Converting PPOR to Trust psot divorce question

M

MarkR

Hi Guys,
I've done a search & read most of Terrys trust thread, but I can't seem to find the answer to the question of converting PPOR to trust post divorce?

Unfortunately it looks like my wife & I will be parting ways in the near future. One scenario is that I pay her for her portion of our PPOR once the value of this has been legally agreed. I may then stay there , or turn it into an IP.

My concern is that with the 'new' PPOR in my name it can become ?up for grabs? if in the future I enter into another long term relationship.

So, my question is, how hard/expensive is it to convert a PPOR into a Trust at the time when the title changes from joint names to my name?

My main goal is asset protection in case history repeats with any future relationship.

Thanks
Mark
 
MarkR said:
My main goal is asset protection in case history repeats with any future relationship.
Click to expand...

Please tell me you've got some legal advice on how property division works in family law.

Because it doesn't sound like you have if you think moving your property to a trust protects it from the family court.
 
MarkR said:
Hi Guys,
I've done a search & read most of Terrys trust thread, but I can't seem to find the answer to the question of converting PPOR to trust post divorce?

Unfortunately it looks like my wife & I will be parting ways in the near future. One scenario is that I pay her for her portion of our PPOR once the value of this has been legally agreed. I may then stay there , or turn it into an IP.

My concern is that with the 'new' PPOR in my name it can become ?up for grabs? if in the future I enter into another long term relationship.

So, my question is, how hard/expensive is it to convert a PPOR into a Trust at the time when the title changes from joint names to my name?

My main goal is asset protection in case history repeats with any future relationship.

Thanks
Mark
Click to expand...

Any property can be held under a new trust. It is dutiable which is why few do it. Legal advice a must !!!
Just putting it on trust isn't a certain form of asset protection.
 
Generally trust held assets can be 'attacked' by the family court. However there is one recent case where a spouse failed in their attack of the family trust because the trust was controlled by the other spouse's mother.

Complex law and you will need to seek advice from a family lawyer.
 
Thanks guys, I'm aware of my responsibilities regarding my current situation but don't have enough information regarding future scenarios, hence my question.

The current advice I've obtained is focused on the usual divorce issues & is a bit light on future proofing any investments.

The trick now is to find the right legal advice for future planning.

Any recommendations for a good source for this in Melb?

Property girl - If there's no kids in the relationship that might be the case, in which case I can move the PPOR into my name as part of settlement & not worry.

Thatbum - Yes, I've obtained legal advice based on current situation, I'm now looking for advice on how to protect myself in 5-10yrs time

Cheers
Mark
 
What are you trying to protect against?
If another relationship goes bust (hopefully it won't), you'll have to split assets with them regardless of whether its your name or trust's.
 
MarkR said:
Thanks guys, I'm aware of my responsibilities regarding my current situation but don't have enough information regarding future scenarios, hence my question.

The current advice I've obtained is focused on the usual divorce issues & is a bit light on future proofing any investments.

The trick now is to find the right legal advice for future planning.

Thatbum - Yes, I've obtained legal advice based on current situation, I'm now looking for advice on how to protect myself in 5-10yrs time

Cheers
Mark
Click to expand...

Your best courses of action to "protect" your assets from the family court are:

1. Don't get married or enter into a de facto relationship for more than 2 years.

2. Burn or dump all your assets and quit your job. Permanently disable your earning capacity as well.

3. Marry or enter into a relationship with someone with more assets and/or financial resources than you.

4. Don't carry on a relationship in way where you encourage your partner to handicap his or her earning capacity for the sake of the relationship.

5. Understand the factors that the family court look at when determining a fair and equitable division of assets, so you understand what your liability is.

...in that order.

Seriously, there's not really much that can be done for most people to "protect" their assets. The laws are there so that people can't just elect to have their cake and eat it too. See point 4 especially.
 
techie said:
How strong are pre-nups?
Click to expand...

It varies. However, they don't really work as most people think they do.

Also, the requirements for them mean that they aren't really practical for most "normal" relationships and asset pools. eg. Each party needs their own independent legal advice, requires expensive specialised drafting, regular updating, etc

I could go on.
 
property_girl said:
Isn't there legislation that states a spouse cannot lay claim to any asset to which he or she has not contributed?
Click to expand...

Ha! In Queensland, a spouse can lay claim to an expected inheritance in splitting assets in a divorce. I read of a case about 5 years ago where a wife made a successful claim against her husband's future inheritance. From memory it was several hundred thousand dollars. The parents were still alive.

http://www.bnlaw.com.au/page/Events...spective_Inheritance_in_Property_Settlements/
 
Mr. Fabulous said:
Ha! In Queensland, a spouse can lay claim to an expected inheritance in splitting assets in a divorce. I read of a case about 5 years ago where a wife made a successful claim against her husband's future inheritance. From memory it was several hundred thousand dollars. The parents were still alive.

http://www.bnlaw.com.au/page/Events...spective_Inheritance_in_Property_Settlements/
Click to expand...

Of course, the other side of the story you won't hear is how the husband squandered the relationship assets post separation; how the wife started the relationship with substantial assets and the husband nothing; or how the husband now has significant earning potential post marriage while the wife has been lumped with a bunch of kids for the next 15 years.

Or in short, why the family court's extensive powers that were invoked to make that particular aspect of the property division actually fair.

But that doesn't make for as good family law bashing propaganda.
 
Yes, you never hear about the poor wife that got screwed by her ex-husband... if you live in a cave with your head buried in the sand.

People that live in modern society hear about it constantly. But I guess for some people, even then it's not enough.

What's interesting is that, even to this day, the general picture of divorce that people get is the husband running off with his hot young secretary, leaving the poor wife to struggle. When in actual fact, women initiate the overwhelming majority of divorces.
 
Last edited:
Mr Fabulous -- just because women may initiate more divorces doesn't mean that it isn't the husband having an affair, or that their earning capacity has been hindered by the relationship (by having kids, taking time to support the husband etc), or it could be something completely different altogether!

It just means they are the ones who have decided the relationship isn't working for them. At the end of the day it shouldn't matter who initiates the divorce but ensuring a FAIR split of assets.

If the situation was reversed and men had to take time off to birth/raise children and their careers suffered because of it, it would be fair that they still get assets from the relationship because they have contributed to the relationship in other ways.
 
thatbum said:
Your best courses of action to "protect" your assets from the family court are:

1. Don't get married or enter into a de facto relationship for more than 2 years.

2. Burn or dump all your assets and quit your job. Permanently disable your earning capacity as well.

3. Marry or enter into a relationship with someone with more assets and/or financial resources than you.

4. Don't carry on a relationship in way where you encourage your partner to handicap his or her earning capacity for the sake of the relationship.

5. Understand the factors that the family court look at when determining a fair and equitable division of assets, so you understand what your liability is.

...in that order.

Seriously, there's not really much that can be done for most people to "protect" their assets. The laws are there so that people can't just elect to have their cake and eat it too. See point 4 especially.
Click to expand...

I agree completely. There is not really much you can do other than the above.

Just accept that entering a relationship could result in a break up at some stage and then that could lead to a property settlement and you could 'lose' part of your assets.

Same principles apply to male or female, same sex or opposite sex partners.
 
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