Property lawyers sooooo expensive

Just venting. got a quote from a solicitor to review a lease on a matter that is a bit unique here in queensland. quoted circa $500 an hour. daaaaaaamn. i'm in the wrong profession. will probably pay something in that order due to the uniqueness of the situation. hope they dont take too long to read the lease and decide on a suitable strategy.
 
try running a case to trial, it get's really ugly then.

$500 is probably just the start. when thy ring up to chat and see how things ar eprgoressing, be careful, they have hit the stop watch. then will come the postage fees, filing fees, junior staff to review etc etc
 
I like it when they charge you to peruse your emails, then charge you to write a response.

Charge in 6 minute "unit" blocks. $ 500 / hr. Each block or part thereof is $ 50.


Read email for 7 minutes - 2 units - $ 100.00 Yippee !!!


It gets better when they decide, without you knowing, to have a "conference" for 20 minutes with their colleague 'to appraise and reflect'. This is actually a coffee down at the local. Charge = 4 units - $ 200.00 Yippee !!!


But as all wise investors know, this is simply one of the costs of doing business. No biggy.


Cracks me up when they charge $ 260 per hour for the 19 yo pimply idiot at the back of the office who would struggle to write her own name.

When she's on your payroll, that's when you truly know you are getting top flight service. hahaha.


Armani suits, top addresses, flash offices, Italian coffees, smoothing dulcet tones. Image baby !!!
 
and they say competition is good for the consumer. there are quite a few solicitors in brizzy cbd and they all charge through the teeth. sigh. nothing much i can do about it but bend over in reluctance
 
$500 an hour. daaaaaaamn. i'm in the wrong profession. .

You're in the wrong profession?? That's my weekly wage!!!! :eek:

Read email for 7 minutes - 2 units - $ 100.00 Yippee !!!

It gets better when they decide, without you knowing, to have a "conference" for 20 minutes with their colleague 'to appraise and reflect'. This is actually a coffee down at the local. Charge = 4 units - $ 200.00 Yippee !!!

Cracks me up when they charge $ 260 per hour for the 19 yo pimply idiot at the back of the office who would struggle to write her own name.

Armani suits, top addresses, flash offices, Italian coffees, smoothing dulcet tones. Image baby !!!

Lol, i like it.

Maybe not the 19 year old pimply idiot though, that's me, minus a year, so i'm still learning how letters even work....:D

Another funny thing is, i just realised your name is CashflowPlus - Not when you're done paying the legal fees!!!
 
Hmmm... You are all trying to talk me into putting my degree to use, aren't you...

nah...sitting here right now putting it to use...seriously...don't...you'll be the pimply nosed 19yo *****-kicker for quite a few years, not withstanding that you will actuall ybe able to spell your name...and you barely get 1/10th of what they charge you out at :mad:
 
That's true of my profession too. Although I don't work in law, I get charged out at $250 per hour. The bigwigs in my company get charged out at $750 per hour!

Wish I took home what I get charged out at, that would sure be nice! Heck, even half or a quarter of that would be very nice.
 
nah...sitting here right now putting it to use...seriously...don't...you'll be the pimply nosed 19yo *****-kicker for quite a few years, not withstanding that you will actuall ybe able to spell your name...and you barely get 1/10th of what they charge you out at :mad:

No. I'd be the 28yo ****-kicker ;)

Luckily, I enjoy my current profession of SAHM. :D
 
It gets better when they decide, without you knowing, to have a "conference" for 20 minutes with their colleague 'to appraise and reflect'. This is actually a coffee down at the local. Charge = 4 units - $ 200.00 Yippee !!!

Bewdy......I love appraise and reflect.....

Yes Sir, let me confer with my learned colleagues, with the privilege of nil prejudice, on this matter of wrong and injury, then appraise and reflect in manner and form, said in and outputs.
 
That's true of my profession too. Although I don't work in law, I get charged out at $250 per hour. The bigwigs in my company get charged out at $750 per hour!

Wish I took home what I get charged out at, that would sure be nice! Heck, even half or a quarter of that would be very nice.

what profession is it?
 
I like it when they charge you to peruse your emails, then charge you to write a response.

Charge in 6 minute "unit" blocks. $ 500 / hr. Each block or part thereof is $ 50.


Read email for 7 minutes - 2 units - $ 100.00 Yippee !!!


It gets better when they decide, without you knowing, to have a "conference" for 20 minutes with their colleague 'to appraise and reflect'. This is actually a coffee down at the local. Charge = 4 units - $ 200.00 Yippee !!!

Yes but we have to measure our work and like a tradie we charge by the hour. Better to get a fixed quote if you can.

The conference one is a problem. Saw this on a file when Partner (440/hr) Senior solicitor (360/hr) and Junior solicitor (280/hr) have a 20 min chinwag. The file was divided up -partner oversees but easy work done by junior and rest by senior.

I rang the Law society ethics to ask if it was kosher- they said yes although my view was it is an internal decision of the (high profile) firm to manage the work in such a manner why should client pay for it?

Best way around it is to get a competent solicitor (5yrs + should be OK ) and authorize him or her only to work on matters with no "conferences".

PS Original poster $500/hr is a bit steep for an aging partner fossil. Get them lean, young and strong should be able to do $400/hr in the city and $300/hr in the burbs.

Its a bit like briefing barristers- I never use fat ones as I read it as complacency- they've forgotten how to fight. Look for someone who wants your work. Good luck.
 
people will call 6 accountants to get their annual return down from $400 to $300 but they will call up a plumber out of the yellow pages and let him write whatever invoice he likes
 
And my uncle had the nerve to continually tell me accountants are thiefs! I would round 7 minutes down to 6 and charge 1 unit! :)

Problem is with that is it is computer driven. The practice management software records the time you are on the phone with them and automatically adds it to your bill. Always open on your desktop is the practice management software, so when you are working on a matter you have a client field for the account name and a start/finish and a pause button which times all the work stuff. However with the higher end software it is linked to the phone system so when you are put through it starts timing for your account and stops when it hangs up, you can also set it to automatically record the conversation and it saves as an mp3 in the clients file. Expensive software but pays for itself with reduced time spent on logging billing.

If the lawyer works for a decent sized firm they will also have to meet minimum billing time. The nicer ones might let you get away with billing 5.5hrs per day, the not so nice (though better paying ones) want you to bill 7.5 hrs per day and that is actual billable hours not time on site. You may also be required to average that over the year for 5 days a week. So if you take your 4 weeks annual leave and have to do the 7.5 hrs a day that's 150 hours of billing time you need to make up. And unless you are senior you probably don't get a share in that either, it's jsut what you are required to do to make salary, albeit a decent one.

I have done a fair bit of research on this as I should be opening a property law and property accounting firm in inner Brisbane with my partners in the second half of this year. We are going to run a completely different model where the lawyers and accountants get no salary at all, they receive a % of their billable hours/ fees. This way we are aiming to attract driven professionals who don't want the staffing hassles of running a firm/partner advertising etc. As always can't give too much info at this stage as my partners are involved with other practices at present and will not be making it paublic until thier notice is given.
 
Problem is with that is it is computer driven. The practice management software records the time you are on the phone with them and automatically adds it to your bill. Always open on your desktop is the practice management software, so when you are working on a matter you have a client field for the account name and a start/finish and a pause button which times all the work stuff. However with the higher end software it is linked to the phone system so when you are put through it starts timing for your account and stops when it hangs up, you can also set it to automatically record the conversation and it saves as an mp3 in the clients file. Expensive software but pays for itself with reduced time spent on logging billing.

If the lawyer works for a decent sized firm they will also have to meet minimum billing time. The nicer ones might let you get away with billing 5.5hrs per day, the not so nice (though better paying ones) want you to bill 7.5 hrs per day and that is actual billable hours not time on site. You may also be required to average that over the year for 5 days a week. So if you take your 4 weeks annual leave and have to do the 7.5 hrs a day that's 150 hours of billing time you need to make up. And unless you are senior you probably don't get a share in that either, it's jsut what you are required to do to make salary, albeit a decent one.

I have done a fair bit of research on this as I should be opening a property law and property accounting firm in inner Brisbane with my partners in the second half of this year. We are going to run a completely different model where the lawyers and accountants get no salary at all, they receive a % of their billable hours/ fees. This way we are aiming to attract driven professionals who don't want the staffing hassles of running a firm/partner advertising etc. As always can't give too much info at this stage as my partners are involved with other practices at present and will not be making it paublic until thier notice is given.

Ring Lexon to see if there are potential insurance loadings with any of the partners.
 
For the majority of accounting work I don't see why hourly billing is necessary. It potentially rewards inefficiency. An example one accounting firm analyses the work involved, based on past experience provides a fixed fee quote and recognises that their internal systems and processes should be developed to ensure that the job is profitable. This rewards efficiency and competence. Another accounting firm charges on billable hours. In this scenario there is an incentive to charge the maximum possible hours because this will generate the highest fee. Leading to uncertainty for the client as to the exact fee and incentive to be less productive and inefficient as the less productive and efficient you are the more you bill. Certain jobs cannot be quoted as fixed fee but in my view the majority can. Imagine going to a hairdresser and being told your haircut would depend on the time taken to do the haircut. If they slowly cut your hair using nail clippers then they get more but the person with years of experience who uses modern equipment and does the haircut in half the time gets paid less. Doesnt seem right.
 
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