Do wooden floors add value?

[shanematt]

I have a ground floor 2 beder unit and was wondering if wooden floors add value in a valuer's eye's and whether it is more attractive to a tenant.Currently is has reasonable carpet that will need replacing in a year or two.
Was thinking of adding an A/C as well at some stage.
Has anyone done this before?

 

[Propertunity]

Yes, both actual wood floors or timber-look vinyl floors and A/C definitely are a value-add.

 

[RumpledElf]

And AC adds value too unless you're in some totally perfect climate. And it makes it much, much more rentable.

We got given a brand new aircon last week (although its only rated to -1) and finally got around to installing it when it condescended to stop raining for a day. Its warm in here now. Wooooooo! Probably wouldn't be able to sell the place without SOME kind of heater here.

 

[Gools]

I have a ground floor 2 beder unit and was wondering if wooden floors add value

Shane, just make sure your strata plan allows you to add wooden floors first before you get too carried away.

 

[namtrak]

Interesting question this.

The assumption is that of course timber floors had value, and I am no exception in believing that is the case. However I have never heard any actual quantification of the actual value a wooden floor adds.

As a member of the Australian Timber Flooring Association I have approached the executive to see if they can come up with a definitive number. They have taken it on board as a research project.

Much better for me if I can say to a client a new timber floor adds % to your home value as opposed to a generic 'yeh it increases your property value'

Cheers

 

[vbplease]

As a member of the Australian Timber Flooring Association I have approached the executive to see if they can come up with a definitive number. They have taken it on board as a research project.

Not sure you can put a definitve number to it, as the rental or resale value is dictated by people.. measuring what people like/dislike is pretty subjective.. the before and after conditions will be different in each case too.

I think the photos here speak for themselves. http://www.somersoft.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52791

 

[namtrak]

......Not sure you can put a definitve number to it, as the rental or resale value is dictated by people.. ......

Thats what I have always thought, however I am wondering wether with the vast amount of real estate sales data now available you can't start comparing apples with apples. A look at the comprehensive data available from a site such as allhomes makes me think that there is enough info out there to start to looking at the the value add of new kitchens, ensuites, timber floors etc objectively rather than subjectively.

I assume there are many cases of similarly designed/built houses being sold in relative proximity with the only differences being the renovations that have been undertaken.

 

[geoffw]

I put in floating floors for an IP a few yers ago. They looked excellent but were obviously not real wood.

Last week I started looking at floating floors and the quality is out of sight so much better than last time.

At that time I bought some quite good looking floor at $45 psm. I than had to buy underlay and edgings and installed it all myself. I did a fair job only.

Now what I can buy looks stunning. $69 psm full retail probably available cheaper from time to time or from other outlets. It looks much easier to work with, it certainly clips together much more easily than the other stuff.

I'm looking at it for ppor so I do want good quality. The room where I want to insall it does not have many complicated corners like those around doorways so I don't see it as being a more difficult job than the one I've already done.

With the underlay ($10 psm thick or $5 thin) it should not be a problem for sound in a block of units.

I have rellies who replaced carpet with floating floors throughout and reported a big cut in health problems with small kids.

 

[namtrak]

Yeh floating flaws have improved in quality, however I would only use them in IP's, never in my PPOR. As an aside I only install hardwood floors and pass on to others the work for floating floors and other prefinished products.

To make the maths of flooring relevant you need to take it over a longer period.

Lets look at flooring over say 20 years.

a) Hardwood flooring installed and finished $140 per sqm
Maintenance coats every 5 years ($10 per sqm) $40 per sqm.

Total cost over 20 years $180 per sqm.

b) Floating floors installed around $100 per sqm (less for DYI)
Replaced every 7 years - more or less

Total cost over 20 years $300 per sqm.

And if you keep the maintenance coats up then the life of the hardwood floor is almost indefinite.

Having said that though, I can hardly be considered to be objective

 

[shanematt]

Thats interesting information about the life of hard wood compared to floating.As I have a policy of never selling my IP's then it sounds like hard wood would be the correct choice.

Thanks

Yeh floating flaws have improved in quality, however I would only use them in IP's, never in my PPOR. As an aside I only install hardwood floors and pass on to others the work for floating floors and other prefinished products.

To make the maths of flooring relevant you need to take it over a longer period.

Lets look at flooring over say 20 years.

a) Hardwood flooring installed and finished $140 per sqm
Maintenance coats every 5 years ($10 per sqm) $40 per sqm.

Total cost over 20 years $180 per sqm.

b) Floating floors installed around $100 per sqm (less for DYI)
Replaced every 7 years - more or less

Total cost over 20 years $300 per sqm.

And if you keep the maintenance coats up then the life of the hardwood floor is almost indefinite.

Having said that though, I can hardly be considered to be objective

 

[shanematt]

Yep,will check.Hopefully being ground floor helps

Shane, just make sure your strata plan allows you to add wooden floors first before you get too carried away.

 

[namtrak]

Thats interesting information about the life of hard wood compared to floating.As I have a policy of never selling my IP's then it sounds like hard wood would be the correct choice.

Thanks

The point I was making was in relation to a PPOR. An IP? Im not so sure. Yes the hardwood floor itself would hold up much better than a floating floor, but I think you would be looking at more regular maintenance coats. Then again I guess the floating floors in an IP may also need to be replaced more often? Depends on the tenants I guess.

 

[geoffw]

b) Floating floors installed around $100 per sqm (less for DYI)
Replaced every 7 years - more or less

The floating floors we were looking at had a 15 year warranty.

 

[namtrak]

I do need to be careful because I am completely biased, however I am not sure that a warranty amounts to much when these are the sort of exclusions:

The Manufacturer’s Warranty does not cover the following:
• Indentations, scratches, damage caused by negligence or accident, water erosion, insects, animals, high-
heeled or spiked shoes, and high traffic areas
• Failure to follow the Manufacturer’s written floating floor installation instructions, including protecting the floor
from sub-floor moisture.
• Exposure to excessive heat, sunlight or improper humidity in the area.
• Improper maintenance, insufficient protection or misuse.
• Where sub-floor heating is used..
• Improper alterations to original manufactured product. Alterations or repairs to the Manufacturer’s original
product will void any and all Warranties.
• Changes in colour or appearance due to full or partial exposure to sunlight, weather, ageing or re-finishing.
• Failure due to structural changes in the sub floor, settling of the building or uneven sub floor that has not been
adequately levelled.

I guess though, that as a consumer, if you satisfy these limitations then this warranty is ideal.

 

[RightValue]

Yes, both actual wood floors or timber-look vinyl floors and A/C definitely are a value-add.

Prove it please.

Also does a $200 a sqm carpet really add that much more value than a $40 a sqm carpet???

IMHO others things add more value like the kitchen and bathroom.

A polished timber floor is just a floor covering .. for it to add a particular amount of value the potential purchaser must really want that over an alternative floor covering.

I doubt the valuer will add all that much to their valuation based on the floor covering.

In all the sales that I have analysed .. (tens of thousands), I can't see a definitive pattern that supports the assumption that polised timber floors definitely add value .. I know they costs a lot though!.

cheers

RightValue

 

[craigb]

Spend more get more i don't think so!
Spending more money on floors, and tiles does not pay off! the experience i have had with valuers is that they look and tick a box, the general finnishes marked beetween 1 and 10, and then compared against a set of recently up loaded pictures off the internet?
the valueers did'nt even note our 3 mtr ceilings???on this home , or the C-BUS electrical system on the last one? but then again most buyers would not notice the differance either.

 

[namtrak]

I haven't been referring to a value set by valuers, but an actual sale price. I think they are two completely different things. I think valuers focus on land size, surrounding properties, building size, building quality - and I suspect most else is peripheral. However. purchasers put much more emphasis on the fittings and fitout of a residence. IMHO

Cheers

 

[Perp]

Yeh floating flaws have improved in quality, however I would only use them in IP's, never in my PPOR. As an aside I only install hardwood floors and pass on to others the work for floating floors and other prefinished products.

Can you not get full hardwood floating floors? Why would these, simply laid on concrete rather than bearers and joists, be necessarily inferior to if they were performing a structural role?

 

[namtrak]

I think we are talking about a few different products.

1. Hardwood flooring laid over joists and bearers and finished in situ is my preference - 19mm thick. Laid with nails/staples/glue. Finished with a hardwax mmmmmm......

2. Hardwood flooring laid over a ply or direct stick to concrete and finished in situ - around 12mm or 14mm thick - called overlay. Laid with nails/staples/glue

3. Engineered flooring, is hardwood flooring which is then prefinished and laid. Laid with nails/staples/glue. This is what I think you referring to.

4. Floating floors are generally a laminate type setup, which is a thin veneer over a ply which is then laid over a rubber/synthetic underlay. No glue/nails etc. These floors are prefinished and in some cases have the actual grain of the timber printed on top. As GeoffW says, some of these are remarkably timber like.

My preference for the boards that are finished in situ is because the finish (polyurathane/wax etc) forms a complete seal over all the boards rather than having the grooves in the finish between each board which is the effect created by the prefinished boards.

I should re-iterate that I personally would not install a hardwood floor in an IP, unless I was looking at capital gains down the track and wanted to write off some expenses. Every hardwood floor I have done (aside from commercial work) has been for PPOR.

I think the floating floors have their place, just not in mine

 

[namtrak]

Can you not get full hardwood floating floors? Why would these, simply laid on concrete rather than bearers and joists, be necessarily inferior to if they were performing a structural role?

A floating floor has zero structural role, regardless of the timber. The only timber floor which is designated as a structural floor is hardwood flooring fixed directly to joists. And interestingly enough this is the only floor you now require a license to install.