Redfern update

I guess it goes all the way to societal models. I think the the best societal model out there is a truly benevolent dicatorship - someone who knows whats best for the people and can do it with good intentions and no red tape. I guess there have been some nations throughout history that may have come close. We currently live in a model that assumes the people know best (whether thats true or not is another question :) )So I guess the model dictates (no pun indended) that the community should decide.

Philosophy according to novice property investor?!
 
ps whatever happens with this bit of legislastion I rekon Redfern has great cg prospect for the next 3-5yrs, cashflow is too low for me though.
 
knightm said:
I guess it goes all the way to societal models. I think the the best societal model out there is a truly benevolent dicatorship - someone who knows whats best for the people and can do it with good intentions and no red tape. I guess there have been some nations throughout history that may have come close. We currently live in a model that assumes the people know best (whether thats true or not is another question :) )So I guess the model dictates (no pun indended) that the community should decide.

Philosophy according to novice property investor?!

HI Knightm

Not bad philosophy. ;)

I am encouraged that persons such as yourself are to be involved in the process. :)

The more you are involved the more say you will get. Sure some bureacrats will give you hell but stuff em.

From my experience I can predicte one thing is certain. There is buckley's chance they will move residents out without their consent. Why.... because where ever they propose to go there will be a huge outcry of NIMBY.

When I worked at CWH some unit blocks actually tried to stop us buying units in their complex because of the bad influence we tenanted to. And sadly even Sydney City Councillors , a stakeholder, protested about some of our developments being imappropiate when local yuppies residnts complained!!. We took then to the Land and Environment Court and won. :D

But to be positive, I remember a single mum of two coming in at X mas with a box of biscuits ( home made) for the staff after having been given a unit a little earlier. We declined being Gov as they could be seen a bribe ( stupid gov rules :mad: )

She begged us to take the biscuits as she told us her story in tears. :(

She had been a Uni Professor and her Husband a Doctor in Bosnia. He was murdering for trying to help those injured on the wrong side and she fled with the kids and nothing else.

She now worked as an accounts clerk at the Casino and hence was eligable. Her children now went to school and no longer feared a knock on the door at night. The biscuits was all she had, to give thanks.

It still makes me cry now. :eek:

Peter 147
 
moving story peter 147 - its good to help people alongside the whole $ thing of p/investing. Puts it all into perspective I guess.
 
Second reading motion, Redfern-Waterloo Auth'ty Bill

http://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/prod/parlment/hansart.nsf/V3Key/LC20041207078

From Hansard second reading motion Redfern-Waterloo Authority Bill NSW Legislative Council (debate adjourned) 7/12/04
Some interesting comments here (excerpts in no particular order follow): -

The Hon Don Harwin

..."Clause 27 refers to any land in the operation area that is a State significant development. This may include areas like Rachel Forster hospital, Redfern railway station, the Eveleigh railway workshops and the local public school site. The bill allows Minister Knowles, in administering the Environment Planing and Assessment Act, to delegate to Minister Sartor his functions as the consent authority. Minister Sartor may then sub-delegate to the authority of the Council of the City of Sydney his functions as the consent authority. The reposing of so much power in Minister Sartor should be disturbing for all reasonable people. But, equally, the challenges and problems in Waterloo and Redfern need to be urgently addressed. Nothing that the Carr Labor Government has done thus far has seen any improvement in the area, and the Opposition is of the view that the Labor Government can have its belated go at trying to get improvement across the social and infrastructure needs of the area. Therefore the Liberal and National parties will not be opposing the bill, but we will move one amendment to limit Minister Sartor's capacity to grab other land areas into the operational area specified under schedule 1."


From Ms. Sylvia Hale (the Greens)-

"The Greens note the irony of the Minister for Energy and Utilities, Frank Sartor, defecting from the Council of the City of Sydney to the Labor Party only to see him now in a grubby little power grab, attempting to wrest much of his former domain back to his control—because that is what this bill is all about, handing development control for the CBD-airport corridor to the "Can-do-man", Frank Sartor—or Frankenstein, as residents named him yesterday. The bill has been dressed up by the Government as a bill that will fix the social problems of Redfern and Waterloo, but that is totally misleading and the residents of Redfern and Waterloo know that. They are well acquainted with State Government apathy toward the real and serious problems in their community. For far too long this Government has turned a blind eye to the social and economic disadvantages of the area, and the provisions of this bill do not fool anybody.

This bill will not fix social disadvantage. It will dilute indigenous and public housing communities by pushing up property prices and gentrifying the area. "

The Hon Don Harwin: ..."But recent revelations in the Sydney Morning Herald indicate that the plan is well developed. In fact, I was fascinated by speculation that elements of what is in the Sydney Morning Herald are in fact Cabinet-in-confidence documents. Therefore one wonders, first, how those documents found their way into the Sydney Morning Herald and, second, what was the motivation of the person in giving them to the Sydney Morning Herald."

Reverend the Hon. Dr Gordon Moyes: "They fell off a truck!"

Ms. Sylvia Hale: ..."There is also a fear that the space above the station will be developed. Other instances of this type of development, such as Chatswood station, have proved disastrous. A once-elegant old rail building makes way for an ugly new residential tower."

The Hon. Duncan Gay: "Where is the elegant building at Redfern railway station?"

The Hon. Dr ARTHUR CHESTERFIELD-EVANS [9.52 p.m.]: "The Redfern and Waterloo Authority Bill is a prime example of the Carr Government's "rule by decree" mentality. Under this bill a new government authority will be given immense statutory power to redevelop the inner-city suburbs of Redfern, Waterloo, Darlington and Eveleigh. The area will stretch from South Dowling Street in the east, along Cleveland Street to City Road in the west, encompassing part of the grounds of Sydney university, then wind down through Golden Grove past Macdonaldtown railway station to near Erskineville station, along Railway Parade to Henderson Street, down Botany Road to the junction of Botany Road and Bourke Street, down Bourke Street and across O'Dea Avenue to South Dowling Street. Other sites affected by the bill include the Alexandria Public School and the Carlton and United Breweries site on Broadway, the developer contributions to which are said to be the seed capital for this project.

The key feature of this bill is that it will override the local council and exempt from all other planning instruments any development that has the blessing of the Minister. I recognise that there are imperatives: the central business district must grow. I recognise also that this Government's neglect of infrastructure as a result of its dogmatic refusal to borrow has made life difficult. Rather than borrow and have assets to set against its borrowings—which is perfectly reasonable economics and a policy that has been followed for perhaps hundreds of years—this Government is obsessed with saying, "The debt is less." Thus it has sold assets and neglected infrastructure. The Government has sold city land at wholesale prices to developers, who make a killing. The same developers are then appropriately grateful and give money to the Carr Government in an appalling fashion that is contrary to good governance.

That wrong policy has led to further bad policy decisions by the Government. It combined the council areas of Sydney and South Sydney and then tried to gain control of the whole area. If it had succeeded I believe it would have developed the area using City of Sydney council as the vehicle. However, the people were not impressed by the Government's arrogance and they were lucky to have a champion in Clover Moore, who they believed was more willing to consult them than the Labor Party was. Clover Moore decisively won the election for the combined Sydney and South Sydney local government areas.

But the Labor Government does not take things lying down—this is an arrogant, bullying government. It is payback time. I am sure that this bill would not have seen the light of day if the Australian Labor Party had won the mayoralty and control of City of Sydney council. The Government thought it could get away with the forced boundary changes. It did not, so it has come back with this bill. One wonders whether we could extrapolate this approach and say that when the Government wants to proceed with development it will always override local government. It has nibbled away at local government in many areas. The Sydney Harbour Foreshore Authority took control of choice waterfront areas. Areas of the Balmain peninsula were excised from the control of Leichhardt council. Parts of Pyrmont were removed from the control of Sydney council. An authority was created to oversee the Olympic site when Auburn Council was denied control of it. We cannot trust these local councils, can we?..."
 
Did a bit of Redfern research for a bit of fun....

Auctions on the weekend

6 Great Buckingham St Marrickville FN Auction - Sold $529,000
72 Great Buckingham St FN Spencer Servi Auction - Highest Bid $910,000

Sales data from the street

43 700K
65 709K
12 713K
41 765K
108 796K
35 800K
62 800K
31 860K
33 891K
10 900K
26 937K
70 940K
 
Hi Xben,

Thanks for the data. Bidded on two of those properties and missed out. Bear in mind that Great Buckingham is arguably the best street outside of "Redfern East"

Cheers,

Julie
 
H I all

been actively looking in Redfern and Darlington?chippendale of late. Lots listed it seems... a result of recents proposal?

BTW if you want to take the plunge terraces on the wrong side on the street AKA on the block side are about $100k less than 1 block away.

$100k gain overnight on $400k aint bad if you can wear the risk and find the tenant.

Personally holiding off until rate rise next year. Be a bottom feeder I say.

Peter 147
 
Just ordered a Residex report on Redfern. It predicts capital growth of 15% per annum for the next 8 years, thereafter 13% per annum.

I also ordered a Residex report for a family member for Pymble-it predicts 9% growth per annum.

At this rate of capital growth the median Redfern house price will be more than the median Pymble house price in about 15 years (I liked that comparison).

Had a look at this property a few weeks ago

http://www.realestate.com.au/cgi-bi...0&p=30&t=res&ty=&snf=rbs&ag=&cu=&fmt=&header=

Asking $559k. Agent says it was recently let for $400/week. Residex says average rental return for Redfern houses=4.2%. This suggests the property is more likely worth about $500k. Looks like a good basic rental proposition-kauri floor-boards, fairly indestructible, 3 bedrooms (though average size bedrooms), ok kitchen, bathroom and enough space for 3 tenants in living area. I know this street well and have let the property opposite this for the last 6 years.

This one also caught my eye as it was so cheap for the area it is in (East Redfern)-looks a dump though. Situated in a lane at the back of Moorehead Street. Asking $355k. Land value only I suspect.

http://www.realestate.com.au/cgi-bi...0&p=30&t=res&ty=&snf=rbs&ag=&cu=&fmt=&header=



Cheers Ajax
 
Ajax said:
Just ordered a Residex report on Redfern. It predicts capital growth of 15% per annum for the next 8 years, thereafter 13% per annum.

I also ordered a Residex report for a family member for Pymble-it predicts 9% growth per annum.

At this rate of capital growth the median Redfern house price will be more than the median Pymble house price in about 15 years (I liked that comparison).

Cheers Ajax


It's relevant from the investors point of view, but the average person who buys in Pymble buys there for different reasons , and wouldn't be looking at Redfern.

I'll be intereseted to see if Residex are any better at predicting growth than interest rates. I bought their reports prior to buying in Brisbane in 2002. I'm glad I didn't rely on their growth predictions in determining where I bought.

See Change
 
G'day John/See change,

Point taken on ability of Residex to predict the future with any great accuracy.

The Residex report I have is for the 2016 postcode-Redfern (and seems to apply to both houses and apartments). I would always try to buy a house here-as its the land value that makes what otherwise may be a dump so valuable. The report states predicted future for 2016 postcode-% pa next 3 years 14%-16%, next 5 years 14%-16%, next 8 years 12-14%. Median rentals for last quater 4.2%

Also did one for Waverley, postcode 2024. Next 3 years 12-14%, next 5 years 10-12%, next 8 years 10-12% Median rentals last quarter 4%


Ajax
 
nice to see that the redfern thread is still alive and kicking :)

now that i have been able to again free up my time a little, i hope to continue my study of the redfern residential market.

ajax, any predictions for the lower end of surry hill by comparison - eg commonwealth st?

this one is definitely out of my price range but curious to know if there is any development potential for a property like this one

http://www.realestate.com.au/cgi-bi...0&p=10&t=res&ty=&snf=rbs&ag=&cu=&fmt=&header=

cheers,

julie
 
Hi Alpina,

I don't know too much about Surry Hills-when I looked years ago properties were always just out of my price range.

That property in Darlington is interesting-10 bedrooms, 2 bathrooms, one car space-a lot of property for $900k. Would be interesting to know the income it is generating. You would also do well to look at the Redfern-Waterloo authority plan to see if road tunnels are planned near this area. Some parts of Abercrombie Street (not sure where in Abercrombie Street this property is) are also very close to the block-assaults and breakins may be more likely in this case though students may not be at too much risk.


Ajax
 
I'll be intereseted to see if Residex are any better at predicting growth than interest rates. I bought their reports prior to buying in Brisbane in 2002. I'm glad I didn't rely on their growth predictions in determining where I bought.

See Change


So their predictions were way off re Logan area SC.

A bit dissapointing to hear,as id read in the past pretty much only good things re their growth predictions.
 
Saw Geoff Doidge and Paul Eslick interviewed on tv last night, advisng a property investor how to approach buying an IP in Brisbane. Apart from using the internet to check for listed properties they also suggested using geosat scans of the suburb, RPdata and Residex reports.

One of them (I think it was Geoff) commented that Residex's future price predictions are about 90% accurate. I'll happily take Residex's forecast 14-16% growth per annum for the next 8 years (with 90% accuracy) for Redfern. Applying "the rule of 72" at 15% p.a. prices should more than double in the next 5 years.


Ajax
 
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