Make Offer on Business Opportunity

Discussion in 'Commercial Property' started by New_Investor, 15th May, 2015.

  1. The Falcon

    The Falcon Member

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    Is this even an attractive business as a single centre and performing well? clearly the bloke is taking the **** as is common in such situations. Perhaps if there is the intention to get a few or more of these centres as a quick roll up and then package them for sale/franchise there may be some value here....but not paying 100k for it. Its worth the depreciated value of its assets (ie. fit out), and that's if you value that stuff...ie. would you replace some/all? So I'd call it 50k at best. As is, this kind of business is just a job unless you have a plan to scale up. Pass for me. I'd be more inclined to start something like this from scratch if a case could be made for it.
     
  2. BayView

    BayView Member

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    If you could get it for the right price, it's one of those businesses where you could staff it with housewives and/or young women/students, etc (who love kids) who want some flexible hours in a nice environment.

    Easy to run for the girls, and the owner would not have to be there, and hopefully pull out a lazy $50k per year passive income (or mostly passive).

    Hey....I've got myself thinking....:D
     
  3. sanj

    sanj Member

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    It sounds understaffed atm (so wage bill should go up) and only makes 10k a year atm, assuming it will easily go up to 50k is dangerous imo
     
  4. The Falcon

    The Falcon Member

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    Yep, he has underdone that wages cost by 50% or more. So right now, this business is losing money realistically.
     
  5. BayView

    BayView Member

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    Yep, absolutely.

    It would have to show a decent enough nett profit after all staff and owner wages included to consider it as a passive income prospect.

    From the OP's point of view; I guess if the wife could run it on her own, and even make a half decent profit from it, it opens them up to all the benefits of running a business from the tax point of view...

    Of course; this in and of itself would not be an adviseable reason to buy it at all..
     
  6. Ace in the Hole

    Ace in the Hole Don't compete, Dominate !

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    One of the most significant issues not emphasised much so far is public liability.

    This is not a business you should enter unaware.
    If a kid gets seriously hurt and you are investigated and held liable, you'll be done.
    You have a duty of care to uphold and you need to be very thorough with these type of things.
    The nature of this business makes it even more risky and the rewards need to be much higher than shown.
     
  7. The Falcon

    The Falcon Member

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    Spot on. And I see insurance costs are compounding at approx. 30% pa last 3years....
     
  8. hobo

    hobo Member

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    This sounds like a complete dog of an investment, TBH.
     
  9. Macca

    Macca Member

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    Dealing with kids all the time you are liable to be sued any time in the next 30 years !

    I would want a good buy to even contemplate this type of business and this is definitely NOT a good deal IMO

    The rent is waaaay too much for a business doing those dollars.

    I agree with the others, walk away, there are far better deals than this if you keep looking and are patient.

    I would be looking for something owned by a baby boomer wanting to retire :)
     
  10. pinkboy

    pinkboy SS Lookerafterer

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    What's your current strike rate picking up good profit generating, passive income businesses?

    :p

    pinkboy
     
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  11. sanj

    sanj Member

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    Ouch!!!!!!!
     
  12. BayView

    BayView Member

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    Zero. :D. (Unless you can class an IP as a profit making passive business?)

    But I'll keep trying.
     
    Last edited: 19th May, 2015
  13. BayView

    BayView Member

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    I fear that this one issue will be yet another nail in the coffin (cost of business that can't be passed on easily) of many a small (and even bigger) businesses in this Country over the next decade or two.

    We are perhaps as litigious as the USA these days, and getting worse.

    The recipe for businesses and more importantly; employment in Aus is on a shaky path.....we all want more range, more choice, more protection, less responsibility, more wages, more rent for our comm IP's....and pay less for our products and services we buy into the bargain.

    I worry about this; I can see a future where nothing is made here, no one will employ anybody here due to crippling regulations and costs....

    The trend is there already; full time jobs disappearing and being rebirthed as casual and limited part-time positions.
     
    Last edited: 19th May, 2015
  14. skater

    skater Capitalist

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    So...you're happy for your wife to work 7 days a week for little to no income?:eek:
     
  15. Scott No Mates

    Scott No Mates ...and people wonder why?

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    Did someone forget to ask how much cash it rakes in which isn't on the books?:rolleyes:
     
  16. jrc

    jrc Member

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    But if the owner's wife is only there one day a week, is any cash going to the owners. Get some friends to mystery shop at various times over a couple of weeks.
     
  17. BayView

    BayView Member

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    True.

    We've been to indoor play centres loads of times over the years with our 3 kids, and they do a lot of cash - entry fees and all the coffees/cakes/drinks etc.

    The birthday parties are where the real money can be made from my observation.

    I think if they can get it for next to nothing and then she works her butt off, it could be a goer.
     
  18. New_Investor

    New_Investor Member

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    Hi Guys,
    Thanks for your responses, I think I have come to a decision. And honestly, you helped me a lot with this. Some of those makes me laugh ?Shut up and take my money :)?.

    I have asked about the cash money, he said there is some cash made, and he cannot tell much about it. and with his wife working 1 day a week. If someone is taking the cash, it would be the manager not the owner. He said on school holidays they can make 1K/week in cash.

    For Insurance, My wife worked in the childcare management before, and the insurance covers future claims for 30 years. E.g. if a kid hit his head while in the child care, and X-ray after 10 years show impact. This is covered by insurance. I understand this is the standard type of insurance with business dealing with children like child care and children playgrounds.

    I have put the numbers together, basically I added the depreciation, net profit, and interest, even I added the 10K for cash. And it ended up with around 32K?s a year. I excluded the wages as my wife is currently earning a wage.

    I have drafted what I am going to add to the place to enhance service and maybe I can increase sales, and the cost came to be 21K?s, this do not include labour, so a DIY kind projects. If Labour is included, these figures will double.

    I have calculated additional hours for my wife and myself working long hours and weekends and a wage for a junior to upgrade the service level. Looks like our hourly rate for additional hours and weekend work will be around $14/hour. Added 4% increase for the rent.

    Thinking logic, this will be 100% consumption of my time to make additional 32K?s per year excluding the risks. This year I bought 2 houses in Brisbane, one appreciated by 15K?s and the other is awaiting valuation. I was quoted for some work for 16K?s , I took 3 days off, and managed to do all the work for 3K?s with couple of handy people, saving 12K?s. Just renovated my kitchen at home. Quoted for 15K, DIY with same quality level for 3K?s.

    If I buy this business, I will have no time to do such jobs, which is theory nearby the numbers of return. I think, using these funds, I will arrange to buy a 3rd Inv. Property, and do some renovations. Keep my Job, and Keep my wife?s job. Have nice weekends with the family without the headache.

    Thanks
    Ram
     
  19. TMNT

    TMNT Member

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    If you are comparint dolars per hour vs ip investment vs profit from a business . Then buying a business is not for you

    You buy businesses for tax deductions, getting rid of the wife, a lifestyle (a very busy one), ego, personal satisfaction etc etc

    and if you can earn decent dollars then thats almost a bonus
     
  20. The Falcon

    The Falcon Member

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    You are doing it wrong ;)