self manage vs PM?
- Thread starter gooroo
- Start date
I live in the same area as our IPs and I was 15 when my parents bought their first IP and I was about 18 when I bought a share with my dad in my first IP (30 years ago).
Neither my parents nor I have ever paid a cent to a PM (except for the rare occasions when a PM has found a tenant for us in return for one week's rent). All the forms are available on line from the RTA and they are most helpful if you need to call them. Not sure about other states.
I will be shot down in flames, but I have never checked a reference. I go on "gut" feeling, and over 30 years I have had less than a handful of problems from the dozens of tenants I have placed. My parents have taken two lots of tenants to the tribunal, and won the case each time, so our dealings with the tribunal have been fantastic and fair. We have had one landlord insurance claim in all that time.
I need the 8% (or whatever) in my pocket. I also note with interest that PMs need to be "managed" even more than some tenants.
Maybe it is because from age 15 I grew up dealing (via my parents) with being a landlord that I don't find it daunting or difficult at all.
Neither my parents nor I have ever paid a cent to a PM (except for the rare occasions when a PM has found a tenant for us in return for one week's rent). All the forms are available on line from the RTA and they are most helpful if you need to call them. Not sure about other states.
I will be shot down in flames, but I have never checked a reference. I go on "gut" feeling, and over 30 years I have had less than a handful of problems from the dozens of tenants I have placed. My parents have taken two lots of tenants to the tribunal, and won the case each time, so our dealings with the tribunal have been fantastic and fair. We have had one landlord insurance claim in all that time.
I need the 8% (or whatever) in my pocket. I also note with interest that PMs need to be "managed" even more than some tenants.
Maybe it is because from age 15 I grew up dealing (via my parents) with being a landlord that I don't find it daunting or difficult at all.
I've decided it personally don't have the time, or the right personality to self manage. The way I see it is that I pay the PM to never have a problem. If he picks the right tenant the money is well earned even if he has to do nothing else except for a follow up once a year.
The one time I did self manage the whole thing fell down in flames. I also figured out my hourly rate to fix the problem was less than $1 per hour. The stress was even worse.
The one time I did self manage the whole thing fell down in flames. I also figured out my hourly rate to fix the problem was less than $1 per hour. The stress was even worse.
i am begining to take the view that my PM is not very good... getting more inclined to self managed though I must say it would be impossible when I go overseas...
i own inner city apartments so it's probably easier to manage as well...
however i think where they are useful is on the exit if they can get the tenant to clean the place up to a good standard... somehow i don't think i could do that...
i own inner city apartments so it's probably easier to manage as well...
however i think where they are useful is on the exit if they can get the tenant to clean the place up to a good standard... somehow i don't think i could do that...
As an agent i obviously have a bias on this one.
I can see the benefits to both ways, particularly when as a landlord you want a fair amount of involvement in the property. However i think if a PM is selecte carefully then it can be beneficial. Even as an agent i would never self manage for a couple of reasons
1. There is a buffer between me and the tenants. Therefore not becoming emotionally involved in the tenant - feeling sorry for them etc.
2. in my personal life i tend to get quite firey when things dont go my way, i would be worried about blowing up at a tenant inappropriately if something went wrong.
3. if i am no longer in the industry, and was working full time else where i dont think i would keep up with changes in legislation. Its the agents full time job to be aware of these things and make sure the landlord complies.
4. all the financial side of things is handled and reported to me neatly in a nice little statement to hand to my accountant.
I can see the benefits to both ways, particularly when as a landlord you want a fair amount of involvement in the property. However i think if a PM is selecte carefully then it can be beneficial. Even as an agent i would never self manage for a couple of reasons
1. There is a buffer between me and the tenants. Therefore not becoming emotionally involved in the tenant - feeling sorry for them etc.
2. in my personal life i tend to get quite firey when things dont go my way, i would be worried about blowing up at a tenant inappropriately if something went wrong.
3. if i am no longer in the industry, and was working full time else where i dont think i would keep up with changes in legislation. Its the agents full time job to be aware of these things and make sure the landlord complies.
4. all the financial side of things is handled and reported to me neatly in a nice little statement to hand to my accountant.
I just took that plunge afer the pm got a new tennant. They ticked all the boxes on the applciatoin ok so i thought let's do this - the pm hadn't done anything on time for way too long (inspections/rent reviews/even repairs weren't actioned!) except rent paymetns & statements..so I got pettilty annoyed and kept thinking 8.5% + GST
I have your concerns re the end of lease, and also Alabex's 2nd point too....
However, a lot of things are dealt with in writing, hence let's you keep a buisness like approach which will be more effective anyway..
And, when you do deal with them directly, prepare to what you will say , focus on the business / issue, not the emoition or the reasons why and you should be fine.
There is always the possiblity of going back to an agent, which is my current leaning when these tenants say they're leaving.. however, the next 10-11 months experiences will help me make that decision...
Met the tenants and told them I'm straight onto the recently borken fence, here's the repalcement exhaust fan (he's a sparky & offered to chuck it in) "if that's still ok with you ?".
Told him I prefer not to get in his & his wife's way, theye've rented it, it's theirs so to speak.. I won;t sticky beack by offering to cut the lawn & peer through the back sliding door into see if the kitchen's clean....
I want you to tell me if something goes wrong or if something needs repairing.
WA Tenancy rules state no reciept is necessary if rent is paid via direct debit like you're paying - however, I reconcile the rent on a pretty simple s/sheet which I can send to you monthly, or weekly reciepts are fine if you prefer.
He thought the mthly statment was fine... Anything wrong (rent was late by 2 days 1 week) and it will show up in the statment... They've signed for 12 months, I plan on sending them a statement strating from the day they moved in each month, it won't be that long...).
So they will know what I know and am keeping track of, hopefully they'll pay on time etc
I rememberd a guy I rented off who handled the paperwork for his dad (dad still got the rent dircetly though (might be 'dumb', but not that dumb). I ws impressed at how easy he made it and how striagh tdown th eline he was - he obviosuly knew mor ethan me & was as good as an agent ! rent was never late & the place was cleaned when I left
Twice I've used a PM and apart from the cost that I could ill afford at the time, they weren't that great. With a one bed flat the pm was unaware that at least 7 people were using the flat in shifts around the clock!!
Then on two occassions I've managed properties myself and it has been okay. One particular tenant was not so pleasant to deal with when he couldn't pay the rent but things worked out in the end.
Then on two occassions I've managed properties myself and it has been okay. One particular tenant was not so pleasant to deal with when he couldn't pay the rent but things worked out in the end.
Hi Wylie
Like you, my Dad self managed all his IPs, most of the time we have been lucky.
However, on the two occasions we have been to the tribunal it has been a stressful ordeal.
The last tenant had detailed knowledge of his rights. He even wrote out a post dated cheque, due on the day the bond was to be released!
Like you, my Dad self managed all his IPs, most of the time we have been lucky.
However, on the two occasions we have been to the tribunal it has been a stressful ordeal.
The last tenant had detailed knowledge of his rights. He even wrote out a post dated cheque, due on the day the bond was to be released!
Or let someone who knows what they are doing do it all for you
You cannot write in things that contradict the act, you will be fined and this is the number one downfall with self managing. Landlords not knowing the law.
Remeber also the richest people in the world value time over money so you need to decide on what your time is worth or whether you would rather be a landlord or an investor!
Personally although I own the management company that manages my properties I never get involved in the management!
It's 6.30 on a Saturday night and you guys are online debating self manage vs using a PM.
You ought to get out more.
Hang on .. what am I doing here?
You ought to get out more.
Hang on .. what am I doing here?
Because my nights start at about 11pm......
Us old blokes are in bed, asleep by then.
Nickolina I found every form I needed on one site online and I simply downloaded them. Here in WA The Department of Employer and Consumer Protection is the font of all knowledge in relation to tenants and landlords. They posted me an Owners Guide to "Renting out Property". They also gave me a tenants version that outlines their rights and responsibilities and I actually gave it to my tenant and I'll request the department to send me another one. You will have a similar government body in the state where your IP is.
I bet you needed to wheel the "Rights" handbook / epistle / tome in with a sack trolley.
The "Responsibilities" piece of tissue paper had what on it, one little item ?? Tenant must breathe, but if they really don't wish to, the Landlord must assist them to the full extent of the Law in this activity. For all other responsibilities, please refer to Landlord's handbook...
LOL... if I could only be a fly on the wall... this sounds like it would make for an hilarious reality TV show.
Personally although I own the management company that manages my properties I never get involved in the management!
Now that sounds like the ultimate solution for PM difficulties! I like... I like.... One way to ensure your interests are always put first!
LOL... if I could only be a fly on the wall... this sounds like it would make for an hilarious reality TV show.
What's so funny? Atleast im giving it a go...! We all have to start somewhere! You can Keep sarcastic comments like that to yourself in the future.
Reason why i asked was because i wasn't sure if there was a kit with all the forms etc that i could pick up from somewhere or if it was a matter of me drafting up my own lease agreement.... regardless i have picked up the tenancy handbook from fair trading, and will be taking it from here on...
Nikolina, the
smilie means that you are not supposed to take the comment seriously. As in "this is my comment but I'm only kidding, its a joke" Everyone here wants to help out. We can't always be 100% serious.
