Duplex Development Toowoomba
- Thread starter Roachy
- Start date
Hi Roachy,
I noticed you disclosed the address at some point to Fourex and so I thought you may be willing to share it. I apologize if I seemed a bit forward in my request.
I had a contract on a property in North Toowoomba, on two lots, and single dwelling at front. Two things seemed to really kill it. Slope of land was against me. Both lots would be less than 450m2 after boundary realignment (due to shared driveway) and council suggested property was not much good for developing.
I am after a block of land where an existing dwelling can be utilised and a second dwelling can be built ( Dual occupancy ) or better still, be able to sub-divide so can build duplex and sell off original dwelling (same strategy as yourself). Aim here is to have neutral or cash flow property that is not high risk. I do not want to look for cash flow in small regional town, mining town etc.
The idea behind ascertaining the address of your property is two fold. To help me give guidelines to real-estate agents. To use your site as precedence for having such a small lot subdivision. Council have been known to shift their thinking based on precedence before.
Either way, thank you for your time.
I noticed you disclosed the address at some point to Fourex and so I thought you may be willing to share it. I apologize if I seemed a bit forward in my request.
I had a contract on a property in North Toowoomba, on two lots, and single dwelling at front. Two things seemed to really kill it. Slope of land was against me. Both lots would be less than 450m2 after boundary realignment (due to shared driveway) and council suggested property was not much good for developing.
I am after a block of land where an existing dwelling can be utilised and a second dwelling can be built ( Dual occupancy ) or better still, be able to sub-divide so can build duplex and sell off original dwelling (same strategy as yourself). Aim here is to have neutral or cash flow property that is not high risk. I do not want to look for cash flow in small regional town, mining town etc.
The idea behind ascertaining the address of your property is two fold. To help me give guidelines to real-estate agents. To use your site as precedence for having such a small lot subdivision. Council have been known to shift their thinking based on precedence before.
Either way, thank you for your time.
G'day Hartley,
I provided you the address in a Personal Message.
My DA was completed approximately 3 1/2 years ago, so things have changed. I heard that driveways have gone to 6.5m an a few different things. Go and have a driveby my block and you will see how it is configured. Its perfect for what you want.
Council I think want 600m2 for a dual occupancy under the multi-dwelling zone. I always ring up council town planners to make sure I can do what I want. They wouldn't give it to me in writing but gave me the necessary assurance I could do what I wanted.
I'll keep my eye out for any blocks I see. I definitely know of one, but my mate is currently looking at it.
Your strategy is perfect. And looking at demographics figures (rents are going up) the strategy will only be getting better.
At this point in time the whole block will be cashflow positive by around $3k, not including any write offs or depreciation.
Throw anymore questions at me as they come to you.
Roachy
Demographics I don't totally agree. From all I have heard is that Surat Basin will bring much growth to Toowoomba and the surrounding smaller hubs. Traditionally Toowoomba has been the main hub for all of South West/Central Queensland. I think that base will become larger.
Toowoomba is lower in the socio-economic level than Brisbane, and thats why we may be seeing these new listings, due to mortgage stress.
I personally believe that Toowoomba is a large growth area for the near and long future.
If you can provide anymore information it would be much appreciated.
Roachy
Toowoomba is lower in the socio-economic level than Brisbane, and thats why we may be seeing these new listings, due to mortgage stress.
I personally believe that Toowoomba is a large growth area for the near and long future.
If you can provide anymore information it would be much appreciated.
Roachy
hartleypj,
Sometimes you just need to solve a problem.
Slope of block against you - Solution seek stormwater drainage easement off a neighbour.
Boundary realignment with the two lots will not work due to minimum lot size - Solution look at dissolving the lot into one and put in an application for a unit development (front dwelling make unit 1 and build a duplex as units 2+3).
Like your thoughts on working with 2 lot properties in the older style locations in Toowoomba, cheap way around the council contribution charges for creating a new lot and headworks charges.
Cheers,
Fourex.
Sometimes you just need to solve a problem.
Slope of block against you - Solution seek stormwater drainage easement off a neighbour.
Boundary realignment with the two lots will not work due to minimum lot size - Solution look at dissolving the lot into one and put in an application for a unit development (front dwelling make unit 1 and build a duplex as units 2+3).
Like your thoughts on working with 2 lot properties in the older style locations in Toowoomba, cheap way around the council contribution charges for creating a new lot and headworks charges.
Cheers,
Fourex.
Spot on Fourex.
We may still have a small slope problem...but will be using an exisitng easement to link to a lower road.
Have not thought about setbacks, but your dead right. Very smart way of doing things
Roachy,
There is a time limit on your DA- check when the approval will lapse. Community title can solve some issues, Council have to approve the CMS.
I have been looking at similar developments in the region- more for interest sake. I am a Surveyor in Toowoomba and looking to fill this space, solve problems, and look to develop in the medium term- when I have time to enter the game.
Wilbur
There is a time limit on your DA- check when the approval will lapse. Community title can solve some issues, Council have to approve the CMS.
I have been looking at similar developments in the region- more for interest sake. I am a Surveyor in Toowoomba and looking to fill this space, solve problems, and look to develop in the medium term- when I have time to enter the game.
Wilbur
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Roachy,
There is a time limit on your DA- check when the approval will lapse. Community title can solve some issues, Council have to approve the CMS.
I have been looking at similar developments in the region- more for interest sake. I am a Surveyor in Toowoomba and looking to fill this space, solve problems, and look to develop in the medium term- when I have time to enter the game.
Wilbur
Wilbur,
The DA ends January 2011 and building should start soon. So I'm all good in that respect.
Are you a quantity surveyor?
Roachy
Nope. We look after the titling of new buildings and allotments etc, and the approvals to reconfigure and change the existing use of a lot etc.
I think that there will always be a decent market in Toowoomba for dual occupancy, duplexes etc as the University generates a lot of demand. I am keen to service this market as ultimately I want to invest in it. With little selling in Toowoomba, now is a good time to buy!
Wilbur
I think that there will always be a decent market in Toowoomba for dual occupancy, duplexes etc as the University generates a lot of demand. I am keen to service this market as ultimately I want to invest in it. With little selling in Toowoomba, now is a good time to buy!
Wilbur
YAY!
Finance has finally been approved after being delayed for 2 weeks. Paid the 5% deposit today and signed the building contract. We have started colour selection and the builder has submitted all plans etc to the council.
We are very excited and hope everything comes off without a hitch.
May even fly up to Toowoo and Brisbane to do colours on site; next week sometime.
Will notify you all on dates for slab down, frame up etc.
Roachy
Finance has finally been approved after being delayed for 2 weeks. Paid the 5% deposit today and signed the building contract. We have started colour selection and the builder has submitted all plans etc to the council.
We are very excited and hope everything comes off without a hitch.
May even fly up to Toowoo and Brisbane to do colours on site; next week sometime.
Will notify you all on dates for slab down, frame up etc.
Roachy
I was very interested to read your story re duplex development in Toowoomba as my husband and I are seriously considering 'dipping our toe' into the property development market and are currently looking at purchasing a property with a 1277sqm block. The block has DA approval for the development of 514sqm (behind the present property) which has a proposed laneway access running past the current property which is a 763sqm block.
I would very much appreciate any thoughts on the proposed development, things that we should be aware of, pitfalls etc.
I personally would like to build two 2 storey units on the 514sqm block as this development will be surrounded by housing and I am quite concerned about the aesthetics of ground level duplexs, also unsure of the current rulings with Toowoomba city council re building two story duplexs on a dual occupancy.
Any assistance/advice greatly appreciated
I would very much appreciate any thoughts on the proposed development, things that we should be aware of, pitfalls etc.
I personally would like to build two 2 storey units on the 514sqm block as this development will be surrounded by housing and I am quite concerned about the aesthetics of ground level duplexs, also unsure of the current rulings with Toowoomba city council re building two story duplexs on a dual occupancy.
Any assistance/advice greatly appreciated
Was up in Toowoomba a few weeks ago having a squiz.
An accountant we use up there told us the place is expected to do well from the gas and mining further west.
I can't work it out though. There's 684 resi properties for sale tonight in post code 4350, and 400 rental listings. But SQM has vacancy rate for Jun10 around 1.25%.
If pop is 100,000, and a third rent at 2.5 per rental, then total rental stock should be ~13000.....and 1.25% = 173 rentals.
We rode our bicycles around quite a bit, and the place seems quiet commercially speaking. Lots of empty commercial, and the demographic wasn't too flash.
Though I can't help but like the place......and encores restaurant.
All the best with your dev't roachy. There's only 10 townhouses for sale so maybe you'll capture the downsizing empty nesters with your duplex.
edit:
gees, just checked the unemployment rate 1.9 1.9 2.2 2.8 3.5 for the last 5 qtrs. That's very low compared to the rest of SE Qld.
An accountant we use up there told us the place is expected to do well from the gas and mining further west.
I can't work it out though. There's 684 resi properties for sale tonight in post code 4350, and 400 rental listings. But SQM has vacancy rate for Jun10 around 1.25%.
If pop is 100,000, and a third rent at 2.5 per rental, then total rental stock should be ~13000.....and 1.25% = 173 rentals.
We rode our bicycles around quite a bit, and the place seems quiet commercially speaking. Lots of empty commercial, and the demographic wasn't too flash.
Though I can't help but like the place......and encores restaurant.
All the best with your dev't roachy. There's only 10 townhouses for sale so maybe you'll capture the downsizing empty nesters with your duplex.
edit:
gees, just checked the unemployment rate 1.9 1.9 2.2 2.8 3.5 for the last 5 qtrs. That's very low compared to the rest of SE Qld.
Good morning JK,
With the current Toowoomba council's GFA rule you will be able to put 2x 85m2 (bottom floor only) on that block. And thus, have some nice large 170m2 (theoretically if you build the top floor the same as the bottom) units.
Things to look out for are is the block sloping toward or away from the road. If away, you may need to find drainage through easement to adjoining properties (this can be a hassle).
Also, remember setbacks are a necessary and I believe they are 1m for Toowoomba, except for 6m walls with no windows (eg. Garages) (They need to be fire rated too).
Toowoomba Regional Council like there to be 2/3 open space, whether that be the driveway, gardens etc. And you are also to have one guest park per unit. This guest park can just park behind your garage if need be. Also, the driveway length and width has changed, but my DA was completed in 2007 and thus abides by those laws.
Those are a few of the major points. So far its been a pretty easy process, especially with the builder, who has done most of the Town Planning for us.
If you want, you can send the link of the property to me and I can have a quick look for any other areas.
Regards,
Roachy
Was up in Toowoomba a few weeks ago having a squiz.
An accountant we use up there told us the place is expected to do well from the gas and mining further west.
I can't work it out though. There's 684 resi properties for sale tonight in post code 4350, and 400 rental listings. But SQM has vacancy rate for Jun10 around 1.25%.
If pop is 100,000, and a third rent at 2.5 per rental, then total rental stock should be ~13000.....and 1.25% = 173 rentals.
We rode our bicycles around quite a bit, and the place seems quiet commercially speaking. Lots of empty commercial, and the demographic wasn't too flash.
Though I can't help but like the place......and encores restaurant.
All the best with your dev't roachy. There's only 10 townhouses for sale so maybe you'll capture the downsizing empty nesters with your duplex.
edit:
gees, just checked the unemployment rate 1.9 1.9 2.2 2.8 3.5 for the last 5 qtrs. That's very low compared to the rest of SE Qld.
Hey Winston,
Yes those figures are odd. And I see the ones in API all the time and wonder. My REA got a vacancy rate of .53% last year (for all properties).
Toowoomba has grown tremendously since I was there back in 1998 (to when I went up there in 2010). New stores, new shopping centres etc.
There are definitely bogans, but if you buy in the right suburb you will mitigate that risk. There is a general rule to buy in the Eastern Suburbs of Toowoomba (I hope Toowoombaites can back me up on this).
The place does have a nostalgic feel to it and a lot of people visit it for the flower festivals and also the god botherer festivals which happen up there every year.
I hope the Surat Basin brings many of the mining HQs to Toowoomba, and leave the operational work out in Chinchilla and Dalby. We'll soon see.
Thanks for the luck!
Regards,
Roachy
Toowoomba builders
Be prepared to look around.
Peter Betros homes can be reliable. Personal service and he does a good job, well he is very thorough.
Or even Jeffries builders in Warwick.
See how you go
So you bought land and then are building the duplexs on that?
I have wanted to do that but cant see the immediate cash flow.
Be prepared to look around.
Peter Betros homes can be reliable. Personal service and he does a good job, well he is very thorough.
Or even Jeffries builders in Warwick.
See how you go
So you bought land and then are building the duplexs on that?
I have wanted to do that but cant see the immediate cash flow.
Hello all,
Havent updated this for awhile so here I go.
Finance was approved up until the documents department got to the loan. They wanted the land subdivided before any building was to commence. They stated this was due to the LMI restrictions. I am still a little coy about all this mumbo jumbo, but anyway (perhaps someone can spell this out to me).
So we went ahead with the subdivision. I got onto the previous owners who had the original subdivision plan. They were hard to get hold of and had very poor communication skills. They wouldn't return my calls and eventually I gave up on them (I gave them 2 weeks of constantly calling them).
So I got the original Surveyors to draw up the plan again. Got it in the mail a couple of days ago, signed it and sent it back. It should currently be in with council. The surveyors tell me it could take up to 3 weeks for council to seal, and a further 3 weeks for DERM. The contributions fee was the real killer, approximately 19k. The financiers would provide the 19k, but this took my debt to above 1 mil, and apparently this means the LMI rate goes up substantially. Does anyone know what the current days in each of these organisations it is taking?
Anyway, the plumbing department of Toowoomba Council provided me a letter stating that the drawing for the plumbing needed some changes. I sent this immediately to the builder and the builder is currently running with the changes. This should have been rectified and I will ring the builder tomorrow to find out exactly how it has progressed.
Anyway, I got some questions some of you may be able to answer.
I've sent the plan of survey and a copy of the cheque to the financial company I am going through. Will the suffice, allowing the financial company to release funds for the build?
Does anyone know what the current days it takes for Toowoomba Council and DERM to seal these documents and add them to the register?
Hopefully, we can start building mid-September *Fingers Crossed*.
Havent updated this for awhile so here I go.
Finance was approved up until the documents department got to the loan. They wanted the land subdivided before any building was to commence. They stated this was due to the LMI restrictions. I am still a little coy about all this mumbo jumbo, but anyway (perhaps someone can spell this out to me).
So we went ahead with the subdivision. I got onto the previous owners who had the original subdivision plan. They were hard to get hold of and had very poor communication skills. They wouldn't return my calls and eventually I gave up on them (I gave them 2 weeks of constantly calling them).
So I got the original Surveyors to draw up the plan again. Got it in the mail a couple of days ago, signed it and sent it back. It should currently be in with council. The surveyors tell me it could take up to 3 weeks for council to seal, and a further 3 weeks for DERM. The contributions fee was the real killer, approximately 19k. The financiers would provide the 19k, but this took my debt to above 1 mil, and apparently this means the LMI rate goes up substantially. Does anyone know what the current days in each of these organisations it is taking?
Anyway, the plumbing department of Toowoomba Council provided me a letter stating that the drawing for the plumbing needed some changes. I sent this immediately to the builder and the builder is currently running with the changes. This should have been rectified and I will ring the builder tomorrow to find out exactly how it has progressed.
Anyway, I got some questions some of you may be able to answer.
I've sent the plan of survey and a copy of the cheque to the financial company I am going through. Will the suffice, allowing the financial company to release funds for the build?
Does anyone know what the current days it takes for Toowoomba Council and DERM to seal these documents and add them to the register?
Hopefully, we can start building mid-September *Fingers Crossed*.
Already have got a builder, Suncrest Homes. Great bunch of lads to deal with.
The land has been bought and the duplex will be built on that, once the subdivision goes ahead.
I'm not in it for immediate cashflow, but so far it does look like it will be cashflow positive, if my figures are correct.
Update:
Finance has been approved for the purchase of the house and property. Finance is currently being discussed for the duplex. It looks like we will have to put a pretty hefty deposit for the construction, around 40k. Lucky we have funds
Should be getting the final plans tomorrow with quote for the building of the duplex. Fingers crossed under 300k.
Once settlement is achieved (18 Jun) we will start buildind ASAP.
Got a question for everyone? I'm looking at selling the house at the front of the block, but the land is yet to be subdivided. How much does a subdivide cost in Toowoomba. I'll need to start saving hahaha.
Have a good day and hopefully I'll have some nice plans to show you tomorrow.
Roachy
I chose Toowoomba mainly because its a city, its a growing community, the purchase price was cheap for the suburb it was in and I know a number of property developers up there who have made money in duplex, triplex and student accommodation. Also, Toowoomba shadows the Brisbane market and Im personally hoping that Brisbane prices will go up, since we are at the start of the proeprty cycle in Brisbane.
Hi Roachy,
Starting to have a read of your thread.
During this Reconfigure of a lot, did you have to get permission from your mortgage providers. Your assumption regarding council and derm seem right, but I had to get permission from my mortgage guys and this took 6 weeks for them to confirm!!
F
