherwise you’ll not only lose valuable space but it’ll look like sh*t.

One more thing - in terms of adding value, installing a new wardrobe might be a smart move, but as a tool for increasing rental return, I’m not sure you’ll really get your money’s worth. Seriously, is anyone going to pay an extra $5-$10 dollars a week for such a pleasure? Probably not. Then again, if you’re contemplating an honest and proper renovation, then your conscience won’t let you cut corners.

TIMBER BLINDS
If you’re going for timber floors then you’ve got to go with Timber Venetian blinds. It’s a beautiful one-two punch. But go for the imitation ones – they look like real wood (especially the cedar look), come at approximately 60-70% of the cost and are much more durable. And when you have tenants who find twisted joy in seeing how many times those blinds go up and down in a span of 30 secs, then imitation-wood is the way to go – they’ll take a pounding.

When they talk about measurements they’ll ask for the length (ie, width) and drop (ie, height). You can also get these blinds custom made or ready-made (the cheaper alternative). Just shop around a bit (Vista, Kresta, Solomon Blinds, etc) for the best price. Most offer free onsite quotes. For under $300 you can get two windows easily fitted (custom made + imitation style). That’s what my two windows came too (1200mm length+900mm drop & 900mm length + 900mm drop). I went with Vista Blinds.


CONCLUSION
Hmm, that’s about all I can offer in terms of advice. In the end, it’s all about keeping your costs down, implementing quality improvements and learning from others. Search through my other posts for more details into the topics and points I’ve touched upon here.

I cannot offer ideas/tips on the Kitchen and Bathroom, as the previous owner renovated the Kitchen and I’m yet to tackle the bathroom.


Go for it and good luck.

George

George, Thanks for the great post. Alot of good information and ideas for me to consider. I really appreciate the time you took to supply this info and describe your reno work. We're going to give the painting a go ourselves and will seek out tradies for the rest. Your detailed post will help greatly.

I looked up www.nutechpaints.com.au . They seem to be producing outdoor paints etc for roof tiles etc. From what you said I gather they also make interior paints. Do you know if they advertise this or do they just do it when approached? I'll check them out when it comes buying time for the paints.

Thanks again,

MF

No worries MF35 – I’m happy to share with like-minded persons.

About Nu-Tech - I checked out the site and yes, that's them. It's even got the name of the distributor here in Brisbane who I purchased my paint from. Your right, they don't seem to advertise the interior paints, but they definitely make them, no doubt about that. Best thing to do is to ring the distributor in your state and have a chat to them - they'll probably tell you everything you need to know, including the closest dealer in your area.

I must confess that the distributor here in is a friend of a friend, so I was able to purchase the paint directly from their warehouse. See if you can do this in Victoria (maybe not feasible due to distance) and if not, then ask them for the closest dealer who they supply to.

To recap the prices I paid:

20 litre ceiling paint - $120
20 litre sealer/undercoat - $120
20 litre top coat (low-sheen or flat – just tell them its for a bedroom wall) - $120.

----------------------------------
OK - UPDATE

I just rang the Nu-Tech distributor here in Brisbane (Andrew) and asked him the best way to purchase Nu-Tech paints in Melbourne. He instantly said that your best bet is to go to the Thomastown store, which is the actual Nu-Tech dealership. Don't worry about the store that's listed in Melbourne, as they are only distributors, whereas Thomastown is an actual outlet for the public. He said just go down there and they'll be able to match any colour algorithm you want. In other words, if you want 'China White', then they'll make it up, you want Snoop Doogy Dog Pink and they can do that too.

He also said that 90% of their paints are for exterior and stripping - that's why their website is devoid of any real info on interiors.

George

Great post Grubar30,

Have you had a re-val since your renno? If so are you happy to share the before / after renno values?

Thanks Captain.

Haven't re-valued yet. Still have the bathroom and toilet to do, and also some work on the balcony (rust removing, re-painting, etc). Once that happens I'll be running to do a re-valuation.

I'll keep everyone posted of my results.

Btw, unit was bought for $208K in Aug 2004.

Gimme 6-8 weeks and I'll have some answers for you all.

George

grubar30,

Thanks again. I'll check out 'Nu Tech' once I've picked colours etc. Do you know if they're able to do a 'wash and ware' type paint? Also, I'm in Sydney. From memory there are some contacts on the site for various locations around the country where I can make some inquires. But if you happen to be talking to him again and you remember, a pointer to the best place in Sydney to approach wouldn't hurt.

I'll look forward to the pics for your place when you're finished. So are you living in your place while doing the reno?

With our place I've run the reno stuff past the Strata Manager who advises that no prior approval is required for anything except structural changes. IE - if we knock out the kitchen wall, or part there of, we'll need an Engineers Report and confirmation that we've complied with any Council requirements. The wooden floors weren't an issue as long as we use acoustic underlay.

I've spoken to the Auction yards and am advised the Floating Floors usually sell in the $35 - $38 psqm range. Availabililty / choice varies significantly from week to week though. Then I'd have to get hold of the acoustic underlay, and get it all laid. I'm checking out the options with tradies to try and get an idea what they would charge to lay the floor. Hoping it's less than the $40 a sqm the show rooms charge.

Trouble with all the planning is I can't get in for another 3 weeks to get things quoted properly, and to make my mind up about the Kitchen reno stuff. What happens with the kitchen will effect the order everything gets done I'd imagine (I'm assuming the kitchen wall work would be better done before everything else). Hard to make definate plans in these circumstances. Can only do the research and plan generally for a few possible courses of action. Complicated by the fact I'm away at the time of settlement on a pre paid holiday I can't get out of, so everything has to be organised before I go. Then on return have to do the move in. We'll see how it pans out.

I'll let you know how we go.

MF

Hi MF 35

With paint colours Dulux have some great colour charts out at the moment in differnt clours in groups of four giving scope for feature wall etc. We used there relax colour scheme recently in a two bed reno using Berkshire white on the walls, Beige Royal for feature wall and White on white for trim. I think it looks great.

Silas

wooden floor colours

i was reading an interesting interior decorating article the other day about wood colours in homes.

the consensus from the designers was to go for a midrange tone of wood. the reason being is that dark and light woods are very fashionable at different periods but come and go, so if you head for something inbetween you can make the flooring appear lighter or darker depending on your walls colours, knobs, rugs etc ... so the mid range is never actually out of fashion.

lizzie

Hi MF35,

Yep, Nut-tech does a wash 'n wear paint - but they call it washable. Exact same thing!

I picked up more paint during the week, but my mate Andrew wasn't there, so I was unable to ask him about Nu-Tech paint and Sydney. Nonetheless, I did some homework for you this morning and rang the store in Sydney. They quoted me the following prices:

20 litre interior, washable, lo-sheen (i.e. walls) - $102 + GST
20 litre sealer/undercoat - $84 + GST
20 litre ceiling white - $82 + GST

These prices are pretty damn awesome! I was getting the lot for $360 and I KNOW the guy in Brisbane. Looks like I’m getting a raw deal.

Anyway, I spoke to a Deon down in Sydney. He said to place your order, you simply ring him up, tell him what you want and they'll call you back once the paint is finished.

Living in the unit while Renovating
Yes, I’m living in my unit while doing it up. The trick here is to tackle one room at a time and to cordon-off /isolate this room from the rest of the unit with a hanging sheet. I say hanging sheet because I took my doors off when painting the rooms – I found this easier (however, have the doors hanging when getting around to painting them). Regardless how you isolate the room, be sure to do this when sanding otherwise you’ll get dust everywhere and you’ll be cursing yourself trying to clean it up.

CLEANING UP
Oh yeah, DONT use your new/existing (unless its old and crappy) vacuum cleaner to constantly clean up dust whilst renovating. Reason being that vacuum cleaners cannot handle this type of dust, known in the vacuum industry as “plaster dust”. This dust is too fine for vacuum cleaners to filter, so it ends up getting into the guts of the machine and totally screwing it up. You’ll know when this happens because your vacuum cleaner will start making a high pitched sucking noise and there will be very little suction power – and no matter how many times you clean the filter pads or insert a new bag, it gets periodically worse until it finally stops working.

I had this happen to a new cleaner I purchased about 2 months ago and it actually voided my warranty – as I found out when I took it in for repair. The guys at GODFREYS (a well-known vacuum specialist franchise in QLD) - upon opening my machine – immediately asked if I had used it for renovating. I sheepishly said yes and then they gave me the entire spiel how plaster dust is the worst thing for a vacuum cleaner, how it voids the warranty and how people have ruined thousand dollar machines because of this. And in spite of my objections ‘that what kind of vacuum cleaner doesn’t handle dust’, there was no way around this issue. It’s just the way it is!


SO, what you need to do here is go and purchase yourself a crappy little $20-$30 second-hand/used vacuum. GODFREY’S actually had a devoted little section in their store for this very purpose. Yep, a measly $29 is what I paid for a used Sanyo (and I thought they only made Stereos!). Fingers crossed you might get 2-3 weeks of sucking before it craps itself.


Replacing Floors
Another trick – if you’re replacing the existing floor, then leave it in until you have done the painting. This way you don’t have to worry about paint spillages as much. I mean, who cares if it’s eventually getting replaced. But if you put the new floor in prior to painting then your going to get a lot of headaches cleaning up the littlest specs of paint. Also, if you have carpet and you rip this carpet up AFTER you’ve painted, then be careful you don’t tear/strip the paint up the wall in the process. To get around this just run a Stanley-Knife along the edges of your carpet to separate it from the dried paint. And even if you accidentally peel some paint, then don’t fess to much as the skirting boards for your floating floors will hide these little imperfections.

That’s about it….

Cya’s…

George

Grubar30,

More helpful tips & information. Thanks again!

I'll definately give Nu-tech a call up. Sounds like pretty competitve pricing! I've also got a crappy old vacum cleaner so if we need to do any of that type of vacuming we'll be right. Due for a new one.

Re Painting. The paint / walls in our unit are in reasonable condition (Concrete / rendered brick?) but will require some minor cosmetic patch ups to cracks in the walls prior to painting. Did you just paint over the existing paint job? Is there any dramas with this?

We'll be painting before the new floors go in. Might rip up the old carpets first though. Floors underneath are concrete.

We're still a couple of weeks away from access. We'll have the floors & paint (colour / type) picked out before then but will wait util we actually get inside to confirm our choices before we buy / order anything.

Lizzie and Silas referred to the wood floors / paint scheme. We're pretty much settled on wood floors for the kitchen, hall & dinning room. About half the unit. Still undecided about the living room. If it can be done we'll strongly consider carpet in the Lounge area / room. Depend again on getting in and having a good look at what will work. If doesn't work this will be floating floor as well.

We like the mid range woods and have picked out a few likely ones based on similar logic to that discussed by Lizzie. As well as being easy to match to colour schemes / fashion (tennants tastes etc) it's the middle of the road in terms of the visual perception of space (how big or small the place looks / feels). The darker woods make the place look smaller. Personally we like the dark to mid colour woods. But for a combination of the reasons mentioned we'll go with the mid colour floating floors.

With the paint scheme we'll be looking at what they seem to call the 'neutral' or 'natural' colour schemes. Sounds similar to what Silas is describing. I'll have a look at the Dulux colour schemes for ideas.

MF

Also, Re carpet? What do people think are the best carpets (wool/synthetic and combinations etc and styles/types etc) to use and the best places to get them? Sydney interests me but posts about other areas will no doubt be of interest to someone else.

MF

Re Painting. The paint / walls in our unit are in reasonable condition (Concrete / rendered brick?) but will require some minor cosmetic patch ups to cracks in the walls prior to painting. Did you just paint over the existing paint job? Is there any dramas with this?

Click to expand...

Yep, rendered brick. Yes, I painted over the existing walls but NOT before I patched and sanded thoroughly. In fact, some walls had areas with flaking paint that required scraping with a good quality scraper (don't but the cheap ones - they'll warp and bend under good pressure).

To prepare the walls properly:

1) I scraped all loose paint. Just run the scraper hard against the wall and remove as much loose paint as possible, but don’t be too pedantic about it - if it doesn’t come off with one or two good hard scrapes then it wont likely come off anytime soon. Any anyway, once we paint over it, it'll be rock solid for years.

Btw, this was a major step for me but it might not be in your unit.

2) Grab your electric sander (grip =40 or 60 - I didn't find this too rough) and sand like mad. Its imperative you sand the walls. It'll not only give you a smooth surface by flattening any unevenness, but it'll highlight cracks and holes.


3) Patch any gaps, cracks or minor holes. I used a few different gap fillers - the only one that comes to mind is Selley’s “SPAKFILLA Rapid” that dries in 30 min. It comes in a blue container. Not the cheapest stuff. But I have used other products (can’t recall the brand names) that worked just as well and were slightly cheaper.

Remember to wipe the dust off the area before you patch.

4) Sand back the patched areas with a block of wood and a high grip (120 was good). I found using an electric sander was overkill for patched areas – it removed not only the excess bog but the filled gaps too.

5) Clean and wipe down all walls with sugar soap. To make things easier I first went over all the walls with bucket of plain water and one of those mops with the disposal heads. The technique here is to wipe in one direction – from top to bottom, rinse mop after 2-3 wipes and start again. After this is done, you can attack the walls properly with sugar soap. I found that scrubbing the walls with sugar soap immediately after sanding was a waste of time as you weren’t actually removing the dust, but merely moving it around. A once over with water first (remember one direction!) removed all the dust. Give it a go and you’ll see what I’m talking about.

Oh yeah, vacuum up right about now.

6) Apply your first undercoat. Let it dry then patch what you might have missed in step 3 - you’ll often notice that after the first undercoat, some cracks/holes appear that weren’t visible beforehand.

If your thinking “not again” then just remember - a smooth surface is quite conducive to a beautiful finish. In other words, bog and patch thoroughly or it’ll look second rate in the end.

After it dries, sand back again with that small block and high grip and wipe down the affected area with a damp cloth.


After this you can pretty much get stuck into the actual painting.


George

Final Result After Reno

Hi All,

Been some time since the discussion on this thread but thought I'd better get back on and post the result for those who are interested. I sought advice about alot of different areas of the reno work, some of which were discussed in other threads. We moved out a couple of months ago after completing the reno.

The background was this. My wife and I purcahsed our first IP in Kensington Sydney (Eastern Suburbs, neighouring Randwick). We are not tradies and have minimal experience in handyman type work so we were always going to have most work done by Tradies but co-ordinate it ourselves.

The Unit: Large 2 bedroom, with separate dining / 3rd bedroom if enclosed, 2 bathrooms (1 ensuite), internal laundry, large lock up garage with storage space, in a quite street a short walk (100-150ms) to shops, transport etc. 108 sqm floor space including balcony. Garage space on top of that.

The unit was in average but not terrible condition when purchased. It had Peach coloured paint on walls that had been pretty roughly done. Had been tennanted and previous tennant had cats which meant the average light tan carpet (that looked peach at times because of the walls) had to go. It smelled of cat and had some staining (from the cats I'd say). Also, given we were going to live in it for 6 months or more, and my wife had just had a bad experience in a rental where we had some sort of lice or mites in the carpet that bit hell out of her, the carpet was always going.

The Kitchen was older & intact but the stove elements were rusting and the oven wasn't working. There was no dishwasher or space for it within the cupboard set up.

The Bathroom - inside lip to the toilet bowl in the main bathroom was broken. Bathroom toilets and vanity etc were caramel. Vanity was chipboard and starting to rot. It had older wired glass style shower screens with some cracking. Tiles were ok white with faint traces of caramel / tan pattern, but the grouting in some area's was poor. It was chalky and chipped away easily.

There were no built ins in bedrooms, older light fittings, crappy old blinds or none at all.

We decided to target middle - upper middle income professionals (probably couples) as tennants. The area's proximity to the CBD (15 min bus ride), Centennial Park, and the Shopping & Beaches etc of the Eastern Suburbs is somewhat attractive to such tennants. Uni of NSW is nearby and provides students at the right time of the year in case we had trouble getting our target tennant group. The reno was to be a cosmetic one with no structural work required.

Paid $480k for the unit. Was rented for $370 when purchased. Lived in it as our PPOR claiming FHOG & Stamp Duty Exemption. Stayed for about 8 months before moving out for financial reasons (cheaper to rent elsewhere and rent out our unit than live in our own unit). During our stay we completed/organised following renovations;

• Painting througout done ourselves with acrylic paints purchased from Nutech Paints: Used a total of 24Lts of Undercoat Acrylic Sealer, 24Lts of Washable Interior Low Sheen 'China White' for walls (matched to Dulux colour charts), 8Lts of ceiling white, 4 Lts of gloss enamel in 'Stowe White'.
Total cost including freight = $445.55. Could have been even less but we were slightly short of paint and had to re-order.

• New White Venitian Style Blinds throughout with some Role Down blinds in the lounge room (from 'Vista') throughout = $1405

• New Vinyl Rubber Bassed Imitation Wood Floor Planks from 'Classic Floor Coverings' (www.classicfloorcoverings.com.au). Actual product was 'Designer Planks, Natural Spotted Gum'. Worked out at about $80m laid = Total $6420 laid.

There is some discussion regarding this type of flooring on another thread (Classic Floor Coverings) and I must say that I was very happy with the result. Both in terms of look and liveability.

• New Carpet from Harvey Norman for the 2 bedrooms = $1230 laid.

• Large Stegbar Built In mirrored cupboard in Main Bedroom = $1650.

• Bathroom work;
- 2 x bathroom shower recesses re-grouted etc = $990
- New Toilet in main bathroom & Plumbing = $649
- New Vanity in main bathroom (purchased at autctions) = $393.75
- 2 x shower tap sets (purchased at autctions) = $123.75
- 1 x bath tap set (purchased at autctions) = $56.25
- 2 x new shower screens = $465 & $330
Bathrooms total = $3007.75

We possibly could have got away without the re-grouting but as the tiles were older we were concerned if tennants dislodged any we'd have dramas trying to match them. So went for the safer option.

• Light fittings throughout:
- Lights = $246.37 (purchased at auctions)
- Installed cheaply by a friend (qualified sparky) for $50.

• New Kitchen;
- Tiling = $450
- Tiles = $227.50
- Plumbing = $450
- Electrical = $495
- Kitchen Removal = $352
- Kitchen Installation = $1045
- Kitchen Cupboards etc = $6232.60
- Andi Appliances (Oven, Cook top, Range hood & Sink) = $1250
- Dishlex Dishwasher = $849
Total = $11 351.10

We used "Kitcheners Kitchens" (www.kitcheners.com.au). They are very flexible and target investor renovations primarily. You can use them to do it all or do alot yourself. They can do the kitchen design & purchase the cupboards and put you in contact with their subcontracted tradies, or you can use your own tradies. Advantage if you were a tradie or have friends or family who are tradies. Either way the fact you can elect to co-ordinate the tradies yourself (they just give you their phone numbers) allows you to save money on the 'service' side of things. Same with all the appliances and fittings. You can source your own and see if their suppliers can beat the price, or just select from the different levels of appliances etc they offer which were pretty cheap as is. We puchased our own tiles and the tiler just turned up to put them in.

TOTAL RENOVATION COST: $25 805.77

When we moved out in April 06 we did so after receiving advice from our RE Agent that this time of the year (leading into winter and after Uni etc has gone back) sees a drop off in competition for rental properties in the area. We did so anyway giving precedence to personal considerations like the fact my wife is pregnant and we wanted to move early in the pregnancy rather than late and the fact that the sooner we got out the sooner we'd start saving money (cheapre than living in it).

As a result it took us 4-6 weeks to rent. It is now rented for $430 a week on a 12 month lease to 1 lady with the Defence Forces (on subsidised rent). Although the RE Agent Rent Appraisal was $465, and we thought it was worth $450 a week, given the bad timing $430 was acceptable. We'll review the rent at a good time demand wise after the 12 month lease is up. Either way, we got the target tennant we were after who in the early stages appears to be a good secure tennant.

So we acheived an increase in rent from $370 to $430 (About a 16.2% increase in rent by my calcs) for an outlay of $25 806 (About 5.4% of the purchase price).

I had a local RE Agent do an informal valuation after the reno was complete. He is a friend who new we weren't selling it and who I asked for a realistic estimate which he provided as "at least $550k". He's worked selling real estate in the eastern suburbs for over 10 years so I'd hope he's somewhere near the mark.

I'd be interested in your opinions on how good, bad or otherwise this overall result is?

We were also fortunate that according to Residex figures Kensingtion was one of the only Eastern Sydney suburbs to go up in value last year. A 10% increase being listed for Kensington (last year I think). Council upgrades of the commercial area / street scape etc at Kensington Junction (still occuring) may have something to do with that as it was previously one of the few suburbs that hadn't been fixed up.

I was going to attach come photos but apparently my photo files are bigger than the forum limit per photo. Most of my before photos had been accidently deleted anyway but I had enough to demonstrate the basic colour and flooring changes and show the unit in its renovated state. Doen't matter I guess.

What I learned from this was that I would only ever want to co-ordinate the reno, not do to much of the hands on work. Apart from the fact that I don't have the skills in most areas, I don't have the time. We both work full time jobs earning reasonable money and study on top of that. Also, with a baby about to arrive on top of that I can only see the time pressures increasing.

So the way I see it (and specific to our circumstances only) I could earn better money doing extra hours in my current job than the savings I'd make out of doing it myself. It would get done quicker, and hopefully better. In which case paying a professional for most stuff seems the way to go for us. I don't know if we'd even do the painting next time but would where possible still co-ordinate the reno. I found we saved a fair bit of money just be doing that ourselves instead of handing the whole project over to someone else.

I've heard people talk about the stress renovating (especially live in renovating) can put on relationships and while we had no major dramas I could see there being problems if it had been any more intense or had dragged out much longer. My wife was pregnant which might have made things slightly more trying when you're coming home from work, painting until late, catching a few hours sleep and starting over.

Thanks to everyone who contributed with advice to this and related threads. Let me know what you think.

MF35

i would turn the unit into a 3 bedroom if you can

Thanks MF35 for you detailed post and followup.
I'm in the early stage of doing something like this (but using Metropople) in Melb, so I can definately make use of your numbers at least for comparisions.

Great stuff !!