Debt = Wealth ?

[always_learning]

What a story! In the past when I had an issue with any supplier AMEX always helped me and I got a refund and so were others, so I am relly surprised to hear your story. Anyway what I have learned from this story;

1) Do not use a company called APEX as their business practices are very dubious and you might get screwed by them.

2) Do not pay with AMEX for ANY car rentals as they do not support you when the supplier will try to screw you.

So, congrats to both companies for work well done, this is the way to loose customers!!!

For you AL, my only suggestion would be to contact one of the current affairs (www.todaytonight.com.au - Channel 7 - or www.aca.ninemsn.com.au channel 9-) with the proof you have and if they pick up your story, believe me you had your payback big time! I am sure you will get your money back and also an apology for the "misunderstanding"!

2c.

It is a "my word against their word", basically APEX says I have no evidence that damages where not done (impossible logic). What happened was I dropped the car off late at night at Perth International airport in the APEX car drop off area, for the night flight back to japan, the office is closed at that time and I put gave the keys to the gatekeeper as recommended by APEX for an after office hour drop off.

Point also I paid extra $12/day insurance for "excess removal", however APEX claimed that since I had not informed police of my "damages" during "driving" so I was am liable for the full amount. When I pay with AmericanEX for a rental car you get extra insurance, but again when I claimed to AMEX against this insurance, I was told I should have reported my "accident" at the time as stipulated.

So point is that when they take your card imprint you are giving them full ability to take as much money as they like from you and they dont need to provide evidence, they dont even need to actually perform the repairs, they can say that $795 damages where done we will keep that because that is probably how much we will loose when we auction the car.

The new AL rule is "Always get the car checked and signed off in person at the time of drop off", if nobody will be around go use Budget/Avis who ever will be around.

 

[Aceyducey]

Always Learning,

I wouldn't stand for that kind of treatment.

Have you cancelled your Amex & written a letter to the CEO of Apex?

I recently had Optus try to charge me $800 for a mobile phone I had never gotten from them. I could not prove I hadn't gotten a phone from them & they couldn't prove I had.....

I worked our way up the ladder until I found someone who would cancel it (and reverse the charge on my credit card).

If the company cannot prove the damage you have a legal claim against them. Don't hold a grudge - resolve the situation to your satisfaction!

Cheers,

Aceyducey

 

[skater]

I had a similar situation also in Perth. Northside Car Rentals was the Company, and I would definately NOT recommend them.

Car backed into my rental car, only a small scratch (NO DENT) and left. Witness saw whole thing, gave Rego No and description of driver. Reported it to Police. Was still charged excess, even though it was not our fault, had reported it, and there was a witness.

It appears that these rental firms have a license to print money.

 

[rambada]

Interesting topic but it raises another question in my mind. If people are concerned about debt/assett issues then have they assessed their goals and their structure correctly? I mean whats the exit strategy? Debt is no problem at all with assett backing but whats the point? Capital gain is easy but how to convert to cash flow. I can't give my capital to Coles or Woolies in exchange for groceries. If we as property investors accept our own debt ratios for a given capital return, ie the risks/rewards have been assessed and accepted, then how do people intend to access given gain?

 

[Sunfish]

A tid bit from Gary North

He is an American Newsletter writer;

"SAVING AND SUCCESS

It is the determination to save that marks the successful
person. I am not persuaded that the successful person is made
successful by a savings program. He is successful because he has
determination to spend less than he earns, every month, no matter
what. It is this unbreakable dedication to sacrificing a portion
of the present for the sake of the future that marks the
successful person. It is a mind-set. It is this self-
determined, self-disciplined program -- a systematic savings
program -- that marks the person who has the ability to become a
success. This personality trait affects everything he does. He
is future-oriented. He is therefore upper-class."

No further comment ...... Thommo

 

[Aceyducey]

I am not persuaded that the successful person is made
successful by a savings program. He is successful because he has
determination to spend less than he earns, every month, no matter
what. It is this unbreakable dedication to sacrificing a portion
of the present for the sake of the future that marks the
successful person. It is a mind-set. It is this self-
determined, self-disciplined program -- a systematic savings
program -- that marks the person who has the ability to become a
success.

100% agree - though I was misled by the savings focus at first

Simply saving is not enough - you need to then leverage these saving by sacrificing living standards in the present for future living standard.

This doesn't mean that you need to live as a pauper today - though some people may see it that way Simply think about how much better would your life be if you spend 105% of what you earn versus how good your life is spending 70% of what you earn...would your life be 50% better? Probably not

Cheers,

Aceyducey

 

[always_learning]

In a recent poll on this forum 33% of respondants reported that they are millionaires. Let me guess that these millionaires didnt save $100pw from their salaries until they had a $1,000,000 in the bank.

In Jan's book she shows, dare I say; with with near mathematical certainty, how to crack the $1M in around 10 years on average income.

Debt is a terrible word, if anyone is like me, then we should try to avoid using the word "debt" the same sentence as investment, simply because as he word "debt" tends to bring forward negative emotions. The word "finance" however in my case doenst push any emotional buttons.

Finance is a tool, finance is a means to an end. Finance in a raw term just amplifies, just as walking from Sydney to Melbourne is possible, so to is buying investment properties for cash, just I want to use a car or better still a jet. Finance gets me where I am going quicker.

Debt is buying a new car with loan, debt is your credit card bill for that TV, clothes, expensive dinner with the wife. I dont like "debt". Finance is a tool I use to amplify my investment strategy.

 

[Steve Navra]

Debt is buying a new car with loan, debt is your credit card bill for that TV, clothes, expensive dinner with the wife. I dont like "debt". Finance is a tool I use to amplify my investment strategy.

Seeing the Trees for the Woods:

Debt is NOT a concept when applied to an increasing and income producing asset. (Property /shares)

Substitute the concept of "Debt" with the real value . . . "NET EQUITY".

You might control many properties . . . you are NOT in debt, rather you are holding $XXX,XXX-xx of net equity.

Regards,

Steve

 

[Sunfish]

Debt = " An obligation to pay or do something. "

You are obliged to pay for your property.

GOOD debt is that which you can repay.
BAD debt is that which you can't. Not everyone who borrows to invest can meet their obligations.

 

[always_learning]

Debt = " An obligation to pay or do something. "

You are obliged to pay for your property.

GOOD debt is that which you can repay.
BAD debt is that which you can't. Not everyone who borrows to invest can meet their obligations.

GOOD debt is that which you can repay. Again just my opinion but I am obliged to simply to service the "debt", or another words manage my cashflow so to meet the requirements of finance. Which gets now to the core of my current consideration: do I need to plan to pay down all my debt over my working life? i.e. is being debt free my goal? is being debt free a "working class" or middle class ideal, a concept which is absolutely not shared by the "wealthy"? ie. Does Kerry Packer wake up each morning singing "I owe, I owe, off to work I go?" does he have a goal of being "Debt Free in 10 years"? Or is Kerry Packer aiming for "Net Equity", "Shareholder value", "Profitablity" leaving finance simply as a means to an end and a tool to be managed?

BAD debt as that which you cannot repay? Let's say I buy a S320 Benz on lease, I can meet my obligations to repay the monthly $2000 cost, but I wouldn't class that as good debt.

Not everyone who borrows to invest can meet their obligations This to me is the key point! How to manage the risks pertaining to the use of finance?

 

[Steve Navra]

Let's say I buy a S320 Benz on lease, I can meet my obligations to repay the monthly $2000 cost

Hi AL,

Rather buy a S500 Benz . . . after all greater debt = Greater wealth??

Steve

 

[Tibor]

Debt = " An obligation to pay or do something. "

You are obliged to pay for your property.

GOOD debt is that which you can repay.
BAD debt is that which you can't. Not everyone who borrows to invest can meet their obligations.

Thommo,

I beg to differ and rather agree (opinion) with AL.

Good Debt which services an Asset (puts money INto your pocket) - cash-flow positive property, divident paying share, interest bearing bank account, royalties, etc -

Bad Debt which sercices a Liability / Doodad, / ect (takes money OUT of your pocket) - negatively geared property, new car, nice big house (called your home), speculative shares, etc -

hence,

Good debt can service itself, no matter what

Sure, I might opened a can of worms here.

2c

 

[always_learning]

Hi AL,

Rather buy a S500 Benz . . . after all greater debt = Greater wealth??

Steve

But the S500 or S600 would be "bad" debt as I couldnt service the finance, I could only manage repayments on the "povety pack" S320.

 

[Aceyducey]

The entire good debt/bad debt model is a tool for teaching people to reach a certain level of financial maturity.

The model is a good one to apply to your circumstance when relevant.

After attaining that point different models apply.


Some people can leap ahead to an understanding of how to leverage debt, some people take the slower route of attaining debt-free status first.

Both routes are fine.

A slight point on the definitions of Good Debt offered so far...Good Debt isn't only debt that you can service, but has to be generating some form of increase in your net wealth (and this may not be monetary).

What's the point in owning an asset that costs you nothing to hold, but earns you nothing?


Cheers,

Aceyducey