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Hi James, in my version of the PIT, there are of course clauses that talk about discretionary distribution, but they are all subject to Clause 3.1(a) which states that all income goes to the unit holders while units are on issue. So the deed is only discretionary when units are not on issue...

Hi Mry, yes, it is often hard to break away from our fetters. They can indeed hold us back. Cheers, Shadow.

Exactly Julia... HDTs are not about tax avoidance, they are about holding your assets in a flexible trust structure with all the benefits that go along with that, while at the same time achieving the benefit of negative gearing that is rightfully allowed for all investors. I think this is what a...

I don't see any danger to my negative gearing deductions, because I would still claim these deductions had I purchased the property in my own name. So I have not claimed any more deductions than I would normally be entitled to. I certainly do see risks with using a poorly written deed, or...

OK Alex, but the ATO does need to prove that tax was avoided, which it would find very difficult to do when no tax was actually avoided, but lets leave it at that. Cheers, Shadow.

Hi Geoff, The vast majority of accountants on this forum (possibly all of them) use Chris Batten's MGS HDT deed. So I would expect them all to support each other in the use of this deed. If you check one of my earlier posts in this thread, I noted a statement that Chris made about the C&N...

Hi Alex, please read the document again and pay attention to what it really says. It refers to ways in which individuals can misuse HDTs, or use poorly written HDTs, in an effort to avoid tax, in which case they would quite rightly draw the attention of the ATO. No Alex, this is...

Hi Geoff... of course not... C&N are a competitor to Chris Batten. Chris would have had the HDT market nicely wrapped up until C&N released a competing deed. There is not much difference between the deeds. The main difference is that the C&N deed does not vest after 80 years, and they have...

Hi Alex, thanks, but I think others probably know what I meant. My point is that accountants who specialise in property have determined that well written HDTs used correctly are fine. I haven't seen any 'ASSOCIATIONS' saying that there is a problem with well written and correctly used HDT deeds...

Hi Mry... I think I have. This proof is very simple. There can be no issue with a HDT when it is used correctly, because no tax is avoided. I don't have an issue with anyones interpretation. I think we are all on the same page here. I agree with you and Julia when you say that a poorly written...

Hi GSJ... exactly, yes I agree a DT is better, if you don't want to negative gear. This really comes down to how the user wishes to use the trust... there is no issue with the trust itself, but if the user creates a very contrived and conservative estimate of the market value for redemption...

Hi Julia... here we go again... What issues? I've already explained there are no issues when a HDT is used correctly! It's not about having all the options covered as well as other methods. Other methods work for some of the options, but not all of the options. The HDT covers ALL of the...

Hi Julia... you are missing the point. Yes, a DT does let you achieve most of the same benefits... but not the negative gearing. My point is the HDT lets you do everything under one structure. Why is it more expensive? If you're talking about the few hundred extra dollars to do the tax...

Hi Mry, What is the NTAA's position on the Property Investor Trust and MGS HDT when used correctly? Yes, I suppose I am an 'anonymous internet poster', as are many on this forum. I am not trying to give financial or tax advice here. I am not trying to convince anybody to follow any...

One PBR refers to a correct use of a well written deed. The other does not. The deed does assign rights to units. Not sure I understand what you're saying here?

You could if you wanted to, but there would be no point, as it is designed for property. There are more appropriate deeds for other assets. No you can still use any accountant for your accounting, but it would make more sense to use C&N, since they are the ones who understand the deed best...

Hi Ben, Let's just say that this rule does not apply in all states of Australia. Cheers, Shadow.

Hi GSJ... the PIT is a HDT. The main advantage over other HDTs is the 'no 80 year vesting' clause, and the fact that I think C&N are very knowledgeable in regards to property, so I prefer to use them as my accountants. No the PIT definitely does not allow this at all. I think there has...

So am I! This is what I said... I would not want to redeem the units if my plan was to always have a negatively geared portfolio, never sell, and live off equity. You mean the one about the poorly written deed that was used incorrectly? I already listed them out above... asset...

Why? There are enough PBRs out there that say HDTs are fine if used correctly. What makes you think the deed says this? The deed does not say this. Well, I guess because the deed does not say what you seem to think it says... that's why! Cheers, Shadow.