Development site auction today

Today I went to an auction in Moorebank, western Sydney for a large block of land of 1,200m and an old house which had a DA approval for 6 x 2 bedroom townhouses. The property was previously on the market for $720k and the vendor decided against selling even though someone offered $740k. It was then placed with a different agent to go to auction. It sold today at the auction for $910k which I thought would price the development out of feasibility. The finished product would sell for $350k each, total of $2.1m. At a build cost of $170k each totals $1.2m + land 910k comes to $1.93m, profit before tax of only $170k, a profit margin of just 9%.
The agent said those bidding at the end were all builders and could build at cost price of $170k each but I can't see how they could achieve much profit after purchasing for $910k. Perhaps they can build it for less than $170k?

My question is how do people compete against builders who are bidding at auctions for development sites like this? There are obviously plenty of developers around who aren't builders. Also what sort of cost per square meter would builders be constructing at?
On these figures above to get a 20% return on costs you couldn't buy it for more than $725k. Are there people out there developing off margins below 20%. If so and the banks don't lend unless the project has at least a 20% margin then would they fund most of it with their own cash? Or they might have to wait until the market goes up before they can source the funds.

Would be keen to hear peoples thoughts if they've had experience in this.

Cheers
 
For the builder they are making a profit plus paying their wages. If the deal doesnt stack up for you just move onto the next one.
 
It is also a frustrating thing for me.

too many crazy people around.

not only developer face this problem, many builders also are facing this problem!

Too many people blindly buying the property and "hope" the price will go up in value when they wanted to sell.

simple too many buyers not many seller in the Sydney market right now.

specially too many cash buyer with tons of cash.:(
 
I would suggest buying in off-market transactions where possible and getting your own DA approval so that you don't have competition.

Look especially at areas which are planned for higher density rezoning but it hasn't gone through yet and approach owners directly.
 
I would suggest buying in off-market transactions where possible and getting your own DA approval so that you don't have competition.

Look especially at areas which are planned for higher density rezoning but it hasn't gone through yet and approach owners directly.

How do you propose that?

The usual spamming letters or contacting every agent and becoming friendly with them?

And yes op, I know how you feel, recently in an area that wasn't booming and quit flat end product 220k, needed 20k Reno(fire damaged) if I did it with my awesome skills, probably 30 to 35 if done professionally or by an amateur, sold for 173k, I was going In at 150 to 152k

So had they spent 30k plus stamp duty plus legals would leave 11 to 6k profit, or zero profit if they sold it through an agent

Me thinks they had just watched renovation rescue

Edit: I'd love to see what their opinions overall are everything is done and dusted

Must admit I never ever hear of horror stories of these sorts of people underestimating time cost and ability after watching these types of shows

I guess people are never going to boast about their mistakes
 
Find ideal development sites and approach the owner directly, to find a deal that works for both of you. Agents normally just get in the way and make it more difficult to find the best arrangement,especially if you want an extended due diligence period or option (which an agent is likely to discourage as they want a quick sale).

I have created a series of videos on going through this process for small, simple development sites. This is the first one in a series of 4 videos on how to use RP Data to find property development sites http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=perF03avcZw

Cheers,
Matt
 
What you'll find is that people tend to overestimate the final price of the product they are selling - this causes the large variations in price for development sites you think are overpriced.
 
I say let them have it. They are still many sites around, and if you have other income to get you through, you wont be desperate to start the unprofitable development
 
are they 2 storey or single storey and are you including all outgoings in the build cost?

They are double story. No I'm not including all the outgoings. To keep it simple I haven't even included tax, agents selling fees. I would presume the $170k build cost the agent mentioned would include everything such as civil works and professional fees to get the project to CC approved stage.

I spoke to the architect and he estimated an additional $15k to $20k to have the site at CC approved stage. He said he couldn't fit 3 beds on the site due to more visitor parking requirements. The sewage pipes were on the side of the block but the architect couldnt tell me if they needed to be moved until he had a report done. The pipes were not sitting under the proposed buildings. The council contributions were $15k, not bad I thought for 6 dwellings. To add to the cost a telegraph pole right in the middle at the front needed to be moved to make way for the driveway. This pole had wires also running across the other side of the street on a busy road. The vendor 'accidently' didnt include the page in the DA special conditions saying that the developer must move the pole at his own cost. Not that this matters much as anyone with some development knowledge would know that the council does not pay for these things especially a builder forking out $900k. There is also the cost of the driveway running down the middle of the block. The block is flat with a very slight natural slope to the back corner.

The address is 178 Newbridge rd, Moorebank, NSW.
btw this was purely a researching exercise it was never my intention to bid at the auction.
 
Heh when it was advertised by the previous agent, I've actually made an offer of $650k (keep in mind no plans and everything was still STCA) and was quickly told to get lost (in far less polite terms, of course) and pretty surprised it's $910k.
 
Last edited:
I am not a builder and never do any development.

However, this deal makes perfect senses to me if the buyer is a builder.

The A$350K per house is today's price. Suppose the total profit is A$0 if we use today's house prices as selling prices, and all costs are counted.

If I am a builder, this deal makes senses because the market is on the way up.

After all houses are built which should be at least 2 years later. The market might move to more than 30%.

The end project is 30% profit.

If the house price is the same as today which is the worse case, I still get my salary paid because I am a builder.

Obviously, there is a risk with it. This is the thing. If you don't take risks, probably, you have to sit on the sideline and just keep wondering.
 
Doesn't seem to stack up - there is also the stamp duty of $40k and interest holding costs; the thing with a hot market is someone's estimate of the end selling price maybe optimistic and higher. Also never ever believe the agents estimate of the build cost.

Council contribution seems good though....

They are double story. No I'm not including all the outgoings. To keep it simple I haven't even included tax, agents selling fees. I would presume the $170k build cost the agent mentioned would include everything such as civil works and professional fees to get the project to CC approved stage.

I spoke to the architect and he estimated an additional $15k to $20k to have the site at CC approved stage. He said he couldn't fit 3 beds on the site due to more visitor parking requirements. The sewage pipes were on the side of the block but the architect couldnt tell me if they needed to be moved until he had a report done. The pipes were not sitting under the proposed buildings. The council contributions were $15k, not bad I thought for 6 dwellings. To add to the cost a telegraph pole right in the middle at the front needed to be moved to make way for the driveway. This pole had wires also running across the other side of the street on a busy road. The vendor 'accidently' didnt include the page in the DA special conditions saying that the developer must move the pole at his own cost. Not that this matters much as anyone with some development knowledge would know that the council does not pay for these things especially a builder forking out $900k. There is also the cost of the driveway running down the middle of the block. The block is flat with a very slight natural slope to the back corner.

The address is 178 Newbridge rd, Moorebank, NSW.
btw this was purely a researching exercise it was never my intention to bid at the auction.
 
Another problem with people purchasing property/blocks in proposed development areas to carry out projects that are currently not financially viable,is that it lifts/inflates prices in those areas'.
'Bubble' do I hear.........
 
was at auction yesterday in fairfield heights - around 525sqm
the property went for 503k. the second highest bidder who lost out only lost out by 2k. he was a builder. i suppose in his mind, he has already run the feasibility in his mind!!! but only by 2k?

anyway, bloody hell...im never gonna win against these builders.
houses are going like pancakes in cabramatta/smithfield/ffld heights/ccnly heights
 
Back
Top