Green Title / Freehold Subdivision - Perth

OK Guys - todays dumb questions
i am a complete newbie to property development and am struggling to grasp the process involved

last month we got approval from WAPC to subdivide our property in perth into 2 green title blocks - subject to completion of satisfactory conditions...

these are the conditions - what do they mean in english?:

1) Water corp sewerage and water connections (is this headworks?)
2) Western power underground electrical supply (again assume this is headworks?)
3) removal of existing shed, garage, carport and pool (speak to local council and see if i need a demo permit?)
4) filling in and stabilising block and earing with stormwater (soakwells?)
5) apply to local council for crossover (assume this means getting the curb lowered?)
6) bring existing house (being retained) up to code - (so assume i have to a speak to the local council and find out what they need?)
7)All buildings having the necessary clearance from the new boundaries as requested (does this refer to the planned house having correct setbacks and distance from the boundary?)


so on a freehold / green title subdivision what is the process?

1) find a suitable plot
2) contour and feature survey
3) stage 1 application to WAPC for subdivisin approval
4) come up with a design for the block - talk to developers / builders
5) organise trades to renovate existing house (get licence to erect carport / garage and driveway)
5) organise trades to remove outbuildings and level the site
6) meet conditions imposed by WAPC
7) get surveyors to liaise with utilities for connections
8) Deposited plan to be submitted to Landgate
9) submission of form 1C and applicable fees to WAPC to endorse plan along with confirmation that conditions have been met
10) start building?


so questions:

1) how much work has to be completed before construction begins?
2) does the headworks need to be done? and the fences?
3) at what stage are seperate titles issued?
4) does the builder require seperate titles to start building?
5) when does the builder get the building licence?
6) at what stage do i need to advise the bank (mortgage holder) that i am doing a subdivision?
7) what happens with finance? - assuming the existing / retained dwelling is going to loose some of its value - at what stage will the banks want to re-value?
8) is it wise to approach existing bank to get construction loan?
9) do all subdivision costs come out of my pocket or can the construction loan cover some of these costs aswell?
10) if the construction loan is say 90% of build cost - at what stage to i pay out my 10%?
11) what is the time frame for each stage?


so many questions i know..... just trying to wrap my head around it all
any help would be greatly appreciated :)
think I need a mentor before i royally screw this all up
 
OK Guys - todays dumb questions
i am a complete newbie to property development and am struggling to grasp the process involved

last month we got approval from WAPC to subdivide our property in perth into 2 green title blocks - subject to completion of satisfactory conditions...

these are the conditions - what do they mean in english?:

1) Water corp sewerage and water connections (is this headworks?)yes about 7k plus all the drainage to the new lot
2) Western power underground electrical supply (again assume this is headworks?)No thats a power dome. Usually around the 1400 mark. Speak to western power
3) removal of existing shed, garage, carport and pool (speak to local council and see if i need a demo permit?)yes speak to council, you will need to provide something to say the pool has been removed and compacted correctly
4) filling in and stabilising block and earing with stormwater (soakwells?)
5) apply to local council for crossover (assume this means getting the curb lowered?)that means a new crossover to council spec
6) bring existing house (being retained) up to code - (so assume i have to a speak to the local council and find out what they need?)yes. Could be render, paint, landscaping etc
7)All buildings having the necessary clearance from the new boundaries as requested (does this refer to the planned house having correct setbacks and distance from the boundary?) yes, part of the design


so on a freehold / green title subdivision what is the process?

1) find a suitable plot
2) contour and feature survey
3) stage 1 application to WAPC for subdivisin approval
4) come up with a design for the block - talk to developers / builders
5) organise trades to renovate existing house (get licence to erect carport / garage and driveway)
5) organise trades to remove outbuildings and level the site
6) meet conditions imposed by WAPC
7) get surveyors to liaise with utilities for connections
8) Deposited plan to be submitted to Landgate
9) submission of form 1C and applicable fees to WAPC to endorse plan along with confirmation that conditions have been met
10) start building?


so questions:

1) how much work has to be completed before construction begins?
2) does the headworks need to be done? and the fences?not until you want them to sign off for subdivision
3) at what stage are seperate titles issued?when all conditions are apprkved and signed off on it goes back to wapc to approve and issue titles
4) does the builder require seperate titles to start building?no
5) when does the builder get the building licence?After you sign the contract and they apply for it
6) at what stage do i need to advise the bank (mortgage holder) that i am doing a subdivision?sooner the better
7) what happens with finance? - assuming the existing / retained dwelling is going to loose some of its value - at what stage will the banks want to re-value?First up aspart of construction loan and the after if you want to split the loan
8) is it wise to approach existing bank to get construction loan? yes or fefinance to another lender if needed
9) do all subdivision costs come out of my pocket or can the construction loan cover some of these costs aswell?cash or equity, some can go in contract but you will be charged gst and might come off the valuation
10) if the construction loan is say 90% of build cost - at what stage to i pay out my 10%?at the first progress payment
11) what is the time frame for each stage?it varys alot


so many questions i know..... just trying to wrap my head around it all
any help would be greatly appreciated :)
think I need a mentor before i royally screw this all up

Hope this helps.
 
OK Guys - todays dumb questions
i am a complete newbie to property development and am struggling to grasp the process involved[/quote]
Not at all. Actually really good questions, and it looks like you have a pretty good grasp of the process too.

6) bring existing house (being retained) up to code - (so assume i have to a speak to the local council and find out what they need?)7)All buildings having the necessary clearance from the new boundaries as requested (does this refer to the planned house having correct setbacks and distance from the boundary?)
For a green title, there may not be too much you have to do to bring the house up to code, just check with council. For boundary clearances, you would need to make sure the new boundaries don't make the existing house non-compliant with setback requirements. i.e. the back new lot boundary should not be so close to the existing house that the existing house would not comply with setback requirements after subdivision.

1) how much work has to be completed before construction begins?
The area where you are building would need to be cleared. That's about all you need to do to start construction.
2) does the headworks need to be done? and the fences?
Fences don't need to be done to start construction but the builder will need access to water and power quite early in the process
3) at what stage are seperate titles issued?
It's a bit up to you. You can apply to have titles before you start construction, during construction or even years later. Having two houses on one title or two houses on two titles will affect your banks valuation of the land. Also, it's best to apply for titles before your condition approval expires unless you want to pay for another subdivision!
4) does the builder require seperate titles to start building?
No.
8) is it wise to approach existing bank to get construction loan?
If they offer you a good deal. Otherwise speak to your mortgage broker to see if they can find you a better deal.
9) do all subdivision costs come out of my pocket or can the construction loan cover some of these costs aswell?
I am funding my subdivision costs from a loan taken out over another property.


so many questions i know..... just trying to wrap my head around it all any help would be greatly appreciated :)
think I need a mentor before i royally screw this all up
Seems like you are on the right track. Just keep posting questions if you are unsure about something.
 
Most has been answered above but you could also do built strata. Where you build everything (including the work on the existing house) then apply to WAPC for the titles.

There are pros and cons to this.

Make sure you do nothing to the existing house without permission from the bank. It is their asset (pretty much) and they will need approve all changes to it
 
Most has been answered above but you could also do built strata. Where you build everything (including the work on the existing house) then apply to WAPC for the titles.
Local governments do built stratas now, so you don't need to deal with WAPC. You can apply for a built strata once your development reaches plate height.
 
I just split 2 blocks (corner lot) into 2 strata survey lots, used The Land Division, Joel. All costs involved came in at $52,000, however this included $18,000 demolition costs and $5200 fencing.

Was advised that it would have cost me an extra $10,000 if I went green title.

Joel should be able to provide you with a quote outlining all the costs involved including government charges etc.

MTR:)
 
I just split 2 blocks (corner lot) into 2 strata survey lots, used The Land Division, Joel. All costs involved came in at $52,000, however this included $18,000 demolition costs and $5200 fencing.
Did you have to do much drain and fill? To create two lots behind my existing house in Cloverdale, including site works, drain and fill and all other associated costs has a provisional sum of $80,000. Of course the actual costs could be lower.
 
Similar costings to what HD ACE has posted, however as mentioned I demolished a house and erected fencing, so buyers could clearly see each site.

No retaining, I just did not do it, the buyers can pay for this one as part of their builds I guess. It did get raised by buyers that the block was not completely flat, but I did not see this as my issue when on selling land.

Drainage/retaining $80K wow that's huge.

MTR
 
Local governments do built stratas now, so you don't need to deal with WAPC. You can apply for a built strata once your development reaches plate height.

Sorry I did use wrong term there - council then landgate do titles.

I'd be surprised anyone could/would apply at plate height because the conditions won't have been met yet - no crossovers etc. I've always done mine after then used lot sync to have the titles done. I'm curious as to how you can do it at plate height.
 
Thanks for all your responses guys

i have already applied and been approved for a freehold subdivision
so surely if we decided to build and then subdivide (built strata?) then that would mean having to reapply under built strata and pay fees again? and wait another 3 months for approval?
doesnt sound like a very good idea now that the ball is rolling on the green title subdivision

have approached my mortgage broker this morning - she is going to inform MacQuarie (mortgage holder) of my intentions to subdivide and seeking pre-approval for a construction loan ... will also be talking to ANZ in the next few days and see if i can top up my line of credit by getting my PPOR revalued again (to pay for subdivision)

suppose there is no point in putting the cart before the horse and talking to builders and architects until i know i can afford to do the subdivision.... it was a complete pain in the *** (and long winded to boot) getting preapproval for the mortgage last time as we are both self -employeed

so steps 1-4 should be?

1) advise bank of intentions
2) seek construction loan
3) find cash to do subdivision
4) approach builders
5) then meet conditions
 
Sorry I did use wrong term there - council then landgate do titles.

I'd be surprised anyone could/would apply at plate height because the conditions won't have been met yet - no crossovers etc. I've always done mine after then used lot sync to have the titles done. I'm curious as to how you can do it at plate height.
Plate height is for preliminary approval which I think is then valid for 2 years. You can't go to title until you have cleared all of your conditions, so it would depend on what they are. I don't remember a crossover condition on a strata title approval, but then I haven't seen many so YMMV.

This is because of Belmont's scheme where they can't support subdivision above R30 in a split coded area unless development has reached plate height. That means no freehold, no survey strata and no strata preliminary approvals until development has substantially commenced. The only reason I would apply at plate height is to get the approval process over earlier in the build rather than waiting until at the end and then being held up by Council.
 
doesnt sound like a very good idea now that the ball is rolling on the green title subdivision
Personally, I like green titles so if that suits your investment strategy it sounds like the way to go.

it was a complete pain in the *** (and long winded to boot) getting preapproval for the mortgage last time as we are both self -employeed
Ugh! Yes! My partner is self employed and it is a PITA

so steps 1-4 should be?

1) advise bank of intentions
2) seek construction loan
3) find cash to do subdivision
4) approach builders
5) then meet conditions
Basically yes, but there is no harm starting to talk to builders now. You can tell them you have preliminary approval and don't have to disclose anything further. The reason you might want to start earlier is that it is quite a process to select a builder. I have just gone through the process and it did take some time.
 
Regarding bringing the old house up to code, this could get complex. If an existing wall suddenly acts as the boundary/parapet, you could need a fair bit of work done to make it compliant.

Then your HWS would need minimum clearance. Meterbox location could be an issue. Eaves on existing home will need to maintain good clearance from new lot and so on.

It all depends on how the new lot affects the existing. The above is worst case scenario, but make sure whoever you are dealing with knows their stuff.
 
if you want to go survey strata to green and there is works to be done such as building mods, do you need consent from both owners to proceed? is it possible that one party could prevent the conversion happening?
 
Regarding bringing the old house up to code, this could get complex. If an existing wall suddenly acts as the boundary/parapet, you could need a fair bit of work done to make it compliant.

Then your HWS would need minimum clearance. Meterbox location could be an issue. Eaves on existing home will need to maintain good clearance from new lot and so on.

It all depends on how the new lot affects the existing. The above is worst case scenario, but make sure whoever you are dealing with knows their stuff.
That's not worst case. The worst I have seen is a partial house demo to achieve boundary clearances. Mine is bad enough where I have to demo the veranda because it intrudes into the proposed Lot 2.

I imagine this has been taken into account with the design of the subdivision.

From memory, the main things for bringing a single house up to code would be:
1) boundary setbacks
2) access (new crossover may be required)
3) car parking (two car bays will be required)
4) minimum outdoor living area as per the codes
 
if you want to go survey strata to green and there is works to be done such as building mods, do you need consent from both owners to proceed? is it possible that one party could prevent the conversion happening?
Probably worth starting your own thread for this one.
 
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