NEWSTART ALLOWANCE IF YOU OWN IPs

Regardless of the opinions...........


Family situation For homeowners For non-homeowners
assets must be less than assets must be less than


Single $202,000 $348,500
Couple combined $286,500 $433,000
One partner eligible, combined assets $286,500 $433,000



Ok that's it........why am I working...:confused:


Ciao

Nor
 
And we would love to help her out Skater, but are just now facing a huge capital gains tax bill ourselves so cash is short.
I wasn't talking about a large cash donation. More along the lines of a room, food, the use of a car to get to interviews & maybe a few $$ when needed. No lifestyle stuff, (coffees, movies, meals out, clothes, makeup). Nothing else, which I am sure any parent could do.

I maintain a cash buffer. Which is something that seems to be missing in her case.
Me too, but remember the general community isn't as educated as we are here.

Its not a personal attack on you/her. Its a general comment - why should the govt have to pay out welfare money to her? Shes not in "hard times" or been made redundant, she doesnt have a disability or mental illness, shes leaving her job voluntarily and moving back to Australia. And she has assets with most likely equity that could pay for months (or years) of living expenses.

Is that not what you invest for, so that if you hit a bad spell you have something you can leverage or sell to pay to live? You cant just take take take from the govt in negative gearing benefits ongoing, then expect the govt to fund your living expenses because you decide to move back to Australia of your own accord and dont have any savings.

Instead, you take any work you can while you look for a teaching job, rather than just expect to be given Newstart and rent assistance.
I agree, there are way too many people that just sit around because the 'right' job isn't forthcoming. If you are in trouble, you take anything you can. We've been in some hard places over the years & between us, hubby & I have done all sorts of things to put food on the table.

The old "but I paid tax I deserve some of it back when I need it" line doesnt go far with me. We all benefit from tax paid in far more ways than just by having a centrelink payment when we cant find work. 35% of my tax went to welfare last FY, I dont say "well centrelink owe me money now please".

Living and working overseas is a great experience, but if a working adult fails to save any money to fund a relocation across the world, I fail to see why the taxpayer needs to fund any person in her scenario.
Again, I agree. I think if you are going overseas to live for a while it is completely foolhardy to not have some money put aside for when you come back.

There are probably about 10 others in Australia as clever as skater. No-one else would even ask.
I'm not that clever! I remember a thread years ago now, that discussed this exact scenario. It was before 9/11, because we had closed our Business by then. And it wasn't in regards to the dole, but a family allowance. I was running the Business with the help of our Children, 6 days per week, while Hubby was working in Hornsby 6 days per week (we were in Wollongong), and on Sundays, he looked after the Business while I worked in a call centre.

And while we were doing all that work, our income was still way under the dole at the time, because it was all being funnelled unto the Business that was running at a massive loss. We endured living like this for around 18 months, living upstairs in a nasty filthy office space, where I refused to even enter the kitchen, it was so bad. I used to cook our meals downstairs in the pie warmer. It's funny how creative you can be when you have to.

As soon as our lease was up on the building, we were able to close up shop & move away.

Hustle like an immigrant and do what you have to do.

LOL! Yes, we've done that so many times, I've lost count. So many dodgy jobs, but it kept us fed.:D

Anyway, back to the problem at hand.

I'm not so heartless to say that she shouldn't be given a helping hand. BUT.....welfare should be there to help anybody out in times of financial duress. It is not there as a lifestyle choice.

I believe that, depending on the real situation, because we really don't know how much money this girl has, that it is possible that she should be able to access, at least, say, eight weeks of benefits, when she gets back here. In those 8 weeks, it gives an agent a couple of weeks to launch a property on the market, as well as six weeks to settle.

If she gets back here penniless, should she be expected to survive with NOTHING in the time it takes to sell a property? Even if you 'hustle like an immigrant', not everyone would have the skills or the confidence to do that successfully, so she may not make any money in that time. So....I see it as a safety net to get her through.

HOWEVER, I also find it really hard to imagine that anyone with three IP's in Sydney, or even Newcastle could have assets under the threshold, since everything has doubled in price, there has to be a tonne of equity in there.
 
Hi Seaview, I am keen to know in some detail (if you don't mind sharing) the difficulty you ran into wirh "safe managed funds" during the GFC. Was this leveraged commercial real estate fund or some other derivatives/ strategy based fund?
 
If she gets back here penniless, should she be expected to survive with NOTHING in the time it takes to sell a property? Even if you 'hustle like an immigrant', not everyone would have the skills or the confidence to do that successfully, so she may not make any money in that time. So....I see it as a safety net to get her through.

Perfect.
Problems are opportunities.
This is here chance to get these real world skills which will build her confidence and ability to do what is required to rise above.
 
Perfect.
Problems are opportunities.
This is here chance to get these real world skills which will build her confidence and ability to do what is required to rise above.

I know what you're saying, and it's what I would do myself, but I recognise that not everyone can.

I believe that the welfare system is both too harsh, and too soft at the same time, and that anybody who is in real need should be able to access it FOR A LIMITED PERIOD OF TIME. In other words, it should be a hand-up, not a hand-out, and there should be no stigma involved if you do need access to it.

There should be no long term unemployed like we have today. If they lose their job, for whatever reason, I believe people should be able to access temporary welfare. After the temporary period is over, then we start to make it tough on them. Note, I said LOSE, not QUIT!

With the current system, it basically encourages people to spend all of their money each week, and not even try to strive for better. If you have too much in savings or investment, you get nothing, yet the person next in line, who could have been on a higher income, but has spent it all, gets a helping hand.

The genuine cases, even if they hit hard times, will only ever need an occasional hand-up.

It's those that want a hand-out that I have a problem with and I feel they should have to do mandatory work-for-the-dole, week in, week out, just like any other job. Don't turn up, and your dole gets cut. No jobs for them to do? Tough, they can walk the streets/highways picking up garbage. They can clean graffiti off walls, they can paint council owned fences. There's heaps of menial tasks they can do to keep them occupied and off the streets, and desperate enough to look for real work.

Same deal with kids that quit school. There's tons of them that just roam around bored causing trouble. Either you are in school, learning, and if you muck up too much you get expelled, OR you join in the work-for-the-dole to keep your youth allowance. There's no sitting at home all day playing Xbox, smoking, drinking, drugging & getting up to mischief. Don't go to school, you funds get cut, don't show up for your work, your funds get cut.
 
You guys are a hoot.
When I were a lad we lived in a shoe box, and had to lick the road clean every day. We worked 28 hours a day, and our dad murdered us in our sleep each night... and if you tell young people these days how hard it was, they won't believe you.
Anyway, Falcon, the "safe" managed funds were not R/E related, they were largely related to Steve Navras miracle income fund.
We do learn lots by experience and our dumb mistakes.
And we sure will help daughter out with free rent etc. and being smart, hard working and resourceful, she will find work quickly, and has a string of experience in a range of jobs.
BUT in principle, I (as one who deplores supporting dole bludgers) still do NOT have a problem using my tax money to help out a worker who has left one job (one of the most stressful on the planet BTW - half her colleagues are on stress leave). A few weeks of dole till she finds a job seems reasonable to me.
And heck, a buffer would be nice, but the huge rates bills on her IPS plus blow out in sub division costs etc ate up her buffer. So there you go.
I have pretty well done chatting about this for now. Though would love to hear from anyone with actual info about getting the dole while owning an IP.
I have to go and work now at the hugely successful business (sorry but don't ask) I started in my sixties while working at a crap telemarketing day job (my first in 30 years since retiring as a professional to be a house wife and mum). That job was a godsend and to my amazement I was the best seller they ever had. Kept us going while my husband spiralled down into depression due to our circumstances and could not work. Also he could not get sickness or any other benefits due to all our IPs which we tried to sell but took ages to sell). Once we pay off ATO we WILL have some spare cash, at long last.
Anyway, I think we can all agree on one thing - that Oz is the absolute best place to re-invent yourself if you do fall on hard times.
Cheers
Seaview
 
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Not sure why you're taking things so personally, you started the thread.

Anyway, hope it all works out with your daughter.
 
Everyone should get $200 per week regardless of their circumstances. Its about what we spend on 'welfare' anyway, (administration makes up a large proportion of the spend) and we could do away with all this moralizing and name calling about cheats etc.
 
Have to go and work at the hugely successful business I started in my sixties while working at a crap telelmarketing job (my first in 30 years - which I had to take and was the best seller they had to my amazement , as my husband spiralled down into depression due to our circumstances).
But I think we can all agree that Oz is the absolute place to re-invent yourself if you do fall on hard times.

Remember, it's only a passing phase, and yes, Australia IS the lucky country in that regard. We've been on the brink a few times in years gone past, but it is possible to come back from the brink with hard work & dedication.
 
Everyone should get $200 per week regardless of their circumstances. Its about what we spend on 'welfare' anyway, (administration makes up a large proportion of the spend) and we could do away with all this moralizing and name calling about cheats etc.

I've been reading a bit about basic income, interesting concept. Don't know enough about it to have formed an opinion yet but it certainly would cut down the administration costs significantly.

Isn't $140bn or so spent on welfare atm? Pretty crazy amount
 
You guys are a hoot.
When I were a lad we had to lick the road clean every day, we worked 28 hours a day, and our dad murdered us while we were asleep.
Anyway, Falcon, the "safe" managed funds were not R/E related, they were largely related to Steve Navras miracle income fund.
We do learn lots by experience, and we sure will help daughter out with free rent etc. and being smart, hard working and resourceful, she will find work quickly, and has a string of experience in a range of jobs.
BUT in principle, I (as one who deplores supporting dole bludgers) still do NOT have a problem using my tax money to help out a worker who has left one job (one of the most stressful on the planet BTW - half her colleagues are on stress leave). A few weeks of dole till she finds a job seems reasonable to me. And heck, a buffer would be nice, but the huge rates bills on her IPS plus blow out in sub division costs etc ate into her buffer. So there you go.

I hope it works out for your daughter,but rather then stand in a line that sometimes goes out into the carpark in the local centrelink outlet in our area in inner brisbane ,and you give centrelink every bit of investment data your daughter has,and the systems they have in place,then only to find out you don't qualify would be just a waste of time..
 
I have to go and work now at the hugely successful business I started in my sixties while working at a crap telemarketing day job (my first in 30 years since retiring as a professional to be a house wife and mum).

If your business is hugely successful then give your daughter a job for a few weeks. Or since Newstart and rent assistance is circa $1200pm,. give her a few months worth.

Or just mooch of the govt teet, whatever works.
 
Dave,
I DID say I am cash strapped as ATO wants my blood NOW. (Hoping to drag it out with payments over a year, but they still want a LOT up front). Otherwise we WOULD give her cash.
I despise mooching off govt teet and do NOT think a worker who needs short term help between jobs should be classed as a moocher.
 
Dave,
I DID say I am cash strapped as ATO wants my blood NOW. (Hoping to drag it out with payments over a year, but they still want a LOT up front). Otherwise we WOULD give her cash.
I despise mooching off govt teet and do NOT think a worker who needs short term help between jobs should be classed as a moocher.

If you are requiring a Payment Plan with the ATO, that means you haven't paid the required taxes at the required time.

How can you sit there and say things like 'successful business' when you are insolvent re. above? :confused:

Payment Plan = mooching off the Government in my view as well, just a different way.


pinkboy
 
Pinkboy, I will be using every cent I make in my successful business to pay the ATO. By your logic I guess minimising tax, and negative gearing and lots of other things are mooching too then. ATO hardly has a welfare mentality though, which is a shame for me. I have not even got my tax bill yet FYI, but know what is coming. And I do have grounds for a payment plan due to blood bath in our finances over previous years FYI. Bankruptcy would have been easier I guess. Silly me, we would rather show integrity and pay our debts, using whatever help lines are available. Conscience is clear.
Terry W, thanks for some actual info (at last). I think those asset values have been adjusted up since 1991 though. It is probably not worth even trying to get through the Centrelink maze for just a few weeks dole. But the link about Financial Hardship grounds etc may help others who are unable to sell IPs quickly, and where the bread winner is sick or unable to work.
I knew if I persevered here, eventually the brains trust would triumph over the random opinion givers.
Thanks
Seaview
 
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Most unemployment type benefits come with a waiting period. It is unlikely your daughter will be able to access benefits immediately she arrives home.
Marg
 
what is newstart allowance?

I know it's some kind of centerlink payout, apologies for naive questions but how does this one differ from other forms of unemployment benefits?

are they called different names for different people?

how much per week is this newstart thing?

Newstart is the unemployment benefit people receive when they are looking for full-time work. I think it's currently gone up to around $519 a fortnight or just shy of $260 a week. If you voluntarily leave a job and want to claim the payment there's usually a 4-8 week wait with backpay.

Honestly if I was your daughter I wouldn't even worry about it. By the time she is eligible for Newstart (if she is even eligible with 3 IPs in Sydney) she would probably be employed by that time. Centrelink is a bureaucratic mess and will do everything they can to inconvience your life if you rely on them for payments. I'm not sure if it's just a myth but I've heard regional towns are crying out for teachers but who knows. Maybe she'll just have to live with you guys temporarily until she gets back up on her feet.
 
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