I pay super profits tax why not miners

i'm saying that if someone is genuinely interested in finding out the real percentage they need to do their own research and calculations, and shouldn't believe someone who holds a financial interest in the subject ;)
 
it's surprising how some people call themselves investors but don't know simple math :rolleyes: (not directed at you Ausprop, but the author of the paper)

in the first example the guy gives the numbers are:



Now i've highlighted the important bits.

In the first part of calculation, where he calculates profit before tax, he includes royalty. Then in the calculation of total tax he uses the same amount as a base for calculating percentage, which already had royalty subtracted. And then includes royalty again in the percentage.

So the real percentage of overall tax should've been 38% with the current tax rate.

How do you end up getting the $15 mil to be 8%? The total tax paid is still the 57 mil and they get to keep 86 mil (123 - 37)

In the example with new proposed structure we see the same mistake again. If you add the super tax and royalty back onto the base to get same 138m before tax profit, you will see that the percentage is not 64% but 57%

This perfectly shows how interested people can manipulate those who don't bother to do their own calculations.

As per my embedded question.

Cheers
 
Getting back to the Neils Original Question

I think the idealogy of taking this on a personal level on current earnt income isnt realistic, but then my view might not be either

A more realistic(?) view may that you tax adviser comes back to you and says,,,,,,,,,,geeze mate the ATO is turning the tax scales back to mid 80s, where the top rate was more than 50 )?) , and we have re assessed your numbers from ur last 5 years income.

But dont worry, the ATO will only want some of this money from when you earn more than the minimum wage.

I hear some of the advertising on the radio in favour of the tax and it talks about a fairer and better system and improving the way the system is taxed, and how this will will improve our long term future, and putting money back into the communities that make the dollars. Doesnt work with fuel excise or tobbaco excise now ?

All good and well, the GST was similarly polarising.

I xpect that there is no way the tax will get up in the way its currently put together.............and I can really see the WA and QLd State govs sitting on the sidelines while their income base is urther eroded.

The Carbon Tax idealogy was a more broad based way to distribute welfare. That wasnt going to come off so now we will have a go at this method

In the end, its not even about political idealogy its about poorly considered policy ( to date) thats not propely nutted out before being trotted out.


ta
rolf
 
in my opinion they should just increase the export duty on all the resources

force them to process it all here and sell a product rather than raw materials


Them..?? Who's them? The miners?

Miners dig up raw material. It's not the miners job to value add.

Why don't you go and build a factory and make something and export it then, if it's so darn easy and simple? But remember, your competing with people working for a tenth of our wages, and with different environmental regulations. It's the export income provided by mining which allows Australia to not have to manufacture stuff, and thank goodness for that. Western nations manufacturers are competing with this,......




20091020luguang16.jpg



See ya's.
 
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The Carbon Tax idealogy was a more broad based way to distribute welfare. That wasnt going to come off so now we will have a go at this method


Yep. Rolf, you've got it worked out. Anyone who understood the ETS would know that it wasn't designed to reduce carbon emissions. It certainly did that in Australia, but if the emissions were sent to China instead, then that doesn't count.

The ETS was designed to distribute wealth to the labor voter from business. This tax is the same. If this doesn't work out, they will think up another scheme. This is the most left wing government this country has ever had.


See ya's.
 
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And fancy ideas about govt sharing downside risk are just that - fanciful. Hard to bring back a mining company from the dead when their only project just went belly up - being half dead with a bucket load of tax credits is pretty cold comfort... So in reality this just removes upside and that's it.

Yes, I wonder how fast the govt. would repeal/alter the legislation if the commodities market turned to custard, and all the marginal mines (and perhaps some of the big ones) started booking large losses and putting their hand out for Rudd's 40% downside guarantee, and the money was flowing out of Govt. coffers instead of in?
 
As per my embedded question.

Cheers

royalty is also a tax.

so when you calculate tax as a percentage of 'before tax income' you need to either add royalty back to the base amount, which will make it 138m, or don't include it in the 57 mil of total taxes.

the 123m he refers to as a 'pre-tax' profit already had royalty subtracted from it.
 
Them..?? Who's them? The miners?
them - the government. last time i checked, miners weren't in control of export duties.

Miners dig up raw material. It's not the miners job to value add.

then why should they get more profit than someone who does?

Why don't you go and build a factory and make something and export it then, if it's so darn easy and simple?

a lot of people do, and their products are quite competitive.
 
The mining companies are now running their international adds where various international accented individuals are thanking krudd.

I suspect that these adds are not far from the truth where the competing countries are watching krudd&co's every move but for different motives to those eluded to in the adds.

Those other governments are watching just to see how successful this policy is implemented and formulating their own comparable policy to spring on those same mining companies.

Lets face it with the current (and recent past) boom in resources every government is in some way going to want to get their hands on some extra dough.

Just a thought.

Cheers
 
the government is desparate for the tax to pass - purely because they've promised to bring the budget back into the black, and this is the only way they know how.

much easier than reducing spending or becoming more efficient.

bit like painting acylic over gloss without bothering to do any ground/prep work because it's easy - but causes massive headaches down the track.
 
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