Cost of vacate clean

Discussion in 'Property Management' started by paguatao, 19th Sep, 2013.

  1. paguatao

    paguatao Member

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    So the PM organised a vacate clean. They set a limit of $300 with a list of things to do (based on the final inspection).

    We happened to be there painting when the 2 guys arrived. They worked for about 3+ hours. One of the things on the list was: - wipe the top of power points (dusty). And boy did they take a good time to spray and wipe each power point! I don't think the powerpoints in my own house ever gets wiped.

    The PCR which I have received doesn't state anything about powerpoints being clean or dusty, so what's the point?

    They did a good job on using their industrial machines to clean the laundry sink and the floor, but .... just with my own eyes, the place wasn't too bad. It just needed a regular wipedown everywhere, a good scrub in the bathroom and the floor tiles to be mopped.

    It's so hard to know what is excessive and what's not. If that was the only thing to come out of the bond that would be ok but there was a bunch of other stuff which used up all the bond and over, so now I foresee a few months of pain trying to get the tenants to pay up what they owe.
     
  2. thatbum

    thatbum law talking guy

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    Could be a little awkward if the tenant decides to challenge the cleaning costs. The standard is a "reasonable state of cleanliness" at law, so you seem to be saying it wasn't far off that already - or at least not $300 off that mark at least.

    I have noticed around Perth some "unusually friendly" relationships between PMs and cleaning companies, but who knows.
     
  3. Colin Rice

    Colin Rice Perth Mortgage Broker

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    I would ask the PM if they get a "kickback" from the cleaners. Might not get a straight answer but look for the pupil dilation ;)
     
  4. INVSTOR

    INVSTOR O+

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    What happened with me is that the PM's owned the cleanIng company so they took the payment for it from rent and I was left trying to fight for payment out of bond. The next lot of tenants said on incoming reports everything was dirty, so when they left, they left it disgustingly dirty. I'm not sure what the cleaning bills in the hundreds were for, or if anyone came to the property. I ended up paying for cleanIng plus got handed back a dirty property a year later when next tenants left. I got charged $500 for cleaning another property at vacate. It was three bed, one bath and just been painted. I couldn't justify the bill for that one! When I queried it they said it was really difficult to work around the painter. Funny that the cleaner came in two days after painter finished! So corrupt!
     
  5. fisherman

    fisherman Member

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    It is almost de rigueur for incoming tenants to discover on taking up occupancy that things need a clean, regardless of the work done prior.

    I guess tenants try to cover themselves on the Condition Report. However the PMs call the cleaners rather than visit, inspect and discuss. It is really not worth the aggro the PMs say, and later at the end of tenancy if there is any dispute, the Tribunal will want evidence that a 'certified' clean was done. So we are often up for an entry clean of an already clean property and the minimum going rate is always $300.

    The overheads are continually increasing and yes, somehow or other those increases must have some bearing on rental prices.
     
  6. Zorrohd

    Zorrohd Member

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    Cleaning! Don't get me started! (Well, going to anyway)

    My partner Rod and I moved to Townsville a few years ago and rented a property. Nice 2 bed 2 storey townhouse. It was up for rent as the owner was very sick and had moved into hospital for a long term stay. The property was not very clean when we moved in, and I took a heap of photos and emailed them to the RE agent to include on the condition report. However given the owners situation, we didn't make too much of a fuss, as we felt sorry for the owners position, and appreciated that if she were that sick, cleaning was not her priority.

    Anyway, when we left, I scrubbed it from top to bottom. Having done builders cleans before, I considered myself quite a competent cleaner. But nooooo. Apparently there was dirt between the oven and the kitchen cabinetry. Which would have required disconnecting the oven to move and clean. And we'd left pegs on the clothes line. And scent sticks on the kitchen window sill. Both of which had been there when we moved in, clearly belonging to the owner. Anyway, the PM, rather than just chucking them out, took $300 from our bond to pay a cleaner to come in and remove. As were already back in Victoria, our hands were pretty much tied. I contacted the PM And raised the issue of the email I had sent, however that PM had moved on, and had not included my photos in the file. And unfortunately my computer that I'd sent the email from had died, so I no longer had the email either. Lesson learnt.

    Then when we moved back into our PPOR in Vic, we had an opposite experience. Our home had been tenanted for 2 years to a couple with one 3 year old child. However in the two years, Mrs Tenant had had twins, and they'd acquired a dog. The dog had chewed the timber architraves and some of the exterior weather boards, and dug up most of the garden. Discipline appeared to have gone out the window with the older child, as there were pen marks all over the walls. We turned up with our furniture to move in, but the place had not been cleaned. There was dirt and inexplicable marks all over the carpet, so we rang our PM, and they got a cleaner in, and came round to inspect the damage. Meanwhile we stood around for a couple of hours waiting for thee cleaner to finish. Next day, I asked the PM for their regular inspection reports. Given the place had been tenanted for a few years, I expected a few. Well, the single inspection report they were able to supply was from the previous day when we'd called them prior to moving back in. I was flabbergasted. The RE had been collecting 8% management fees for 2 years for NOTHING!!

    Another lesson learnt.

    We now keep much more close contact with PM's, and much more pro-active in our involvement. Seems you can't trust anyone but yourself to take due and proper care, and PM's can and will take advantage of cleaning issues on both sides of the spectrum.

    These issues remind me that experience leads to good judgement. Bad judgement leads to experience.
     
  7. Jacaranda

    Jacaranda Heather Donald

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    I now put an extra clause in my lease that the property must be professionally cleaned and carpets fumigated by the tenant when they vacate the property. Being a dog owner I will always rent to dog owners.

    I believe if the property is clean when a tenant moves in they might leave it clean when they vacate also if it is in the lease the PM can insist on in and takes the money from the bond if needed. It also gets approved if you go to court.

    Also learnt the hard way that Landlords Insurance is a must. I also have a policy with Barclays MIS in Brisbane called Protect and Collect. They are debt collectors so can chase tenants for the debts.
     
  8. eXc

    eXc Member

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    Only place I rented was dirty when we moved in, and we made it spotless when we moved out due to fear mongering by the PM.

    We had 4 people spend more than a whole day inside the house - we washed all the walls, paid carpet cleaner, cleaned powerpoints, picture hangers, oven, behind over, grease trap...etc. I wouldn't mind doing all this normally, but I don't think they even bothered to clean the bathroom or run a vacuum over carpet before we moved in. No doubt the PM took some cleaning fees from the bond, and didn't use it to clean the house.

    The PM walked in and went straight for the grease trap "well if you cleaned that, you must have cleaned the rest" and left it at that.
     
  9. mikezen

    mikezen Bigmember

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    Good advice and only 55 a year bargain ! :D
     
  10. DEC

    DEC Member

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    Do you have one that covers for what our insurer is calling poor housekeeping?
    We have one at present who has left leaving some scribble on the wall, badly gouged and damaged skirting boards , pink stains on the carpet and general mess and the insurers say its just poor housekeeping so no claim.
    Bond has been eaten by no rent for the last few weeks
    There is more than a few thousand to rectify if getting someone to do it.

    Have you used this yet and what was the result?
     
  11. DEC

    DEC Member

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    Bump:)
    and a few more for 10
     
  12. zmagen

    zmagen Manager, APAC @ NTI

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    One of the main reasons we stick to studio/1 bedroom units - cleaning bills are rarely beyond $100 (not to mention maintenance is minute, there are no surprises with structural issues etc, and most of them come with an onsite manager).

    Cap gain is, granted, less, but with the supreme cashflow we aim for to begin with, we don't care about that much, and can also handle more than a few body corp rate hikes over the investment life cycle.
     
  13. fisherman

    fisherman Member

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    You might have to raise a special thread to discuss "Barclays MIS in Brisbane called Protect and Collect".

    I would also be interested in the subject.
     
  14. mikezen

    mikezen Bigmember

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    I wonder if u could bring it in half way through a tenancy ?
     
  15. handyandy

    handyandy Member

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    Off course you can and more to the point I would expect that they would take your 'subscription' a month or 2 before the tenant left and you could foresee problems.