Finders Fees.. Specific Performance Alarms

J

Joshwaly

Hi all,

I love the forum i love the way its split up...

But im sure ther are many forumites on the site that are students or are in the situation where they cant yet afford to invest... so they operate as a finder for investors, i speak as one of those people.

However my question lies in how the advice of a finder is taken.... can it be measured as proffesional advice, if the needs of the investor arent met is the finder liable for specific performance.... i am just curious as i have a number of potential clients however i am scared to give them advice as a finder, simply because of issues like specific performance, can an express term in a contract over ride the issue of performance???

any advice would be fantastic!

Regards Josh
 
Originally posted by Joshwaly
Hi all,

I love the forum i love the way its split up...

But im sure ther are many forumites on the site that are students or are in the situation where they cant yet afford to invest... so they operate as a finder for investors, i speak as one of those people.

However my question lies in how the advice of a finder is taken.... can it be measured as proffesional advice, if the needs of the investor arent met is the finder liable for specific performance.... i am just curious as i have a number of potential clients however i am scared to give them advice as a finder, simply because of issues like specific performance, can an express term in a contract over ride the issue of performance???

any advice would be fantastic!

Regards Josh
Click to expand...

Josh,

1. If you cant afford to invest, you wont be able to afford the professional indemnity insurance that think you might need?

2. If you cant afford to invest you have no assets anyway so who the hell is going to both suing you?

3. Just do it..
 
Josh,

By doing what you are proposing you are, in fact, acting as an estate agent, and must be properly licensed for this.

There is a fine, in VIC it's about 50k, for acting as an agent without a license.

Dunc, you are a dill, as usual. Your advise is flippant and dangerously stupid.

Don't be a waly, Josh.

Get a license, or get a job and start saving to invest.

asy :D
 
hmm some harsh advise so you cant find positive cash flow properties for people at a price legally and just for the record i do have a job i dont wanna a rep as a shmucky bum... but i also go to uni so i have commitments that dont allow me to work full time....

Thanks your advice tho!

Regards Josh
 
Originally posted by asy
Josh,

By doing what you are proposing you are, in fact, acting as an estate agent, and must be properly licensed for this.

There is a fine, in VIC it's about 50k, for acting as an agent without a license.

Dunc, you are a dill, as usual. Your advise is flippant and dangerously stupid.

Don't be a waly, Josh.

Get a license, or get a job and start saving to invest.

asy :D
Click to expand...

Asy,

Just what I'd expect from an Agent.. most of you guys do a 6 week TAFE course or something similar and then you're let loose on an unsuspecting population to bullsh_t about potential rent and capital gains as you guide unsuspecting consumers through open houses.. They lap up your advice, after all.. you're a REAL ESTATE AGENT..

If Josh can go out, find a great deal, bring it to the attention of an experienced investor and get paid a neat little finders fee then good on him. This is a recognised strategy for someone to break into the market and to gain valuable experience in the mean time.. overseas its referred to as Bird Dogging.. Google it, there's a wealth of advice available on it.. My quick read of the Victorian Act that covers Real Estate Agents doesn't suggest that such an activity would require someone to licence themself.

Your own advice is frankly crap and self-serving. It further serves to pigeon hole him in your own narrow view of how one should start their investing career... Your sum sage advice amounts to 1. Get a job.. 2. Get a licence.. 3. Start investing.. thats it? there's simply no other way.. Can you spell creative? Do you know the phrase that suggests "thinking outside of the square".

Agents like you all suffer from this lofty view of your own profession.. in reality, any dullard can list and sell a house in this market, from an Investors perspective I've never seen the value-add you appear to think you can bring to the table.

Go Josh!
 
Last edited:
Originally posted by duncan_m
Asy,

Just what I'd expect from an Agent.. most of you guys do a 6 week TAFE course or something similar and then you're let loose on an unsuspecting population to bullsh_t about potential rent and capital gains as you guide unsuspecting consumers through open houses.. They lap up your advice, after all.. you're a REAL ESTATE AGENT..

If Josh can go out, find a great deal, bring it to the attention of an experienced investor and get paid a neat little finders fee then good on him.

Your own advice is frankly crap and self-serving. It further serves to pigeon hole him in your own narrow view of how one should start their investing career... Agents like you all suffer from this lofty view of your own profession.. in reality, any dullard can list and sell a house in this market, from an Investors perspective I've never seen the value-add you appear to think you can bring to the table.

Go Josh!
Click to expand...

I beg your pardon...

For your information I have the FULL license, not the reps license, and have done a little more than a 6 week course. That is, however totally irrelevant in this case.

I don't really care whether you like agents or not, that's not the issue, the issue is that your advice to Josh was dangerously stupid. You are suggesting that he do something which is against the law.

Irrespective of what my view is of the profession, or any value which would or would not be added by an agent, it's a legal requirement for him to be licensed.

Josh, license or don't license. I have told you what my opinion is, and so has Dunc. It's up to you.

asy :D
 
Finder Fee... bullsh_t

Hi Duncan,


You said, "Just what I'd expect from an Agent.. most of you guys do a 6 week TAFE course or something similar and then you're let loose on an unsuspecting population to bullsh_t about potential rent and capital gains as you guide unsuspecting consumers through open houses.. They lap up your advice, after all.. you're a REAL ESTATE AGENT.. "

Hmmm... it's not that easy.

Most people are out of the industry in 3 months.



You said, "If Josh can go out, find a great deal, bring it to the attention of an experienced investor and get paid a neat little finders fee then good on him. "

Asy is correct. Legally, you need a real estate agent license.



You said, "Your own advice is frankly crap and self-serving. It further serves to pigeon hole him in your own narrow view of how one should start their investing career... Agents like you all suffer from this lofty view of your own profession.. in reality, any dullard can list and sell a house in this market, from an Investors perspective I've never seen the value-add you appear to think you can bring to the table."

Crap? Now that's a strong word.

Do you really know what you're talking about ?



You said, "Most of you guys do a 6 week TAFE course or something similar... blah blah blah."


Hmmm...

QC.RE (agency), Dip.Bus (real estate),
B.Bus (marketing), PGDip.Property (valuation)

Please do not generalise.... comment and contribute.

And please don't throw stones...


And I repeat... finder is illegal in Australia. (Get a real etate license, then... find all the property you want).
 
Fact: Unlicensed buyers agents are illegal in all states of Australia

Fact: When acting in a professional capacity,advising someone to act in an illegal way or giving poor advice leaves you open to court action (potentially both civil and criminal). Therefore professionals should ALWAYS have insurance.

Nothing else really needs to be said really.

Josh,

Good luck with your future. Note there are ways to buy property with no cash down - I suggest you investigate these avenues as well.

I am of the opinion that anyone acting as a buyer's agent should morally know the ins and outs of property investing. Have you ever inspected or bought property Josh? If not, go talk to some people in the industry and ask to learn from them. You'll then be able to give better advice, improve your customer service & be more successful.


Duncan, Asy is one of the good guys! If you dislike agents that much, get into share investing instead.

Cheers,

Aceyducey
 
Finder.... needs a r/e license

Hi Duncan,


You said, "Finder... This is a recognised strategy for someone to break into the market and to gain valuable experience in the mean time.. overseas its referred to as Bird Dogging.. Google it, there's a wealth of advice available on it..

True, that's teh US term. Just read flipping properties... But it doesn't make it legal in the US.


Yous aid, "My quick read of the Victorian Act that covers Real Estate Agents doesn't suggest that such an activity would require someone to licence themself."

Is that right...

Wow... you're the 102nd person to tell me that...

Please read a little closer... you'll find the answer...


"Unlicensed Finder = illegal in every state of Australia."



Search somersoft... i think we've argued this point about 10+ times over the last few years.
 
Originally posted by Aceyducey
Duncan, Asy is one of the good guys! If you dislike agents that much, get into share investing instead.
Click to expand...

I wasnt the one to start throwing strong language around.. everyone knows I dislike 99% of agents.. the whole industry is riddled with fraud and lack of ethics and I dont exclude the Agents who market themselves as ethical from this..

I'm sure Asy is a good guy..

If Josh has to do a course in order to bring deals to investors.. so be it.. I bow to the greater wisdom of Asy and Ross..

DUncan.
 
Re: Finder.... needs a r/e license

Originally posted by Ross Sondergeld
Hi Duncan,
True, that's teh US term. Just read flipping properties... But it doesn't make it legal in the US.
Click to expand...


Ross..

I think flipping and bird-dogging are two seperate strategies.. Flipping involves securing a property, maybe even settling on it.. then on-selling for good profit.. Bird Dogging, from my understanding, you can just find the property.. bring it to the attention of an Investor and take a small fee....
 
Bow or kick in teeth...

Hi,


Duncan said, "I bow to the greater wisdom of Asy and Ross.."


Thank you.

I appreciate a bow. And asy... also acknowledges your appreciation of our greatwe knowledge... ;)


I'm used to getting kicked in the teeth... spat on... and walked all over... (Wow... it's great to be a real estate agent on the god coast. Imagine 1 agent for every 100 properties.)


Relax... duncan.... you need to take it easy buddy.
 
Re: Re: Finder.... needs a r/e license

Originally posted by duncan_m
Ross..

I think flipping and bird-dogging are two seperate strategies.. Flipping involves securing a property, maybe even settling on it.. then on-selling for good profit.. Bird Dogging, from my understanding, you can just find the property.. bring it to the attention of an Investor and take a small fee....
Click to expand...

Dunc is right here...

Flipping is COMPLETELY differrent from Bird-dogging...

Flipping is totally legal, without any licenses. You can do it to your heart's content...

The other isn't legal without a license.. Nuff said...

asy :D
 
Wow - some more heated debate.

On agents study...

In NSW the FULL license is done in 12 weeks full time.

There has just been a change but from my memory if you want to do it part time its now 6months part time (one day a week) plus 3month additional work after completion. (It was previously 12months part time one day a week)

I can only comment on NSW

On finders fees...

Its also illegal to fudge figures on a loan application, in the end without having a licence you are breaking the law (hence why all buyers agents/advocates have to be licenced) it depends how you go about it whether you get caught. (forgetting the moral implications and the fact your stealing [honest] agents $$$)
 
Originally posted by XBenX

On finders fees...

Its also illegal to fudge figures on a loan application, in the end without having a licence you are breaking the law (hence why all buyers agents/advocates have to be licenced) it depends how you go about it whether you get caught. (forgetting the moral implications and the fact your stealing [honest] agents $$$)
Click to expand...

Err.. what has fudging figures on a Loan Application got to do with paying a few dollars to someone who has pointed out a great property deal to you?
 
Hi All

As an investor I really don't care how a property is brought to my attention and whether there is an agent involved that the person has used to find a property or whether he has approached the owner directly. If the deal stacks up then I will buy the property, indirectly pay the agents commission and pay a finders fee to my spotters.

The last deal cost me $15k on top of the agents price but made me $630k within 4 months. Would not have been in a position to move except for my "finder".

I, unfortunately also have a very low opinion of realestate agents as for the money they charge they add very little to the deal and at times obstruct the deal for their own ends.

Cheers
 
Hey Aceyducey,

I sent a private message and was unsure if you recieved it but i m curious of your no money down loan an email about it would be mmmmuuuccchley appreciated

P.S my situation student casual worker started working 4 weeks ago minimal savings... how creative can one be...

:(

Kind regards

Josh
 
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