Refinancing. Real return on invested money

Hi folks
This thought may generate some discussion.
I have long been of the opinion that the quicker I get my money back from an investment means the better the investment whether it be from growth, cash flow or differing degrees of both.
Here is an example:
If I were to invest $100K of my money into a property
that is valued at $500K @ 80% LVR
7.5%pa I/O loan
Coupled with a historical area growth rate of 10%pa
With a rent of $500pw
And extra holding costs (not including loan repayments) @ 25% of the rent

Would mean in "a perfect world" I would be able to refinance the property at the end of year 4 and take my original investment back (including the aggregated extra holding costs) to go to work somewhere else leaving only the continuing aggregated annual shortfall to be reconciled at the next refinancing opportunity.
Furthermore, although the % rate of return on my invested money is falling as the years go by (37.62%p/a at end of year 1, down to 35.34%p/a at the time of refinance at the end of year 4) the refinanced investment is only the cost of the total borrowed funds plus aggregated future holding costs. Which would send the return on invested funds to a new high around 1745.38%pa at the end of the first year after refinancing (based on 5% return on new property value).I do not include the added equity in the scenario as it is trapped or locked into the investment and is still not accessable unless the property is sold or refinanced at a higher LVR.
This is the way I think in regard to investing in property when the desire to build a sizeable portfolio is the goal.
My emphasis is not so much on the actual return from rent (although it is a critical component needed to balance the holding costs and sustain the investment) but more so, the longer term return of my money through capital growth.
 
Last edited:
Hi Simon
It is nice to be reminded of how to make it quickly in property.Your master plan puts an end to the theory that property is a long term investment.

Thanks for your post.
Mark
 
Hi Simon
It is nice to be reminded of how to make it quickly in property.Your master plan puts an end to the theory that property is a long term investment.

Thanks for your post.
Mark

Hi Mark
For me the secret to investing is leverage with other peoples money. The controling factor though is the cost of that money.
Simon
 
Hi Mark
For me the secret to investing is leverage with other peoples money. The controling factor though is the cost of that money.
Simon
Yes I agree.
Leverage is probably the most beneficial aspect of property investment and the reason why property beats all other forms of investment. However too much leverage can be an investors undoing but it can also make him rich. The cost of the money should be met by the return on the investment.
 
Last edited:
Hi Mark
Just out of interest I have attached the calculator SS that I used to formulate my example.
I have since refined the calculator so the reinvested % return is different than in my example but the principal of the exercise is still in tact.
Enjoy
Simon
 

Attachments

  • calculator.xls
    42.5 KB · Views: 87
Would mean in "a perfect world" I would be able to refinance the property at the end of year 4 and take my original investment back (including the aggregated extra holding costs) to go to work somewhere else leaving only the continuing aggregated annual shortfall to be reconciled at the next refinancing opportunity.

Simon,

Are you capitalising interest? Do you make repayments to one loan from another?

MJK:D
 
Hi MJK
Good to hear from you:)
What I have shared above is a calculation for refinancing strategies. It is not a strategy in itself. It is just the way one can see clearly how their real "hurt" money is working for them. As I said to Mark it is the leverage of other folks money that is the key to property investing not so much the return from the rental income. What one does with the reclaimed equity after refinancing is really up to the investors and their individual strategies.
As for my strategy I always try to reinvest the equity retrieved into growing or maintaining/updating the portfolio. I have no other income other than the rents and sales of my portfolio. That is why leveraged growth is so important to me. My strategy is very money intensive so it always pays me well to hold large amounts of funds in offsets and lines of credit ready to be used for both opportunity or defence these funds come from the boom segments. At present I am going through a defensive segment but am optimistic about the future of my portfolio.
Hope this helps
Simon
 
Hi Simon
Would it be wiser or safer to hold a portion of your portfolio to provide your income rather than rely on leveraged growth?

Just a thought
Mark
 
Simon
Just put aside $10m of property at 5% return to provide your personal income and pay any unexpected costs and interest payments. There maybe even be some left over to pay off mortgages as they fall due.

Of course it does not have to be $10m I just like round fiqures.

cheers
 
Simon
Just put aside $10m of property at 5% return to provide your personal income and pay any unexpected costs and interest payments. There maybe even be some left over to pay off mortgages as they fall due.

Of course it does not have to be $10m I just like round fiqures.

cheers

Ha Ha:)
If I did that I would feel guilty that I was not leveraging enough.:D
The other main player in my strategy is the LVR and if it spirals out of control them I'm out of the game, so to speak.
Normal annual growth of around 8 to 10% on a $10ml portfolio would be 800 to 1000K and if it costs 400K to hold and run the portfolio then you are still ahead. The trick is accessing the new equity as it grows. I find it is relatively easy when you are using some of it to grow the asset base further.
Simon
 
Hi MJK
Good to hear from you:)
What I have shared above is a calculation for refinancing strategies. It is not a strategy in itself. It is just the way one can see clearly how their real "hurt" money is working for them. As I said to Mark it is the leverage of other folks money that is the key to property investing not so much the return from the rental income. What one does with the reclaimed equity after refinancing is really up to the investors and their individual strategies.
As for my strategy I always try to reinvest the equity retrieved into growing or maintaining/updating the portfolio. I have no other income other than the rents and sales of my portfolio. That is why leveraged growth is so important to me. My strategy is very money intensive so it always pays me well to hold large amounts of funds in offsets and lines of credit ready to be used for both opportunity or defence these funds come from the boom segments. At present I am going through a defensive segment but am optimistic about the future of my portfolio.
Hope this helps
Simon

Ha Ha Simon,

You'd make a good politician. :D I've been trying to get a straight answer from you on this one for 3 -1/2 years!!!;)

MJK:D :D
 
Ha Ha Simon,

You'd make a good politician. :D I've been trying to get a straight answer from you on this one for 3 -1/2 years!!!;)

MJK:D :D

Heaven forbid!:eek: I don't like lying.
Maybe you just havent asked the right question of me yet
In regard to capitalizing interest I could be wrong but that seems only relative from a taxation perspective and if one is not making enough money from income and sales to actually pay income tax then it is not a big issue. But if your portfolio is self sustaining then in my mind it really does not matter where the funds to sustain the shortfall come from. I don't think that it is possible to capitalize interest on interest with property but you are allowed to borrow to sustain other shortfalls and maintenance. I am not an accountant so I could well be wrong on that point.
Cheers
Simon
 
Ha Ha:)
If I did that I would feel guilty that I was not leveraging enough.:D
The other main player in my strategy is the LVR and if it spirals out of control them I'm out of the game, so to speak.
Normal annual growth of around 8 to 10% on a $10ml portfolio would be 800 to 1000K and if it costs 400K to hold and run the portfolio then you are still ahead. The trick is accessing the new equity as it grows. I find it is relatively easy when you are using some of it to grow the asset base further.
Simon

Hi Simon
Yes I agree, not enough leverage would be irresponsible.
After reconsidering your strategy I think you are right and I would change the net $10m figure I mentioned to a gross $10m. Provided it is in permanent property investment and producing a sizeable cashflow.

cheers
Mark
 
In regard to capitalizing interest I could be wrong but that seems only relative from a taxation perspective and if one is not making enough money from income and sales to actually pay income tax then it is not a big issue.

I don't think that it is possible to capitalize interest on interest with property but you are allowed to borrow to sustain other shortfalls and maintenance. I am not an accountant so I could well be wrong on that point.
Cheers
Simon

Yes, quite right if you have no income to show then the legality of capitalising interest from a tax perspective is a mute point. Your point is a good one. For me my portfolio is positive cashflow using a mix of Managed funds & property so it is not a mute point for me. I also still have a J.O.B.

Yes borrowing for maintainence,rates,insurance and improvements etc. is fine from my perspective also. The major expense in a property portfolio is interest though.

Anyway I dont want to tangent to far away from the original topic.

MJK:D
 
Hi Simon
Yes I agree, not enough leverage would be irresponsible.
After reconsidering your strategy I think you are right and I would change the net $10m figure I mentioned to a gross $10m. Provided it is in permanent property investment and producing a sizeable cashflow.

cheers
Mark

Hi Mark
All I ever wanted was that my property portfolio become a vehicle for a better lifestyle for my family and me. The strategy I used was one that suited both the market and myself at that time. I am sure there are 101 ways to make a great outcome from property investing and I hope discussion like this is of benefit to those coming through the mire.
regards
Simon
 
Hi Mark
All I ever wanted was that my property portfolio become a vehicle for a better lifestyle for my family and me. The strategy I used was one that suited both the market and myself at that time. I am sure there are 101 ways to make a great outcome from property investing and I hope discussion like this is of benefit to those coming through the mire.
regards
Simon

Hi Simon

I think your strategy suites the market right now. Particularly for someone starting out because when the market rises ( and that should be sometime around 10 ish tomorrow morning ) their high debt level will then be of little concern.


Mark
 
Hi Simon

I think your strategy suites the market right now. Particularly for someone starting out because when the market rises ( and that should be sometime around 10 ish tomorrow morning ) their high debt level will then be of little concern.


Mark

Can I have a lend of your crystal ball:)
 
Back
Top