I pay super profits tax why not miners

I pay 30 % tax , if I work a few hours overtime or a second job ( super profit ) pay 40-45 % .
I also pay a hefty mortgage

The miners pay base rate 17 % on 10 million or 10 billion profit on a non renewable resource that doesn't have to be exploited in this generation .
Is that fair ?
 
I pay 30 % tax , if I work a few hours overtime or a second job ( super profit ) pay 40-45 % .
I also pay a hefty mortgage

The miners pay base rate 17 % on 10 million or 10 billion profit on a non renewable resource that doesn't have to be exploited in this generation .
Is that fair ?

No, but they are taking the bigger risks, as are all business owners, and therefore must be given some incentives, otherwise no-one will run a business in this country.

And think about this; while you are complaining about your 30% tax rate, remember that in this country we enjoy every PAID public holiday under the sun and then some, we get 17.5% loading for being away from work having a bludge, and we get paid sick and maternity leave, long service leave and employer contributed super payments.

Shall I continue?
 
I pay 30 % tax , if I work a few hours overtime or a second job ( super profit ) pay 40-45 % .
I also pay a hefty mortgage

The miners pay base rate 17 % on 10 million or 10 billion profit on a non renewable resource that doesn't have to be exploited in this generation .
Is that fair ?

Are you comparing the tax on high profits to the sliding scale of income tax rates ? The odd thing about it for me is that it applies only to miners, not anyone who makes such a profit strange.. That said, I've only heard the "propaganda" from both the govt and the miners anyway, nowhere near enough to confidently pretend I know what Im talking about in person, so I won't pretend I udnerstand it any better here.

Also, when do you pay 45% as a PAYG wage earner these days ?
 
I pay 30 % tax , if I work a few hours overtime or a second job ( super profit ) pay 40-45 % .
I also pay a hefty mortgage

The miners pay base rate 17 % on 10 million or 10 billion profit on a non renewable resource that doesn't have to be exploited in this generation .
Is that fair ?

No I don't think it is fair. Neither is it going to be fair when billions of dollars worth of investment moves overseas, depriving thousands of Australian jobs, impacting the budget revenue, economy in general and everything else that comes along with country that is not safe for foreign investments.

None of the economists and politicians who support the tax have any knowledge of the risks, money that gets poured into projects. It is very easy to sit in an air-con office and say WOW...look how much money the mining industries are making it's not fair. We will whack not 10%, not 20%, not 30% but 40% Super tax on top of company tax rate that every business already pays.

The rules have been you pay 30% company tax minus any legitimate deductible expenses + royalties. The mining companies say OK fair enough, we know the rules we will take the risk pour in billions in an effort to make a profit, if we lose those billions as project turns bad that is our money gone foreever! But fortunately, by doing the right things and bit of luck they start making a lot of money and the Government says hey dude, I have just decided to change the rules! It shouldn't be that way.

How would you feel if you negotiated your salary with your boss only to be told 6 months later. Look man, I reckon you earn a lot more so this is what I am going to do...Reduce your pay by 15%. That is called changing rules mid way. If you think that's not right then even the RSPT is not right.

Cheers,
Oracle.
 
No I don't think it is fair. Neither is it going to be fair when billions of dollars worth of investment moves overseas, depriving thousands of Australian jobs, impacting the budget revenue, economy in general and everything else that comes along with country that is not safe for foreign investments.

None of the economists and politicians who support the tax have any knowledge of the risks, money that gets poured into projects. It is very easy to sit in an air-con office and say WOW...look how much money the mining industries are making it's not fair. We will whack not 10%, not 20%, not 30% but 40% Super tax on top of company tax rate that every business already pays.

The rules have been you pay 30% company tax minus any legitimate deductible expenses + royalties. The mining companies say OK fair enough, we know the rules we will take the risk pour in billions in an effort to make a profit, if we lose those billions as project turns bad that is our money gone foreever! But fortunately, by doing the right things and bit of luck they start making a lot of money and the Government says hey dude, I have just decided to change the rules! It shouldn't be that way.

How would you feel if you negotiated your salary with your boss only to be told 6 months later. Look man, I reckon you earn a lot more so this is what I am going to do...Reduce your pay by 15%. That is called changing rules mid way. If you think that's not right then even the RSPT is not right.

Cheers,
Oracle.

I've heard sales commissions being reviewed for sales staff. (just saying !)
 
I pay 30 % tax , if I work a few hours overtime or a second job ( super profit ) pay 40-45 % .
I also pay a hefty mortgage

The miners pay base rate 17 % on 10 million or 10 billion profit on a non renewable resource that doesn't have to be exploited in this generation .
Is that fair ?

I suspect that you are quoting the populace figures in this case. Company tax is 30%. If they don't pay 30% on gross profits after depreciation deductions etc then they are breaking the tax laws and the tax man is not gentle.

This 17% in all likelyhood is based on the tax paid as a percentage of turnover or at best gross before the legitimate deductions - a different kettle of fish.

The price miners pay for the non renewable part is called a royalty. If the Government wants more then increase the royalty.

Cheers
 
But Andy, how woudl increasign the rolayt, payable curently to state governments (?), provide more income to the federal government ;) hmmmmmm
 
in my opinion they should just increase the export duty on all the resources

force them to process it all here and sell a product rather than raw materials
 
I pay 30 % tax , if I work a few hours overtime or a second job ( super profit ) pay 40-45 % .
I also pay a hefty mortgage

The miners pay base rate 17 % on 10 million or 10 billion profit on a non renewable resource that doesn't have to be exploited in this generation .
Is that fair ?

yes.

because you're not set up using correct tax structures to legally minimise your tax.

therefore, you'll be taxed on a sliding scale.
 
Even if it weren't fair Neil, in my mind you're saying "The goverment is F'ing me up the A, so why shouldn't they F everyone else up the A also?"

Just because something isn't fair doesn't mean they should make things equally sh** for everyone.

A flat tax on everything and everyone is probably the only fair way to go, but that'll never happen.

-Ian
 
Just because something isn't fair doesn't mean they should make things equally sh** for everyone.

Not everyone..... just the miners.... :p
 
hubby works for a mining/steel company and they are very concerned at this new tax (internal memo's). having just spent $40mil on upgrading one of their steel facilities in a remote location supporting a town of 30,000. if they have to pay a much higher tax on the ore that they dig out of the ground themselves to feed the facility, then it is a non-viable, loss making, non-competitive (with china/india) facility and will have to be written off and closed.

then we would buy the value added product in from china instead.

goodbye jobs, goodbye town, goodbye wasted investment.
 
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it was meant to be this way - consume less, pay less tax.

It'd work great, but low income earners would need to be compensated. There's a certain level of spending that really can't be avoided and a higher GST at the expense of income tax (which currently offers tax-free thresholds and low-income offsets) would hurt a lot of people who currently don't pay much of the latter. Perhaps it could be balanced with tax-free payments from the government for people under a certain income threshold. It would be an interesting study to see where such a balance could fit.
 
It'd work great, but low income earners would need to be compensated. There's a certain level of spending that really can't be avoided and a higher GST at the expense of income tax (which currently offers tax-free thresholds and low-income offsets) would hurt a lot of people who currently don't pay much of the latter. Perhaps it could be balanced with tax-free payments from the government for people under a certain income threshold. It would be an interesting study to see where such a balance could fit.

yeah that is a serious problem, because the lower earners pretty much consume the same stuff as higher earners in day to day situations.

it would be interesting....maybe under a certain threshold, income tax could be forfeited by the govt to make it come together, or a smaller - more concentrated - sliding scale for income tax.

doubling GST revenue in a swap for lower income earners income tax could well be the answer the get rid of ALL other taxes to do with consumption.
 
The price miners pay for the non renewable part is called a royalty. If the Government wants more then increase the royalty.

Cheers

Ahhh but Handy, that wouldn't help Swan plug his deficit now would it? ;)

I pay super tax, why not banks? banks are useless leaches on society anyway

Ok Ausprop, let's shut down every bank in Australia and see how far society gets. :rolleyes: (Unless you're being sarcastic? :confused:)
 
I don't mind if the miners have to pay more tax especially in boom times when they get record prices for their commodities.

However, the problem I see with the whole scheme is that the govt will provide relief for companies that are making losses. The problem with that is that we will be bailing out loss making miners in at a time when the whole country will most likely be struggling as well.

This will have a much more devastating impact on this country's economic future than anything we have seen in the past.

The govt is too focused on painting a rosy future for the future of the mining industry to realize that every thing works in cycles and sooner or later the mining bubble will burst.
 
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