Bathroom Project Management Help

[Noodle]

Hi All,

Just wondering if anyone on here has any experience project managing their own bathroom renovations and if so do you have any tips for a complete novice AKA Me

Basically I've had a number of quotes from all-in-one type bathroom renovation companies but all seem fairly ridiculous and around $4-5K more than if I was to organise the individual trades myself.

The good news is I have a fair amount of time off work, so can be around to monitor everything, the bad news is I'm from the calculator kid generation who is useless at anything hands on and hates dealing with tradies but feel this is a challenge I need to take on.

So my main question I guess is what order should the trades go? Here's my very vague and uneducated guess below. I have also put the estimated costs of each trade in brackets after each, so if anything looks particularly unusual if someone could please point out my idiocy I'd be very grateful.

1.) Organise skip bin for waste ($300)

2.) Bathroom strip out of all existing floor wall tiles, shower, vanity, toilet etc ($1800)

3.) Plumber - Replace old pipework with new ($2000)

4.) Electrician - Move power points to new locations ($TBC)

5.) Renderer - Make surfaces smooth and ready for tiling. ($650)

6.) Waterproofer - Initial waterproofing prior to new bath tub being put in. ($600)

7.) Plumber again - To plumb in new bath tub. (Cost as above)

8.) Waterproofer again - Full water proofing on floor and walls. (Cost as above)

9.) Tiler - Tile floor, walls and build wall around bathtub. ($2700)

10.) Plumber again to install new vanity, toilet, shower, taps etc (Cost as above)

11.) Fitted Shower Screen Installed ($750)


Total Trades Cost = $8800 (not including prime costs items like bath, vanity, toilet etc)

Total Time Frame = Approx 3 weeks.

OK so I'm sure I must have missed something out there or put things in the wrong order but really keen to learn and the more I read upon now hopefully the less mistakes I will make along the way.

Thanks so much again everybody.

Noodle

 

[Scott No Mates]

Draw yourself a bar chart of all of the trades including the sequence of work (project plan), allow for lost time as tradies don't show up occasionally.

Cement render will need time to cure - you've lost a week

You've forgotten the painter (ceiling at a minimum but probably door/jamb & walls if not fully tiled)

Are you pulling out the ceiling as well?

 

[Paul j F]

If you are not hands on and not going to do some work yourself then I would strongly advise to get an all in one bathroom reno company. You'll pay a premium for plumbers to come back and install toilet, taps etc. . Watch them, research and learn for the next one....that said I know why it's like to have your mind set on managing it yourself. So here goes...

What sort of walls do you have? You'll need to resheet if it's plasterboard/sheeting.

Are you reconfiguring the layout? You may not want or be able to if you're on a slab or have brick walls. Far cheaper to keep plumbing/waste where it is or close to.

You will need to consider asbestos if it's pre 1980's. If there's asbestos, you cant pull tiles off without disturbing the asbestos so tiles go with it. The skip may not be worth it after asbestos is gone. Even a hands off person can hire a ute and pull out what is left in a day and take to the tip....but your $1800 budget for the strip sounds about right including asbestos.

During the strip you will need to either install caps for all plumbing or put taps etc back on or you arrange plumber the day you strip. If he doesn't show or you are delayed with strip you'll be without water until the existing plumbing is stopped in some way ....see what I mean about having to do some yourself.

Plumber shouldn't really need to come back twice....you'll pay a premium to get him back for a final fit out. Get him to install taps, shower head, even the toilet can be set in place (allowing for tile height) etc once pipes are in correct place and then you take them off prior to sheeting. Then put them all back on after tiling. Traditional bath against wall or in corner is recessed into stud framing before sheeting so plumber can do all that in one visit. Traditional bath has to have a frame, timber or brick? Stand alone doesn't but never done one.

There is so much to consider and only so much can answered on a forum.

 

[Dave_R]

This is an interesting topic, as I'm about to do the same thing with my (soon to be) new IP, and I'm tossing up whether or not to get a full bathroom reno company or individual trades. However I'm getting an asbestos removal company to come in, and they'll strip the walls of the bathroom out for me, since the B&P identified asbestos walls in there.

In your own situation; do you really need to get some of your trades in more than once? Certainly you shouldn't need to get the waterproofer in twice to work around the plumber putting in the bathtub. Don't forget, these trades will charge you a callout fee each time they come out - it adds up. Does all the pipework need to be relocated/replaced? If you are worried about cost (and especially if it is an IP), then you'd be able to save money by retaining the same layout and keeping the toilet, taps etc. in the same locations.

Getting back to my first paragraph, the whole single company vs individual trades is an interesting one and something I'm keen on learning the pros and cons. I would have thought a bathroom reno company would have been about the same price, not a whopping 4-5k over those figures you've printed - if that's the case, then assuming the standard of work is about the same for each, the case for individual trades would be pretty clear-cut on price alone.

 

[mumbai]

Hey Dave,
I am in process of doing exactly same thing with my soon to be IP. Its a fibro house, so asbestos is bound to be. I check with the B&P report guys that I usually go with whether they can identify asbestos and they said they dont do it.
Can I trouble you to provide me the details of your B&P company, so that I can call and check(if they have presence in Sydney too).

 

[wylie]

We are in the process of organising a new bathroom in our PPOR. For $13,600 we have been quoted the whole job, including new plasterboard walls and ceiling. This price includes a shower mixer tap and fittings, shower rail, fittings, hose, spray head and soap dish, cement shower base ready to be tiled, bath mixer and spout, waterproofing, tiling, tiles to the value of $25sqm, seal tiles, vanity unit and waste, mirror cabinet, vanity mixer tap, 3 in 1 heater, fan, light, toilet, we supply bath, we supply glass shower screen. Quote includes fixing of towel rail, soap dish etc but we supply them.

We would not use the fixtures and fittings they have allowed for and want to go a bit more upmarket in these items, so we would pay the extra to get exactly what we want.

I cannot see that we need a new ceiling but we would need new bathroom grade walls once we rip off the tiles.

Instead of paying someone to do all this, we will gut the room ourselves, get our plumber to rough in, get a tiler who does the waterproofing first, buy our own bath, loo, mixers, shower head etc. Get it tiled and finish it off ourselves (attaching towel rails, cavity cabinet and mirror etc.

We bought a brand new but unused $6K stone bath for $1K, had a $400 toilet and glass screen thrown into the deal (gave the toilet to our son and will keep the screen for an IP bathroom down the track).

I've chosen a $700 wall hung in-wall cistern loo for ease of cleaning and to make the room look bigger. These wall hung in-wall loos can get much more expensive but we are happy with the $700 one. We may pay extra to get a partly or fully frosted glass shower cubicle to make cleaning easier and give privacy.

Even with the more expensive fittings than allowed in the quote, I believe we can do this room for $10K.

Tiles are $1,500
Another tiler has quoted just for the bathroom about $4K (but that is very loose as we really had no firm idea of how high we will tile). We have chosen rectified tiles which will cost more as there is very little margin for error, so it appears these are more expensive to have laid.

We were told to make sure our tiler also did the waterproofing so that should anything leak, the tiler cannot blame the waterproofer and vice versa.

 

[Dave_R]

Hey Dave,
I am in process of doing exactly same thing with my soon to be IP. Its a fibro house, so asbestos is bound to be. I check with the B&P report guys that I usually go with whether they can identify asbestos and they said they dont do it.
Can I trouble you to provide me the details of your B&P company, so that I can call and check(if they have presence in Sydney too).

You're right, B&Ps won't actually identify with any certainty whether asbestos exists - that's a job for asbestos specialists, or yourself if you want to send some of it away to get tested in a lab - but the guy I used was reasonably sure that the kitchen used Tilux, an asbestos-based wall sheeting, and that the other wet areas probably would as well.
IMO any building report should at least say that an area "may" contain asbestos, but if you're unsure, definitely get a separate asbestos inspection done.

P.S. The guy I used services the Hunter region only

 

[handyandy]

We bought a brand new but unused $6K stone bath for $1K,

Hi Wylie

How are you going to move this stone bath. It's got to weigh a bomb.

Cheers

 

[Noodle]

Thanks for all the tips and things to think about its been very useful. Its good to know there are quite a few others in the same boat. Whilst part of me would like to just take the easy route out and pay the extra for an all-in-one company the $4-5K mark up (based on 4 separate quotes) compared to combined individual trades quotes is just too much to justify, and if I have aspirations to do my own developments one day this could also be a valuable learning experience.

The layout of the bathroom is predominantly the same as current and I don't believe there are any asbestos concerns although I will double check. The walls are solid though as opposed to plasterboard and its an art deco flat so I'm doubting all of the numerous trades people who have been through and quoted will have missed that.

Anyway I plan to have this all started in the next couple of weeks so will keep you up dated on how it goes.

 

[Jake D]

Hi Wylie

How are you going to move this stone bath. It's got to weigh a bomb.

Cheers

4-6 big blokes and a p-handle trolley.

 

[wylie]

It is pretty heavy . We will be beefing up the joists. Luckily the area under this bathroom is a garage so everything can be seen and worked on easily.

 

[handyandy]

1.) Organise skip bin for waste ($300)

2.) Bathroom strip out of all existing floor wall tiles, shower, vanity, toilet etc ($1800)

3.) Plumber - Replace old pipework with new ($2000)

4.) Electrician - Move power points to new locations ($TBC)

5.) Renderer - Make surfaces smooth and ready for tiling. ($650)

6.) Waterproofer - Initial waterproofing prior to new bath tub being put in. ($600)

7.) Plumber again - To plumb in new bath tub. (Cost as above)

8.) Waterproofer again - Full water proofing on floor and walls. (Cost as above)

9.) Tiler - Tile floor, walls and build wall around bathtub. ($2700)

10.) Plumber again to install new vanity, toilet, shower, taps etc (Cost as above)

11.) Fitted Shower Screen Installed ($750)




Noodle

If you are installing a standard bath ie tiles overlap part of the bath edge, then you actually install the bath before you render.

The strip out step should also include any new channels, or for that matter clearing out of old channels, for the new plumbing and electrical's. If you can organise this yourself rather than having the electrician and plumber both jack hammering channels it will save you money.

Make sure that all your waste holes are protected from any debry falling in them as this will cause you no end of strive.

Cheers

 

[Shahin_Afarin]

Make sure point 6 is done properly - it is arguably one of the most important points. Also how big is the bathroom that you are being charged $2700 for tiling?

 

[Noodle]

Bathroom is actually not large at all, is $2700 a lot for tiling? Most quotes we had were coming in at that $2-2.5K range and then I found out it was more to have the bath Hebel bricked in and tiled. I'm using the same company for the strip out and tiling for ease of accountability in case any issues arise. They weren't the cheapest but seemed most knowledgable when quoting and also have a good reputation. I'm also using a specialist waterproofing company with a good reputation and they have to provide a 10 year warranty certificate. The waterproofing is one of the main reasons we are renovating, so very much agree this is incredibly important.

I know I could do it cheaper, but just trying to find that middle ground of quality but reliable tradies.

 

[Shahin_Afarin]

Bathroom is actually not large at all, is $2700 a lot for tiling? Most quotes we had were coming in at that $2-2.5K range and then I found out it was more to have the bath Hebel bricked in and tiled. I'm using the same company for the strip out and tiling for ease of accountability in case any issues arise. They weren't the cheapest but seemed most knowledgable when quoting and also have a good reputation. I'm also using a specialist waterproofing company with a good reputation and they have to provide a 10 year warranty certificate. The waterproofing is one of the main reasons we are renovating, so very much agree this is incredibly important.

I know I could do it cheaper, but just trying to find that middle ground of quality but reliable tradies.

You are doing the right thing - there are some things you can afford to go cheap on and some things you cannot. Waterproofing is one you certainly cannot.

 

[maadha]

Save $1800 by getting a couple of mates over on a weekend to strip the bathroom. Pay em with a bbq and a few beers and then use that saving to get a bathroom reno place in to do the rest.

Just make sure you cut the power and turn of the water as a pre caution when woorking around electrical\water points.

 

[JungleeJalebi]

bathroom reno

Hi Noodle
Im in the same boat re bathroom reno. Been quoted 9K by one builder and 14 K by another for gutting and renovating my parents bathroom. This doesnt include PC items eg vanity, tiles etc and its an average sized bathroom. I like the idea of using a specialist waterproofing company for the waterproofing. Any advice/recomendations on tilers/waterproofing is welcome. What type of tiles have you used ? ceramic or porcelain? Ive sent you a private message as well. Hope to hear soon


cheers
JJ