Dilemma: Buy property now from parent or wait for will?

[Terryw]

If you went with the Joint Tenants option, It'd get messy if your mother died before your grandmother.

You'd be back at square one. The grandmother would re-acquire the whole of the property.. so when she eventually dies, (assuming there is no change to her will) this would be split between her two daughters.. your aunt would get one half and your mother's half would be split between yourself and your siblings (if any) your mother's partner, (if any)... etc.

Hope everything turns out ok. Family squabbles are annoying.

Or more likely, if your mum died before the grandmother the aunt would get everything.

 

[the helix]

Or more likely, if your mum died before the grandmother the aunt would get everything.

Err, don't wills normally discuss what happens if a beneficiary pre-deceases the testator?

 

[Terryw]

Err, don't wills normally discuss what happens if a beneficiary pre-deceases the testator?

The will may take this into account, but many would not.

If a beneficiary dies before the testator, then their gift would lapse.

eg. X leaves his estate to Y. Y dies before X. The gift to Y will lapse. The estate of X won't pass to Y's estate. Depending on the wording, this may mean X dies intestate. This is why its could to have a residue clause such as '... the remainder of my estate to....."

 

[wylie]

We signed new wills yesterday and all this stuff is covered. Perhaps that is the difference between a "one size fits all" will and one drawn up by a solicitor who knows his stuff?

 

[pully]

1st thought about this story was certainly a legal opinion is needed to protect all parties.

2nd thought was how tragic but not uncommon that 2 elderly people are living in a property valued at $800000, but is in knockdown condition?

pity the family cannot some how get together and come up with a plan that would enable the 2 elderly to live in comfort in the time they have left?

if the grandmother had a voice or a good advocate i wonder what her wishes might be?

her generation have made lots of sacrifices and often put others before themselves. be nice if they and their welfare could be considered, before the so called beneficiaries?

sadly this is happening more and more where the wealth of elderly people is considered to be the entitled property of the next generation. worse in some cases those who feel entitled take it well before death.

no disrespect to the poster who may have good intention but there are many ways of looking at the problem as presented.

 

[syba]

Or more likely, if your mum died before the grandmother the aunt would get everything.

That's probably reasonable if that happens - but my grandmother will ultimatly decide if she wants that to happen or something else. She has been speaking to a solicitor about it, but I just wanted some other peoples thoughts on things. I have printed this thread off and given to her to read over so she can make her own decisions.

2nd thought was how tragic but not uncommon that 2 elderly people are living in a property valued at $800000, but is in knockdown condition?

Is on a decent size block on the Sydney north shore. House is small old asbestos clad house - would be too expensive to renovate it even if you wanted to.

if the grandmother had a voice or a good advocate i wonder what her wishes might be?

My grandmother is the one initiating this as she wants to help her daughter out who has cared for her (and her husband when he was alive) their entire life - particularly now she is elderly. I personally think my aunt should get something but my grandmother doesn't want to.

her generation have made lots of sacrifices and often put others before themselves. be nice if they and their welfare could be considered, before the so called beneficiaries?
sadly this is happening more and more where the wealth of elderly people is considered to be the entitled property of the next generation. worse in some cases those who feel entitled take it well before death.

No one wants to take anything away from her. She wants to make her daughter who has looked after her get to keep the property she lives. If by 'selling' half the property to her enables her to do that, then she is entitled to do that. It is her property so she can do with it what she wants. She is completely of sound mind so the choice is hers to make.

 

[Terryw]

Syba, please let us know what the lawyer recommends - if it is not too personal.

 

[Experimentee]

Something to consider is that if your grandmother transfers the property to your mother either solely or as joint tenants, and then dies within 3 years of the transfer, under NSW law the property could be classed as "notional estate" and would be included in the value of the estate should your mother's sister challenge the Will. Stamp duty would be payable on such a transfer, but would not be payable for a transfer under the Will.

 

[Experimentee]

You should speak with a lawyer about these issues and then they can attest to your mum's capacity to change her will and exercise of free will. If something in her will states something to the effect of "I leave my house solely to my daughter ABC who has taken care of me for the last 20 years" then any challenge is not going to be as successful. IS there anything else (even if of small value) she can leave to the other sister? So that it proves that your mum had considered but chosen not to give, her anything of significant value?

In any event, a Lawyer will know what the best thing to do is.

It's a common misconception that leaving something small to a family member will reduce the possibility of a successful will challenge. In reality, it doesn't affect much at all. It may even go the other way, in that it shows that the willmaker believed that he or she had a responsibility to provide for the person, something which may not as easily be shown as easily if the willmaker had simply not mentioned that person in the will at all.