lifetime lethergy

[lizzie]

lots of interesting replies. i'll see doc first and do sleep clinic to rule that out before trying other ideas. i do take multivits but very happy to have more massages !

interesting to think back over the years. all my school reports from day one said "has intellegence but needs to apply herself." or "has ability but needs to concentrate more" etc etc. in hindsight, this lack of application or concentration may have been caused by background tiredness ... i just cannot recall a time in my life when i wasn't always tired, so thought it was normal.

this may rule out the lack of breathing during sleep - but i did catch the back end of something on tele a while back about incorrect rem dream state causing exhaustion problems.

 

[Player]

L:4 or T:4 ?

y'know what - i'm just gonna chuck this out there - because after 4 or 5 times you'll know for sure.

see a chiro. you may have a problem upper back like me that affects the circulatory sytem and lungs - specifically L4..............cheers and good luck

Hey BC. Interesting.........would that be T: 4 (thoracic/dorsal spine) if it's upper back rather than L:4 (lumbar/lower back)?

Thoracic area also plays a role with autonomics which may affect circulatory elements.....oxygen supply and the subsequent energy to tissues.

 

[wylie]

A friend of mine has all sorts of health issues, including sleep apnoea. She didn't like the c-pap machine so didn't use it (huh??). It was suggested that she try not to sleep on her back.

Of course, it is hard to not sleep on your back when you roll onto your back when asleep. She was asked to sew a pocket on the back of her pajamas and pop a tennis ball into the pocket. When she tries to roll over, she will automatically roll back because the ball will be uncomfortable. She didn't bother with this either???

This could be a very quick and easy (do it tonight?) thing to try for a few days while you are waiting for an appointment with your doctor.

 

[Kit]

Lizzie I suffered from lethargy for many years too. Eventually discovered that it was because of my poor lung function, less than 50% (i.e. my breathing was the same as if I only had one lung - not too good). Way, way better since I started taking medication.

 

[INVSTOR]

Just curious - what medication are you on for that Kit?

 

[Strannik]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronic_fatigue_syndrome

 

[Sunfish]

I've only just come onto this thread and you have a heavy cross to bear Lizzie.

I think mine started in my 30s when I was working hard, drinking too much and sneaking up on middle age so I didn't notice.

In my fourties I would stop for a few zeds on the side of the road, have a nap immediately after breakfast, my brain would fog over when I tried to do my paperwork. I could only operate if something stirred the adrenalin but that only worked till I hit the wall.

Sadly, I have no advice except to resist any anti-depressants you may be prescribed. The condition is "depressing" but you are not clinically depressed so they can't help.

There is no single condition of "chronic fatigue" but a support group may help and that is where you should start your reading.

Oh! And have a thyroid function test.

Wishing you the best.... Thommo

 

[Sunfish]

.....but i did catch the back end of something on tele a while back about incorrect rem dream state causing exhaustion problems.

I doubt the sleep apnea link and generally believe the CF causes the poor sleep, not the reverse. But you still need to try to get a good night's rest.

One gentle way to help which I have only come across lately is melatonin. Serotonin is the brain stimulus to make you happy, melatonin is your body clock's stimulus to the brain. My son's ex was totally blind and could not tell night from day so her body clock would "drift". Melatonin would bring it back into line. Works for jet lag too.

But you can't buy it in Australia. What you get here is "artificial" so best get it from the States.

 

[Comper100]

I can definitely relate to what is been discussed here.

I can sleep 8, 9 or even 10 hours and find it impossible to get my a#$% out of bed each morning. I have tried every technique under the sun for years and still have not cracked it.

I know of people that eat Maccas for breakfast, drink soft drinks, coffee all day and drink like a fish on weekends. Yet they are just bouncing off the walls early in the mornings !

I on the other side eat correct portion of protein/ carbs and good fats, drink herbal tea, stay away from alcohol and exercise yet feel like crap each morning.

Once I am up and after an hour or so I feel really good. It's just that morning buzz I so much desire.

I'm another one who is exactly like this, I struggle like hell to get out of bed, always have. I've tried a variety of things, i do go to the gym in the mornings but feel lethargic as hell until about 10am. I'm a heavy sleeper and its like coming out of a coma each morning. Yet i'm a night owl by nature, the night is easy for me to stay up if I want. Its drives my Gf mad as soon as the sun is up she hits the roof with energy, sometimes getting up at 5:30 to go to the gym .
I've found a pattern though:

Deep sleeper
Takes ages to get to sleep
Can stay awake all night
Lethargic and tired in the morning
Dreams not that vivid

It seams to be these issues that are common. How you crack it is another matter. No matter how much sleep or when i get up has an effect on my state in the morning.

Interesting thread!

 

[Samantha]

Some Solutions I found

I too can relate, except for the dreaming and nightmares.

I have tried to conquer this all my life also. 4 months ago I decided to dedicate my time and effort to sorting it, once and for all because my mind always wants to be at the gym but the body has trouble getting there due to low energy.

I did an exclusion diet for a month and found I am allergic to everything. Slightly disappointed but relieved that I found relief from low energy lvels and an answer.

I still suffered bouts of low energy even on the new diet - very low iron levels - investigated medical history and resulted in a hysterectomy. I am now bouncing off the wall with plenty of energy, however, still wake up groggy some mornings.

The only time I ever felt on top of it was when I followed very strictly the Liver Cleansing Diet (Sandra Cabot) for 2 months. You may ask why I dont do that now - I love champagne too much!

Hope this helps someone.

 

[yadreamin]

lizzie you seem to be beatin yourself up a bit latley.
Now lets see
you are in the middle of a big reno.
You are constantly seeking answers to reno hick ups
you are constantly doing the numbers in your head
you are always on the look out for the next block/house /deal
you are always reaching higher.
you have kids
you have a hubby
you have a home to keep
you have family members to cherish and look after
you have soooooo much to do
for goodness sake give yourself a break super woman and if you need a nap have a nap it aint gonna stop the world.[l do it often]
we are not all perfect and if we stop trying to be perfect life becomes enjoyable.
seeking out a wonder pill is not always the answer.
Yes get the medical checks but give yourself a break
oh and you say you have had it all through life well then maybe you need just a little bit more rest than others. we are not all the same you know.
cheers
yadreamin

 

[lizzie]

just got back from the doc's ... it's a large practice with several doctors and i rarely see the same one twice.

when i rang about the last barrage of tests 3 months ago, i was told by the receptionist that the doc had no concerns. anyhow, bit the bullet and went back today to get this "lethary" thing started on it's path of resolution.

the first thing the new doc did was take a quick history of symptons etc and looked at the last tests - iron and something else (name slips me for the moment) are high and she said that in a female of my age that sends out warning signs that i might have a genetic condition called hemochromatosis whereas the body "makes" to much iron. sent me for a new round of blood tests to either confirm or rule it out before we go further.

apparently it is a genetic condition from birth and would explain the "lifetime" of lethary. great news if she is right as it would explain so much. bad news is that there is no cure as such (nothing to do with diet etc).

i do not cope with blood tests very well, and as i sat there babbling away to the nurse to keep my mind off what she was doing and frrantically trying not to pass out she advised me that her brother has the same condition .... the only treatment is to have 1/2 litre of blood drawn every 6 months to dilute the blood in the body. this needs to be done as excessive iron will damange the liver, heart and pancreas to the point where it becomes fatal.

arrrrrgh!

link for those interested:

http://www.uihealthcare.com/news/news/2005/08/08hemochromatosis.

http://digestive.niddk.nih.gov/ddiseases/pubs/hemochromatosis/

at least hubby will be happy as the ahem drive will increase with treatment!

 

[lizzie]

oooo - and then i just read that the intial treatment is to give a 1/2 litre every 4-7 days to get it under control, before the maintenance of once every 4-6 months kicks in.

i feel really crook!

http://digestive.niddk.nih.gov/ddiseases/pubs/hemochromatosis/#what

reading up on the diet recommendations - no red meat, NO WINE! or alcohol of any kind and a list of recommended diet supplements as long as my arm.

http://www.smile.org.au/OtherMedicalTherapies/Hemochromatosis.htm

 

[joanmc]

Lizzie
that's interesting! It runs in my family too.

 

[Sunfish]

.... the only treatment is to have 1/2 litre of blood drawn every 6 months to dilute the blood in the body. this needs to be done as excessive iron will damange the liver, heart and pancreas to the point where it becomes fatal.

I was about to suggest donating blood but you don't sound a good patient.

If I remember correctly it showed in Mrs Fish as irregular heart rythms, but that was a long time ago. She gave blood for many years.

 

[lizzie]

If I remember correctly it showed in Mrs Fish as irregular heart rythms, but that was a long time ago. She gave blood for many years.

i have those too - as well as getting aching hip joints. how did mrs fish deal with it? there seems to be a lot more info about diet coming out, and this would be my preferred method of complimentry control (except the wine thing!)

if i am able, and i have to have blood removed anyhow, i'll ask if it can be (gulp) donated ... might as well have something good come out of it.

apparently the disease is from celtic origin and up to 1 in 9 have the gene - although only .5 in 100 actually get the disease. and there i was thrilled about my genetics!

 

[Sunfish]

I've got Celtic genes too: I get gout.

I don't think she did much more'n give blood.

 

[lizzie]

looks like i'm going to have to become a pure foods vegetarian ... although apparently i am allowed red wine in moderation (what's that)

http://www.irondisorders.org/Websites/idi/Files/Content/854256/DietRecommendations.pdf

 

[Slim Pikins]

Lizzie,

Is it better to "swallow" the blood test fear thingie and have the blood taken off and used if possible to help a chronic shortage.

Once you have had treatment for 6 months or so blood tests won't matter to you and your body will thank you very much. It's like being diabetic after the initial, giving injections to yourself, you get very used to it very quickly.

Slim

 

[Aaron Sice]

how does your body "make" iron?

we "need" iron to survive, our blood is iron based, when we get low in iron we get haemopheliac - but we don't make it ourselves.

WTF?