How much do you need to live every year?

[jaycee]

Those that can should be required to put in a registered amount of volunteer work, ie. councils - helping elderly, assisting the public, assisting generally in community services.


Weg,

Perhaps all I'm suggesting is you possibly shold be prefixing the above sentence with "In my view.." or "My opnion is..." rahter than stating it as if it s fact, which auotmatically puts people in the position of being wrong.

I didnt mean your posts started fights ro called peopel name, I said" What';s the point of pointing fingers and calling people names (direclty or indirectly calling them names besdies causing fights with people ?
ggested a better way is to stand up for & pioneer the chane one beleives in so storngly instead - but of cousrse, that;' too hard.

If it's too hard, then perhaps there is mare to th esituation thenthan the explantion offered so far, I mean, others agree with you, but it still hasn't been done - I wonder why that is ?

 

[Sunfish]

It's just a natural biological function of being human

Kids are dumb too. Know any who can use a slide rule or logarithms? Or calculate the approximate price of a number of items with discount applied in their head?

 

[Wunderbar]

Kids are dumb too. Know any who can use a slide rule or logarithms? Or calculate the approximate price of a number of items with discount applied in their head?

Heh it makes me laugh when I see people my age reach out for a calculator for a simple calculation.

 

[Sunfish]

I said burden, not rorting... btw, the term most often used when discussing pensions and the over 67's.

Read the passage again Weg: Gregory says the notion there will be masses of people forced to work another two years full-time after age 65 is not correct. "If you take men aged between 60 and 64, only about 45 per cent have a full-time job. That's the average, so the number at 64 would be much lower," he says.

Mr Gregory made no claims that the other 55% are rorting or, in your words "a burden" on society. It is known that some of this group are on a disability pension but not all. He said, quite reasonably, that only a small number of the group of men mentioned will ACTUALLY remain in the workforce for another two years. Both my wife and I worked past our pension age and I dislike finger-pointing.

 

[kathryn d]

Weg,
I agree with you.
My MIL is her late 60's and works fulltime-12 hour shifts.

You nor I will be able to convince anyone that able bodied people should be required to work for their dole.
There are lots of jobs out there..most just don't want to do them.

Seems some people who are on disability pension claim they can't work.I'm sure there is something they can do.

I think the same about prisons.Have them be self sufficient.
Take away priveldges if they don't work.

 

[Wunderbar]

Yeah better put those people in debtor's prison back to work too so they can pay off their debts

 

[jaycee]

Yeah better put those people in debtor's prison back to work too so they can pay off their debts

And take away their privelleges too - don't make a profit, don't get fed.

Can't pay their bill - chop off the electricity used to for the srcurty system to amek sure that prisoners dont escape

Some fo these "tough stance" suggestions appear to me to be reminiscent of what the big bad and terrible communist dictators did which we in the western decmocratic non propaganda using world were better than.

 

[weg]

Sunfish, I agree with the man, but have gone one further to say the system should work at getting those people who are able to work, working (just as you would the young unemployed), hence reducing the years dependent of welfare. I did say excluding those on a disability pension.

My 'finger pointing' and 'burden' so to speak is with a system that ignores other areas of the welfare system but keeps referring to the over 67's as a burden.

I'm not advocating cutting peoples dole, nor am I insinuating this group of unemployed are bludgers (they would exist but are the minority).

Jaycee, there are already incentives around to get people to keep working, but most are hardly incentives. Far better to have a few good ones and have an employer, employee and country benefitting.

Obviously people have differing views. You might see helping and encouraging people back to work as a ball and chain affair, whereas I see it as helping people to help themselves, while they can, as a good thing and getting those that recieve help to give back with voluntary or community work as the right thing to do.

 

[Deltaberry]

And take away their privelleges too - don't make a profit, don't get fed.

Can't pay their bill - chop off the electricity used to for the srcurty system to amek sure that prisoners dont escape

Some fo these "tough stance" suggestions appear to me to be reminiscent of what the big bad and terrible communist dictators did which we in the western decmocratic non propaganda using world were better than.

Democratic indeed, just like Guantanamo Bay
Propaganda, America the champion of...

 

[kathryn d]

I watched the British show today "Yes, Prime Minister".
Extremely interesting.The aide to the Prime Minister went on a radio talk show talking about the problem of unemployment. While he dodged the answer while he thought he was being recorded, off the record he stated if the government really wanted to do something about unemployment it could be reduced 50% overnight. He stated if a dole recipient rejected 2 job offers they would be cut off. Problem solved.

I suppose the bleeding hearts do-gooders would disagree with this.
Of course the people who think prisoners shouldn't work for their keep and people shouldn't honor their debts will be in this group.

 

[tom32]

I watched the British show today "Yes, Prime Minister".
Extremely interesting.The aide to the Prime Minister went on a radio talk show talking about the problem of unemployment. While he dodged the answer while he thought he was being recorded, off the record he stated if the government really wanted to do something about unemployment it could be reduced 50% overnight. He stated if a dole recipient rejected 2 job offers they would be cut off. Problem solved.

I suppose the bleeding hearts do-gooders would disagree with this.
Of course the people who think prisoners shouldn't work for their keep and people shouldn't honor their debts will be in this group.

In Australia we would sack the public servant who did that...

Look at NSW first there was an incompetant government. Then over time as they weeded out anyone in the public service with a backbone and brains they ended up with a completely useless situation NSW has been in for the last few years.

 

[jaycee]

Democratic indeed, just like Guantanamo Bay
Propaganda, America the champion of...

Geoffw, is it ok for me to say I gagree with this post or is that offensive as well ????????????

I belevie Americans are capable fo human mistakes, cause I can credit them with being human.

I hope that non offensive enough to you Geoff that it can remain

 

[jaycee]

I watched the British show today "Yes, Prime Minister".
Extremely interesting.The aide to the Prime Minister went on a radio talk show talking about the problem of unemployment. While he dodged the answer while he thought he was being recorded, off the record he stated if the government really wanted to do something about unemployment it could be reduced 50% overnight. He stated if a dole recipient rejected 2 job offers they would be cut off. Problem solved.

I suppose the bleeding hearts do-gooders would disagree with this.
Of course the people who think prisoners shouldn't work for their keep and people shouldn't honor their debts will be in this group.

I suppose it went over kathryn's head that the show is a comedy
Why do you take such delight in belittling nbad laughing at people who dont; share your view kathryn, ?

It's hard to listen to you and think about wha tyou say seriously when you do this.

 

[tom32]

I suppose it went over kathryn's head that the show is a comedy

I look through the lens of yes minister for all my thoughts on government policy.

My favourite was the tax on smoking when Humphrey explains to him that if they tax tobacco, while they will save in medical expenses think about what it will cost the government in pensions if people stopped smoking!

 

[kathryn d]

I suppose it went over kathryn's head that the show is a comedy
Why do you take such delight in belittling nbad laughing at people who dont; share your view kathryn, ?

It's hard to listen to you and think about wha tyou say seriously when you do this.

Cause I'm a happy person
This show may be a comedy, doesn't make what the show is telling untrue.
You seem to take great delight in disecting my posts.
Would you like it better, if I said something I don't agree with?

Unemployed individuals may generate a lot of jobs..albeit government ones.
However, stimulating the economy makes more.


Where I used to work, there were some who played the system, and took as much medical leave as possible. When it ran out, they were given a choice of either coming back to work or face termination of employment. They came back to work.

Unfortuneatly most governments don't have a backbone. They do what is popular and what will get them re-elected.

 

[jaycee]

I look through the lens of yes minister for all my thoughts on government policy.

My favourite was the tax on smoking when Humphrey explains to him that if they tax tobacco, while they will save in medical expenses think about what it will cost the government in pensions if people stopped smoking!

Yeah it's "so funny cause it's true" znd all that, but it is still a comedy

Surely dumb idiots like me who stand in the way of kathryn's view of the world and how it should be aren;t actually strong enogh to stop kathruyn and the likeminded folk from impelemtning the chagnes they knwo are right for the world ?

Why then haven't the oh so good suggeestions been implemented ?

Don't tell me cause people like kathryn who know better, listen to idiots like me ?

 

[kathryn d]

Yeah it's "so funny cause it's true" znd all that, but it is still a comedy

Surely dumb idiots like me who stand in the way of kathryn's view of the world and how it should be aren;t actually strong enogh to stop kathruyn and the likeminded folk from impelemtning the chagnes they knwo are right for the world ?

Why then haven't the oh so good suggeestions been implemented ?

Don't tell me cause people like kathryn who know better, listen to idiots like me ?

Just means more people like me need to vote and/or run for office.
I never called you any names..you called yourself a dumb idiot.

 

[tom32]

Yeah it's "so funny cause it's true" znd all that, but it is still a comedy

Surely dumb idiots like me who stand in the way of kathryn's view of the world and how it should be aren;t actually strong enogh to stop kathruyn and the likeminded folk from impelemtning the chagnes they knwo are right for the world ?

Why then haven't the oh so good suggeestions been implemented ?

Don't tell me cause people like kathryn who know better, listen to idiots like me ?

Don't get me wrong, I am with you about welfare. There has to be a safety net. At present the net is less than the aged pension which we know is probably too low to live so it is not something anyone would choose to be on unless they were really that way inclined. What do you do with these people? Frankly I'd rather the government pay them off than have to employ them!

 

[herewego]

"One of the things I keep learning is that the secret of being happy is doing things for other people" - Dick Gregory

Are there really so many of us on this forum stuffing our pockets with retirement buffering dollars and thinking so little of those people in our world who could really do with some of our help. These 3rd world countries that some were talking about as great retirement opportunities can also benefit SO SO much from our efforts as volunteers in health and education programs where you can give a few months of your time each year to TRULY give something back of what you have earned (or is that "taken"?) Same applies right here in Oz too!

You will earn no money but you will have no expenses either and you will receive a king's ransom in life experience.

My wife is a social worker here in australia and I am a tradie with some construction experience and we plan this sort of retirement in 10 yrs or so, but with up to 6 months/year of volunteer work. I honestly can't wait!!!

Please think about this as a way of reducing your necessary retirement fund and earning a lot in "returns"....

 

[jaycee]

Cause I'm a happy person
This show may be a comedy, doesn't make what the show is telling untrue.
You seem to take great delight in disecting my posts.
Would you like it better, if I said something I don't agree with?

Unemployed individuals may generate a lot of jobs..albeit government ones.
However, stimulating the economy makes more.


Where I used to work, there were some who played the system, and took as much medical leave as possible. When it ran out, they were given a choice of either coming back to work or face termination of employment. They came back to work.

Unfortuneatly most governments don't have a backbone. They do what is popular and what will get them re-elected.

Cause quirkiness of behaviour is a human trait that can't be ignored I guess as well.

Even the stockmarket analysts knwo that one force they cant; measure is human behaviour

Over time our systems of government end up encompassing things to try and cater for some of these things (like say medical assistance to someone who hurt himself through some form of self harm, or the dole or whatever else ) cause that's what we need.

Now... nowhere did I suggest such implemented systems are perfect. Bu Ijsut doubt that a 'robotic' (for lack of a creative mind) rule type of system would work.