Do you take race into account when making decision on tenant?

[Pushka]

Jaycee,

I don't think Pushka's post hit the nail on the head at all. I wouldn't give a rats if her relative came from Sri Lanka or Timbuktoo, or anywhere in between.

Importantly though, I also wouldn't care less if they were the nicest person in the world either.

Hardly surprising to hear you say that Dazzling.

By 'nice' I meant that they pay their bills on time, are orderly and respectable, dont have the huge alcohol driven parties etc etc. Gosh, they even have a full time job and University Degree . But from what some have said, their race is more important than their credentials, and they wouldn't even get a chance to prove their 'worth'!

 

[jaycee]

jee, some people get their knickers in a twist pretty easily....

To Pushka, jaycee, and to anyone who has got offended by this thread:
Do you really think people here are trying to discriminate people by race simply to offend you? Comon, really.

If you want some real racial discrimination, go back in time to the 1950s, and speak to any italian/german/greek/other immigrant. Todays world of "political correctness" and the cries of "racial hate" are nothing compared to what the post WW2 immigrants endured upon entering this country - but you never hear them complain do you?


If someone wants to incorrectly read into what I've written here and take offense, then they are the lesser person for doing so.
This is my opinion, and my opinion only.

Never heard them copmplain ??

I am one of the above mentioned backgrounds. Yes I did & do hear them complain, of course they complained ! ... and at the same time, others we denying there was anything wrong with saying "go back home bloody wogs"

I didn't say anyone said what they said to offend me on purpose (you msut think I am an idiot), but I got offended anyway as others have in the past

 

[Pushka]

To Pushka, jaycee, and to anyone who has got offended by this thread:
Do you really think people here are trying to discriminate people by race simply to offend you? Comon, really..

That is a fairly silly thing to say really. Whether you offend me, or others is not the issue; not giving someone the opportunity (and who can prove their credentials and reliability) simply because they are not blonde haired and blue eyed on presentation is the point. Now, Martin Bryant, he had the true Aryan characteristics, didn't he!

If you want some real racial discrimination, go back in time to the 1950s, and speak to any italian/german/greek/other immigrant. .

So you think that makes discrimination OK? Because we did it in the past?

 

[Dazz]

Hardly surprising to hear you say that Dazzling.

Thank you Pushka,

I pride myself on being even and consistent in my business dealings, unswayed by any human emotions whatsoever. The Banks have been good teachers to me....and I've been diligently trying to emulate their business model.

None of this thread or subject, however passionate you and others "feel", makes a jot of difference to me.

Good evening.

 

[Witzl]

im really not trying to attack you guys here. Please remember that

not giving someone the opportunity (and who can prove their credentials and reliability) simply because they are not blonde haired and blue eyed on presentation is the point.

I never said that, nor implied it.
I will always consider any applicant, and the major deciding factor is their tennancy credentials.

just to try and clarify.....

1. Im not defending racism at all, nor am i justifying it. I'm just kind of agreeing with some previous comments regarding the current "PC" attitude of the world today.
It's almost like you cant exclude a minority group for any legitimate reason, because they will cry out "discriminiation", and sue the pants off you. I dont like that, and I think its crap. However, i dont like racism either, where it is genuinely racism, not just the boy who cried wolf.

2. As i stated in an earlier post, the reality is that you usually have absolutely no idea what race/ethnicity/culture an applicant is, because you are usually handed a piece of paper by the PM, and given all the information about their financial position and rental history..... so ultimately, the decision comes down to the credentials of the applicant.

3. My comments are simply trying to point out that some people are saying these things, because they are answering the original poster's question as a business decision. I dont think anyone here has come in to this thread to try and spread racism or to single out any particular cultural or ethnic background. I truly feel that people have just voiced their opinion on what might sway their business decision of selecting a suitable tennant for their investment.

Finally, im sorry if i've offended, i didnt mean to.
This topic is obviously too touchy to discuss

 

[sash]

Puska...you raise some interesting points....if I knew that Dazz works on oil rigs...I might not rent to him either. The picture I get mentally is of a one of guys from ZZ top...something out of the movie deliverance!

The funny thing is that....discrimination is so passe these days. The insular view from Australia is going to sorted out as new migrants from India and China reverse discriminate against Anglo Australians....not saying this is right but have a look at London. Wonder whether Dazz would be screaming if this happened to him.

What is the issue if you are insured anyway?

These sort of stupid assumptions are a wealth inhibitors...thank god our government sees this. Otherwise we might not be doing business with China and India because they are different. The we might be going down the gurgler like the US and UK....

People....this not the Xenophobic Australia of the 50s, 60s, 70s, or 80s....this is the multicultural Australia of the noughties.

As for Aboriginal Australians...why not judge each of them on their merits.....what about a fair go! Would it not be terrible if you were of this background but you wanted to better yourself but had people pre-judge you! They don't rent to you....don't give you a job...and then they claim that you are lazy!

Not being nasty....but there seems to be redneck element here.....I saw this in the USA when I lived there. Very subtle....but the views are backward none the less.

The sad thing is when you are rich...you have the opportunity to change things. But it looks like the term "rich" ar$e" holes can be found even on this site.

Hardly surprising to hear you say that Dazzling.

By 'nice' I meant that they pay their bills on time, are orderly and respectable, dont have the huge alcohol driven parties etc etc. Gosh, they even have a full time job and University Degree . But from what some have said, their race is more important than their credentials, and they wouldn't even get a chance to prove their 'worth'!

 

[natmarie73]

I would expect my PM to make the judgement call way before I am presented with the shortlisted applicants. If she presents an application from a person of colour or different ethnicity then I assume she has good reason to present it ie they have a job and good rental history. I would assume an aboriginal (or islander or white) applicant with a history of trashing houses and not paying rent wouldn't even get to the stage where their application was considered so the colour of their skin is a non-issue.

If you are self managing and an obviously downtrodden, drunk, jobless family of aboriginals applied to rent your house of course you wouldn't accept them, but nor would you if they were white right?

I wouldn't think that the aboriginals who are living in commission houses would even be a part of the private market anyway so the chance they would be applying to rent any of our houses is very low if not zero.

My sister's tenant is/was (not sure if she is still there) a single aboriginal woman and she didn't even know it until she went over there one day to inspect the bathroom floor which had rotted and needed to be replaced. She had not had one bit of trouble with this tenant at all.

 

[Pushka]

Hey Witzl, that explains your ideas better so all good.

Dazzling, I am values driven, it is just how I am. And this sometimes means I may make decisions using a less than perfect business model. But that works for me. Actually, I pride myself on it! :: Horses for courses!

Puska...you raise some interesting points....if I knew that Dazz works on oil rigs...I might not rent to him either. The picture I get mentally is of a one of guys from ZZ top...something out of the movie deliverance!

Love it!

 

[steveadl]

As for Aboriginal Australians...why not judge each of them on their merits.....what about a fair go! Would it not be terrible if you were of this background but you wanted to better yourself but had people pre-judge you! They don't rent to you....don't give you a job...and then they claim that you are lazy!

You're right Sash, but when it comes down to me and my few properties - why should I take the risk? Especially when there are other people willing to rent it. Now if I was the Govt. I would have no choice, but I have the luxury of saying "nope, too risky."

That's the advice I would give to the person who started the poll. Let someone else take on that risk and give them a go - it's just not worth the potential hassle, to me anyway.

 

[sash]

No worries Steve.....each to their own.

I used to be quite hardnosed some might even say an *********....but over the last two years I have changed my behaviour....guess what I am getting things now quicker and faster than before.....and funnily enough the networth is moving even quicker!!!

As for risk....isn't that what life is about........

You're right Sash, but when it comes down to me and my few properties - why should I take the risk? Especially when there are other people willing to rent it. Now if I was the Govt. I would have no choice, but I have the luxury of saying "nope, too risky."

That's the advice I would give to the person who started the poll. Let someone else take on that risk and give them a go - it's just not worth the potential hassle, to me anyway.

 

[Aaron Sice]

io see this thread getting locked pretty quickly.

 

[ianvestor]

Kudos steveadl, your posts are without a doubt the most sensible in this entire thread.

 

[Bill.L]

Hi all,

This thread is really bringing out a few emotions, probably from peoples experiences.

I tend to take the PM's advice like Nat. I basically tell them if the tenant stuffs up, that it is they who suggested this lot.

The most trouble we have had with tenants has been with mid-late 20's white Aussies (couples) and single Mothers in their late 30's. If it makes me a Racist about either lot then so be it.

Realistically as GoAnna says, you get good and bad of any race,age, gender make-up etc.

You pays your money you take your chances

bye

 

[Pom]

I too find this thread somewhat sad.

Effectively 2/3rds of the posters taking part in the poll have racist leanings.

Wow. Australia clearly has a long way to go on race issues, particularly considering that a site dedicated to property investment should attract a more educated / intelligent crowd.

 

[firstmillion]

Would you still consider !!

This one is for the people who have categorised Australians as safe-tenant-race and not-safe-tenant-race : In some of the threads, such forumites have mentioned how bad their tenants have been and they had to use police, tribunal etc. to get them evicted because they were behind rents, trashed the property etc. (inspite of choosing tenants from safe-tenant-race). Would these forumites dare to put people from that background as not-safe-tenant-race ? Probably not. . Would refuse to rent your home to people from that race ? Or categorise all of them as being bad tenants ? THINK.

As someone mentioned, investing is a rational decision and it should be based on rational factors.

I would have prefered if the thread was named " Profile of people you would prefer as tenants".

Cheers

Disclaimer : No personal offence is intended, just want to read the logic / rational.

 

[steveadl]

Effectively 2/3rds of the posters taking part in the poll have racist leanings.

Wow. Australia clearly has a long way to go on race issues, particularly considering that a site dedicated to property investment should attract a more educated / intelligent crowd.

Can only speak for myself, but I don't see myself as racist. I judge individuals within a race on their own merits. For example I've had/have a few aboriginal clients who are fantastic people, always nice to talk with when they came in. To them I would have absolutely no problem renting one of my properties to. Unfortunately though, from my limited experience - they are definitely in the vast minority when compared with others I see both around work, and around my neighbourhood, and God forbid I ever walk through Victoria Square at night unless the council have cleaned that up recently?!

If you define the above as racist, then that's your perogative - but as I illustrated, for me it's up to the individual person. The problem is, everyone will obviously be on their best behaviour when meeting with a property manager.

And the point of this thread poll was to ask what you do with your properties. Personally, I'm not willing to take the risk of trying to find (for example) the 1 in 10 that might be a great tenant, when in other racial groupings the odds are much better. In a perfect world things may be different, but I'm living in reality - and in reality, I've seen way too many trashed houses, so I'll lessen the risk of that happening to me any way possible.

By the way Blue, you're right - can't see this thread lasting much longer.

 

[Pushka]

And the point of this thread poll was to ask what you do with your properties. Personally, I'm not willing to take the risk of trying to find (for example) the 1 in 10 that might be a great tenant, when in other racial groupings the odds are much better.

Yep, that's the assumption I dislike, that one racial group is somehow more a risk than others. Because our assumptions - our view of reality, are driven by many factors, including personal experience, media, and the preference of people to hear and promote the bad and not the good.

First million, I think your wording is better.

 

[WinstonWolfe]

Has anyone on Somersoft ever had an Indigenous Australian, Pacific Islander, or Sudanese refugee as a tenant?

 

[twobobsworth]

Has anyone on Somersoft ever had an Indigenous Australian, Pacific Islander, or Sudanese refugee as a tenant?

Nope. Chinese in 1, Indian in the other.

 

[s_t]

Not sure if it is a good idea to get involved in this thread......but
thinking unemotionally and logically:

We want 3 main things from our tenants:
1. Respect/care for other peoples (our) assets
2. Pay bills(rent) on time
3. Reasonable expectations-(eg. don't create drama over every paint chip/scratch etc)

To say that all racial groups, with their different traditional and cultural backgrounds would be equal on these 3 issues isn't logical.

Would the differences be big enough to worry about? Don't know. You could draw up a matrix giving weight to each issue and give a rating for each racial group if you really wanted to Even better hire an unbiased expert well versed on the habits of different groups to do it for you Or you could just go with your gut feeling and select specific applicants who you are happy with


As I mentioned in another thread some time ago, we all discrimate all the time. Discriminate means to discern differences. Anybody who has a place up for rent, and doesn't want to discrimate at all, should hold a lucky dip for all who are interested in the place. I think most owners will instead go with there gut feeling though.......