Donald Trump is a Chump

[jagmcmanus]

Donald Trump is what he is...

Born into a priveleged life he was described as a brat of a child and too much of a handful for his family and staff to cope with, so he was sent to military school to straighten out.

He has never worked for an outside firm or even had to apply for a job.

He started his first developments using his fathers funds, he built using contractors who worked for his fathers companies and sourced properties using his fathers investment team...

So unlike you and I he didn't need to apply for finance to get his first deals off the ground. He didn't need any expertise in developing because guess what? His fathers employees (who had been successfully developing for 3 decades) did all that for him.

He was just a loud obnoxious rich kid, he had life served to him on a silver platter....

I have to ask anyone who has read his books or researched him at all, what value has he been to your investment style? How has he enhanced your property returns?


Timeline of Trumps stated wealth:

(Fred is Trumps father - a very different kettle of fish)

1982 Wealth: Share of Fred's estimated $200 million fortune. Forbes explains: "Consummate self-promoter. Building Trump Tower next to Tiffany's. Angling for Atlantic City casino." Forbes quotes Donald: " 'Man is the most vicious of animals and life is a series of battles ending in victory or defeat.' " While Forbes estimates that the family's fortune was over $200 million, it says that "Donald claims $500 million."

1983 Wealth: Share of Fred's estimated $400 million fortune. (Author note: Observe that although 1982 to 1983 was a particularly brutal recession year, the Trump family's real estate fortune doubles.)

1984 Wealth: Fred has $200 million; Donald has $400 million.

1985 Rank: 51; Wealth: $600 million. (Donald becomes a solo Forbes 400 act; Fred disappears from the list.)

1986 Rank: 50; $700 million.

1987 Rank: 63; $850 million.

1988 Rank: 44; $1 billion.

1989 Rank: 26; $1.7 billion. (Observe that Donald's wealth has grown by $1.1 billion during a four-year period when he was borrowing huge sums to buy money-losing properties.)

1990 Rank: Dropped from the list! Forbes explains: "In 1990 the rich have been getting poorer. Trump is the most noteworthy loser. Once a billionaire, Trump's net worth may actually have dropped to zero." (That makes things clearer. Was he ever a billionaire? Maybe his net worth just stayed the same? Maybe it always had been zero?)

1991 Rank: AWOL.

1992 Rank: AWOL.

1993 Rank: AWOL. (These are the times that try men's souls. Hang in there, Donald.)

1994 Rank: AWOL.

1995 Rank: AWOL.

1996 Rank: He's back. Rank: 373; $450 million. Forbes explains: "Trump, polite but unhappy, phoning from his plane: 'You're putting me on at $450 million? I've got that much in stock market assets alone. There's 100 percent of Trump Tower, 100 percent of the new Nike store - they're paying $10 million a year in rent!' Add it all up, said Trump, and his net worth is 'in the $2 billion range, probably over $2 billion.' " (Don't worry, Donald. One year from now Forbes will help you find another easy $1 billion.)

1997 Rank: 105; $1.4 billion. Forbes explains: "Net worth was negative $900 million in 1990, but the Donald now claims to have $500 million in cash alone. Disputes our estimate. 'The real number,' he insists, 'is $3.7 billion.' "

1998 Rank: 121; $1.5 billion. Forbes explains: "Unstoppable salesman, master of hyperbole. Net worth was negative $900 million in 1990, now claims our estimate is low by a factor of three: 'The number is closer to $5 billion.' "

1999 Rank: 145; $1.6 billion. Forbes explains: "We love Donald. He returns our calls. He usually pays for lunch. He even estimates his own net worth ($4.5 billion). But no matter how hard we try, we just can't prove it."

2000 Rank: 167; $1.7 billion. Forbes explains: "In the Donald's world, worth more than $5 billion. Back on earth, worth considerably less."

2001 Rank: 110; $1.8 billion.

2002 Rank: 92; $1.9 billion.

2003 Rank: 71; $2.5 billion.

2004 Rank: 189; $2.6 billion.

http://ddo.typepad.com/ddo/2005/12/tracking_donald.html
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I would rather read a conservative investment book by Noel Whittaker anyday.

 

[tiger]

He was just a loud obnoxious rich kid, he had life served to him on a silver platter....

So is Paris Hilton but what good has she made of it?

 

[lizzie]

well ... i didn't read all your post - but to take a different slant (this is not advocating, but i do find his books an interesting read) that he could have easily sat on his backside and done nothing but spend his father's money.

in 20 years he's turn $400mil into $2.6bil ... sure he could probably have done the same in a quieter and less spectacular manner, but that was not his style.

also, how many people "win" a couple (or a couple of hundred mil via the uk and usa lotteries) of mil and then end up destitute a few years later - more than you think.

personally i'd rather listen to someone who started with nothing - but underneath all that self-glitz and glamour is "some" good business advice for thinking outside the box, you just got to shift thru the rest.

 

[Token Funder]

well ... i didn't read all your post - but to take a different slant (this is not advocating, but i do find his books an interesting read) that he could have easily sat on his backside and done nothing but spend his father's money.

in 20 years he's turn $400mil into $2.6bil ... sure he could probably have done the same in a quieter and less spectacular manner, but that was not his style.

also, how many people "win" a couple (or a couple of hundred mil via the uk and usa lotteries) of mil and then end up destitute a few years later - more than you think.

personally i'd rather listen to someone who started with nothing - but underneath all that self-glitz and glamour is "some" good business advice for thinking outside the box, you just got to shift thru the rest.

Donald Trump = Alan Bond with scary hair and scarier appetite for debt.

 

[Mr. Fabulous]

He's an incredibly successful businessman who succeeded where most others would have given up. You're some guy on an internet forum. I know who I'd rather pay attention to.

Mark

 

[fernfurn]

You've gotta have money to make money and he had plenty to start with, but could easily have lost the lot, that makes him a winner in my book

 

[kissfan]

jagmcmanus........................................................."You're fired"

Regards
Marty

 

[jagmcmanus]

So is Paris Hilton but what good has she made of it?

What good has she made of it?

She turned being a rich party brat into a career and a brand. What ever you think of Paris (and I don't think much of her at all) she has absolutely capitalised on her situation. Not only is she worth more than Trump, she also doesn't pretend to be anything other than what she is....

 

[jagmcmanus]

well ... i didn't read all your post - but to take a different slant (this is not advocating, but i do find his books an interesting read) that he could have easily sat on his backside and done nothing but spend his father's money.

in 20 years he's turn $400mil into $2.6bil ... sure he could probably have done the same in a quieter and less spectacular manner, but that was not his style.

also, how many people "win" a couple (or a couple of hundred mil via the uk and usa lotteries) of mil and then end up destitute a few years later - more than you think.

personally i'd rather listen to someone who started with nothing - but underneath all that self-glitz and glamour is "some" good business advice for thinking outside the box, you just got to shift thru the rest.

Why bother replying if you didn't read my post. He did not turn 400M into 2.6B. Not even close.

 

[jagmcmanus]

He's an incredibly successful businessman who succeeded where most others would have given up. You're some guy on an internet forum. I know who I'd rather pay attention to.

Mark

In what way is he an incredibly successful businessman?

What specifically did he succeed in where most others wouldn't have?

Why haven't you refuted his 3 BANKRUPTCIES?

How do you think his retail investors felt in 1989, 1998 and 2004 when they lost money with Trump?

Pay Trump all the attention you want. It doesn't worry me, what aorries me is people taking his advice for gospel or not researching him enough.

Truly, if you took the time to read up on his business and personal life (not the propaganda, the factual stuff) you might think differently.

 

[jagmcmanus]

You've gotta have money to make money and he had plenty to start with, but could easily have lost the lot, that makes him a winner in my book

The point is he did lose the lot, he has never substantiated any net worth figures, big hat, no cattle.

 

[jagmcmanus]

jagmcmanus........................................................."You're fired"

Regards
Marty

LOL, is everyone aware he tried to trademark that phrase on two seperate occasions.?

Yes he tried to trademark 2 words of the English language as he believed it was part of his intellectual property. Yikes.

 

[tcocaro]

hmmm i wont dwell but...

I was surprised to hear he had 3x bankruptcies which went against what I had been hearing all the time in the past that he was close too bankruptcy but at the 11th hour saved himself. (I had always been somewhat impressed with that - admiration has since dissipated)

Great that he has apparently bounced back but just because not all your entities go belly up doesn't mean you dodged a bullet? Nor does saying you never "personally" had to declare bankruptcy make the fact your entities HAVE.. its semantics in my view.

Aside from that I congratulate him on his "media" successes and his businesses (on face value) but he can never claim to be a self made man.

This doesn't mean he hasn't achieved a lot but so have many more less known individuals.

I read the "wealth" magazine interview about trump and like all interviews i am most interested in the first few years... I am not really excited to hear about how someone turned 100million into 200million. I find it a lot more interesting to hear how someone made $0 into $1 million.

For this reason i almost laughed when it (and i'm paraphrasing) simply said (as if in triumph) on my very first project in his early 20's I made a 6 million dollar profit.

I would simply like to ask one question...

1. Was the entity you made (YOUR) first 6 MILLION on (YOUR) first (PROJECT) yours? were you even a director of the entity? what was your holdings in that company? - if he wasn't then basically he was a project manager should have been paid 200k for his job and and pat on the back.

I suspect daddy pretty much had a 100% holding here or a 100% guarantee which either way you look at it means dad basically foot the bill and therefore was the developer not "Donald".

Again not bagging him but call a spade a spade he did a good job (on face value given his publicity machine is top notch so its hard to tell whats real and whats not) continuing on from his fathers already existing and profitable empire - but thats it.

If you see him more as a media personality then yes.... hes a natural cannot fault him but its being a developer that has "made him" and for that.. I'm not so impressed.

 

[tcocaro]

didnt paris try to do the same with "thats hot" i think she succeeded didn't she?

Thanks to her theres probably thousands of children around the world burning their hands on the hot stove because their parents cannot scream out "thats hot" in fear of copyright infringement

LOL, is everyone aware he tried to trademark that phrase on two seperate occasions.?

Yes he tried to trademark 2 words of the English language as he believed it was part of his intellectual property. Yikes.

 

[Sunder]

What specifically did he succeed in where most others wouldn't have?

Why haven't you refuted his 3 BANKRUPTCIES?

Tell you what. Give away every cent of your assets and ruin your credit rating. Calling me in 2038 or so, and tell me you are the owner of a 2.8 Billion empire

I'll call Trump a Chump then and make you a celebrity.

Until then, put up or shut up.

 

[Dazz]

Born into a priveleged life

He started his first developments using his fathers funds, he built using contractors who worked for his fathers companies and sourced properties using his fathers investment team...

So unlike you and I he didn't need to apply for finance to get his first deals off the ground. He didn't need any expertise in developing because guess what? His fathers employees (who had been successfully developing for 3 decades) did all that for him.

He was just a loud obnoxious rich kid, he had life served to him on a silver platter....

....and if you asked 100 investors what one of their main goals in life are, probably 90 or so of them would wish for their offspring to have an easier road to hoe than what they endured. Don't hold it against the kids for that...

Not everyone has to start this wealth climbing on the bottom rung - surely.

 

[lizzie]

Why bother replying if you didn't read my post. He did not turn 400M into 2.6B. Not even close.

i read the majority of your post - just couldn't be bothered with the year by year $$ position.

errrr - i used your figures. worth $400mil in 1984 - worth $2.6bil in currently.

why the such savage bitterness about someone who you do not personally know and who has done you no harm (that we are aware of)?

 

[Mr. Fabulous]

why the such savage bitterness about someone who you do not personally know and who has done you no harm (that we are aware of)?

Jealousy (he'll deny it of course).

There you go, jag. There's a few more tall poppies for you to cut down.

Mark

 

[natmarie73]

I personally don't care for Donald Trump either. I find people who really have started with nothing and who make something of themselves much more inspirational than those who inherit no matter what they do with it. Trump senior sounds like someone worth emulating moreso than Trump junior.

He also looks like a nonce which probably doesn't help.

 

[im sparticus]

on more important matters........do you think he got to bed hawko??