Cashless Welfare Card

[VYBerlinaV8]

There are currently approx 20,000 people using the Basicscard scheme. This program is costing the government $350 million to run - this works out to be $17,500 per person on the program. What budget emergency?

It's probably cheaper than giving them all an effective case worker.

 

[Ed Barton]

Majority of the laws are devised and implemented based on a minority. Way of the world.

Heard a lady on radio complaining that her children will go hungry because their school canteen still is cash based. Obviously no intention on making packed lunches for her family.

The card will work for some and for those determined it will not.

The article I read said there would still be some cash payment.

 

[j_p]

The article I read said there would still be some cash payment.

That was my understanding too. The system aims to ensure that certain essentials are paid and still leaves some discretionary spending/cash.

Personally, I am quite proud that in Australia we have a welfare system that helps people in need. What I don't like is seeing people that feel entitled and have no appreciation of what they get and no intention to give anything back or get off welfare when they are capable. I know any system can and will be abused but the level of abuse I have seen is incredible.

 

[Corey Batt]

There are currently approx 20,000 people using the Basicscard scheme. This program is costing the government $350 million to run - this works out to be $17,500 per person on the program. What budget emergency?

The card is currently in a trial phase - it's passed with flying colours obviously if they want to roll out the program.

With full roll out the number of users would multiply many times over reducing per user cost as the infrastructure burden would be aggregated.

And if this curves alcohol/drug usage and child neglect, the savings multiples from the justice + health system far outweighs the cost per user.

 

[Arnoldus]

The card is currently in a trial phase - it's passed with flying colours obviously if they want to roll out the program.

With full roll out the number of users would multiply many times over reducing per user cost as the infrastructure burden would be aggregated.

And if this curves alcohol/drug usage and child neglect, the savings multiples from the justice + health system far outweighs the cost per user.

There's been quite a few teething problems, not sure if they've worked through them properly yet. One of the biggest problems they had rolling it out is that the system was/is to be policed by cashiers at shops, and that there was no way for Government to track what items were purchased in a transaction. I remember seeing this article from last year...

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-08-31/welfare-recipients-skirting-around-income-management-rules/5708012

On the plus side, my understanding is the cards will be declined at pubs/bottle-shops.

My own view is that it would probably be effective for folks who want to use it as a budgeting tool, rather than a way to force people to buy certain products with their government entitlements.

 

[jkat]

I couldn't get past the first paragraph in the article...

"Designed to combat rising levels of domestic violence against women and children, including in remote communities where up to one in 10 women are being bashed..."

How is this going to change?? Domestic Violence has nothing to do with drugs/alcohol or gambling and EVERYTHING to do with power, control and attitudes towards women. A 'cashless' welfare system will probably make the situation of DV worse because it will give more excuses for the perpetrator to abuse...

Unfortunately, it is always the minority that get reported about because nobody wants to hear about the people genuinely struggling that receive welfare support. This frustrates me so much.

*rant over*

 

[kathryn d]

For the families who already are responsible, I don't think it make much difference to them.

It may help some borderline families.

There are ways for the not so responsible people to get around this.
They buy whatever they want, and the compliant shop keeper, rings it up under an acceptable product.

Another way,they sell this card to others for a cash discount.

I'm sure there are many other schemes.

 

[property_girl]

I couldn't get past the first paragraph in the article...

"Designed to combat rising levels of domestic violence against women and children, including in remote communities where up to one in 10 women are being bashed..."

How is this going to change?? Domestic Violence has nothing to do with drugs/alcohol or gambling and EVERYTHING to do with power, control and attitudes towards women. A 'cashless' welfare system will probably make the situation of DV worse because it will give more excuses for the perpetrator to abuse...

JKat, some rural and remote Aboriginal communities have a huge problem with the men drinking alcohol. For whatever reason, most of the women abstain. As a result, there is a high level of domestic abuse and violence. In some instances the women have applied, for and been granted, alcohol restrictions. I personally think this might help the Aboriginal women trying to stop their men getting drunk and beating and killing their women and children.

 

[ellejay]

JKat, some rural and remote Aboriginal communities have a huge problem with the men drinking alcohol. For whatever reason, most of the women abstain. As a result, there is a high level of domestic abuse and violence. In some instances the women have applied, for and been granted, alcohol restrictions. I personally think this might help the Aboriginal women trying to stop their men getting drunk and beating and killing their women and children.

Jkat I don't think you're actually seeing what's happening on the ground. It's probably impossible to imagine unless you're in amongst it.

 

[property_girl]

Jkat I don't think you're actually seeing what's happening on the ground. It's probably impossible to imagine unless you're in amongst it.

Ellejay, I have heard about some really horrible things happening in those communities--things I can't repeat here. If it stops one man from doing something like this, it's worth it.

 

[D.T.]

Ellejay, I have heard about some really horrible things happening in those communities--things I can't repeat here. If it stops one person from doing something like this, it's worth it.

Fixed that for you

 

[property_girl]

Fixed that for you

To apply political correctness in this context is wrong. The fact is that most of the alcohol-related violence in rural and regional communities is perpetrated by men. They also hurt their children in ways that would shock most. Eighty per cent of the women abstain from alcohol, whereas less then 10 per cent of men abstain. Of the remaining 20 per cent of women, most are moderate drinkers. It is the older men and the women with children in some of these communities who have asked that alcohol be banned. In one community the Aboriginal women set up roadblocks so that their husbands and sons could not access alcohol. Many of the women are saying, 'Enough'.

 

[hugh72]

Yes I agree that it is mostly men in remote communities that are committing these crimes but many women are also affected by alcoholism. On many occasions in Cairns I have had to move my children away from watching several women blind drunk trying to beat the ... out of each other. I have seen similar things throughout regional and remote Qld and the NT it just seems that the problem is off most people's radars in capital cities IMO

 

[Tim86]

I couldn't get past the first paragraph in the article...

"Designed to combat rising levels of domestic violence against women and children, including in remote communities where up to one in 10 women are being bashed..."

How is this going to change?? Domestic Violence has nothing to do with drugs/alcohol or gambling and EVERYTHING to do with power, control and attitudes towards women. A 'cashless' welfare system will probably make the situation of DV worse because it will give more excuses for the perpetrator to abuse...

Unfortunately, it is always the minority that get reported about because nobody wants to hear about the people genuinely struggling that receive welfare support. This frustrates me so much.

*rant over*

Alcohol and drugs have a massive impact on dv... What research have you read that shows that alcohol and drug use of abusers does not increase their violent behaviour?

 

[ellejay]

Yes I agree that it is mostly men in remote communities that are committing these crimes but many women are also affected by alcoholism. On many occasions in Cairns I have had to move my children away from watching several women blind drunk trying to beat the ... out of each other. I have seen similar things throughout regional and remote Qld and the NT it just seems that the problem is off most people's radars in capital cities IMO

Yep. (10 characters)

 

[Tim86]

From creativespirits.info

Selected statistics

10
Times an Aboriginal youth is more likely to be a victim of proven abuse or neglect than their white peer [33].
4
Times an Aboriginal child under 5 years is more likely to die as a result of assaults than their white peer [37].
1.8
Times an Indigenous baby is more likely to be neglected or abused [6].
40%
Percentage Indigenous children make up of all hospital admissions in the age group 0 to 4 who are admitted for assault [6].
1,500
Number of people admitted to Alice Springs hospital between 1998 and 2005 with stab wounds. In 2007 Alice Springs was said to have the highest number of stabbings in the world [14]. Most stab wounds were in the thigh due to cultural practices.
$13.6bil
Estimated cost of all domestic violence against women and their children to the Australian economy in 2008-9 [19].
53%
Percentage of criminal cases where the offender was known to the victim. Percentage of these cases where the offender was the spouse: 69% [23].
4.8%
Percentage of Aboriginal children aged to 17 who were under care and protection orders in 2010. Same figure for non-Aboriginal children: 0.5% [34].
5%
Percentage of women experiencing violence from a current partner and reporting the last incident to police [4].
45
Times an Aboriginal women living in rural and remote areas is more likely to experience domestic violence than their white peers [3].
35
Times Aboriginal women are more likely to be hospitalised due to family violence [35]. Other sources report a figure of 23 times [36].
2.6
Average number of women per day seeking treatment for domestic violence related injuries in Alice Springs (between 2000 and 2006) [5].
93%
Percentage of surveyed Aboriginal respondents who believe domestic violence is a crime. 98% of non-Indigenous respondents believed so [18].
20%
Percentage by which Aboriginal Australians are more likely to commit offences of violence than their non-Indigenous counterparts [22].
80%
Percentage of jaw fractures due to alcohol in the Northern Territory. Aboriginal people in the NT have the second highest rate in the world. [25].

 

[Tim86]

By the way with everyone apparently so concerned about domestic violence... Do people realise the government is cutting funding and many many dv shelters are closing around the country. Mental health funding has been pulled too so lots of mental health services are closing up.

Just thought I'd point that out.

 

[hugh72]

From creativespirits.info

Selected statistics

10
Times an Aboriginal youth is more likely to be a victim of proven abuse or neglect than their white peer [33].
4
Times an Aboriginal child under 5 years is more likely to die as a result of assaults than their white peer [37].
1.8
Times an Indigenous baby is more likely to be neglected or abused [6].
40%
Percentage Indigenous children make up of all hospital admissions in the age group 0 to 4 who are admitted for assault [6].
1,500
Number of people admitted to Alice Springs hospital between 1998 and 2005 with stab wounds. In 2007 Alice Springs was said to have the highest number of stabbings in the world [14]. Most stab wounds were in the thigh due to cultural practices.
$13.6bil
Estimated cost of all domestic violence against women and their children to the Australian economy in 2008-9 [19].
53%
Percentage of criminal cases where the offender was known to the victim. Percentage of these cases where the offender was the spouse: 69% [23].
4.8%
Percentage of Aboriginal children aged to 17 who were under care and protection orders in 2010. Same figure for non-Aboriginal children: 0.5% [34].
5%
Percentage of women experiencing violence from a current partner and reporting the last incident to police [4].
45
Times an Aboriginal women living in rural and remote areas is more likely to experience domestic violence than their white peers [3].
35
Times Aboriginal women are more likely to be hospitalised due to family violence [35]. Other sources report a figure of 23 times [36].
2.6
Average number of women per day seeking treatment for domestic violence related injuries in Alice Springs (between 2000 and 2006) [5].
93%
Percentage of surveyed Aboriginal respondents who believe domestic violence is a crime. 98% of non-Indigenous respondents believed so [18].
20%
Percentage by which Aboriginal Australians are more likely to commit offences of violence than their non-Indigenous counterparts [22].
80%
Percentage of jaw fractures due to alcohol in the Northern Territory. Aboriginal people in the NT have the second highest rate in the world. [25].

Nice summary Tim, shows clearly that what both sides of government have attempted over the years hasn't been effective IMO

 

[property_girl]

By the way with everyone apparently so concerned about domestic violence... Do people realise the government is cutting funding and many many dv shelters are closing around the country. Mental health funding has been pulled too so lots of mental health services are closing up.

Just thought I'd point that out.

I know. It's such a shame. Most dv shelters, especially those in rural and remote areas, are filled to the brim.

 

[VYBerlinaV8]

Is there even a solution?

FWIW, I'm a big supporter of women's refuges.