Smoke alarm compliance

[travelbug]

What about hard wired ones?

Ours are ard wired and just received "the" letter. Well a few.

Trying to find what the legislation says about maintenance.

Thanks

Just found this. Seriously $550 for risking people lives.

Noncompliance is an offence and may carry fines that amount to as much as $550. This is the maximum penalty that could be the result of not adhering to smoke alarm regulation guidelines and it shows just how serious smoke alarm compliance is.

 

[xanh]

Not sure that anybody (here, at least) is deliberately not complying with the law.

To me, there is just confusion in who should do what and exactly what that is.

Yes, landlords need to make sure smoke alarms are installed and working prior to a new tenant entering. According to the RTA, the tenant is responsible once the lease has commenced.

To me, the confusing part is the testing/maintenance. Is testing just pressing the button? or does it extend to using simulated smoke? The RTA merely mentions testing (or minimal words to that effect) but I don't think there's ever been any clear definition of what an adequate test is. Personally, I think the 'test' button is enough, as it should do what it describes. Seems reasonable. PMs are saying there's more to it but thats only as a result of the fire alarm companies having a lend of their ear. I hear plenty of opinions but don't see any concrete definition and the legislation hasn't really changed in that regard (Vic).

 

[S.T]

I'm of the firm belief that any testing should be only carried out as per the manufacturers instructions. Most of them will state just pressing the test button and keeping the unit clear of dust is sufficient.

 

[Scott No Mates]

What about hard wired ones?

Ours are ard wired and just received "the" letter. Well a few.

Trying to find what the legislation says about maintenance.

Thanks

Just found this. Seriously $550 for risking people lives.

Noncompliance is an offence and may carry fines that amount to as much as $550. This is the maximum penalty that could be the result of not adhering to smoke alarm regulation guidelines and it shows just how serious smoke alarm compliance is.

There are plenty of companies out there which provide the annual testing service (at a small cost of course). As an owner, you are obliged to have the unit tested & working at the start of each tenancy including battery replacement. (Most agents will call in the handyman/sparky to change the battery as they aren't sufficiently skilled to change a battery/press a button & sign the liability).

 

[travelbug]

There are plenty of companies out there which provide the annual testing service (at a small cost of course). As an owner, you are obliged to have the unit tested & working at the start of each tenancy including battery replacement. (Most agents will call in the handyman/sparky to change the battery as they aren't sufficiently skilled to change a battery/press a button & sign the liability).

Yes I am aware of that (from the letters i received). I'm tryinmg to find out what my obligation is.

They are hardwired and not all hardwired units installed when we did major renos and then got new tenants. So I've done the test with new tenants.
I'm not paying someone a thousand dollars (when you add them all up) to press a few buttons when I can go around and do them all in half a day. IF that is legally what I can do.

 

[MelbGal]

Hi,

I just receive a letter from my pm and it asked me to join the smoke alarm maintenance company.

I have a landlord insurance, does it cover any liability arises from the smoke alarm malfunction?

Does everyone always maintain the smoke alarms in their IP? If yes, is it DIY or pay for smoke alarm company service?


Thanks in advance.

I pay something like $75 per annum to ensure that the smoke alarms are working and compliant. If extra work is needed repairs/replacement then this is on top of the above fee. Gives me peace of mind.

 

[x452]

I pay something like $75 per annum to ensure that the smoke alarms are working and compliant. If extra work is needed repairs/replacement then this is on top of the above fee. Gives me peace of mind.

That sounds like a decent price can you share the name of the company or sparky that you use and in what area?

I've got quotes from $99-$130 excluding parts.

 

[type_one]

Seems to me there are lots of opinions on this but one thing is consistent. The legislation is unclear on responsibility if something should happen. To say it?s the landlords responsibility to have a working smoke alarm at the start of the agreement if fine. But how do you ever prove it either way. I think you would be hard pressed to find a case where a landlord was prosecuted if they have said they did have a working smoke alarm. I think there are some examples in here of landlord seeing sued but those were big buildings that fall under fire legislation not just smoke alarms. That?s a whole other industry.

My main concern with my agent was getting me to sign a form to say I accept liability. That right there, will negate most insurance claims. Your insurance company generally can wash their hands if you starts negotiations. Check even your motor policy. Usually the same. So is the real estate agent accepting liability that they provided advice that means my insurance is invalid. They could unknowingly be getting themselves into even more trouble. Are they even licensed to give insurance/financial advice. Surely that?s a potential breach of some legislation right there.

And as for these alleged ?compliance? companies, show me where they are recognised by a government department as having an authority to do these checks anyway. By default it could be argued the landlord didn?t do the checks so are therefore in breach. These companies seem to be building the famous middleman industry. What?s to say a court doesn?t just say ?they are not recognised as an authority by anyone except themselves?, therefore the landlord is in the same boat. Can my real estate agent GUARANTEE by doing this compliance check I will not be held liable if there is a fire. I would love to hear if someone has asked them to sign onto that agreement. I bet not an agent on the planet would sign such an agreement. I bet even the compliance company would not sign such an agreement.

 

[Burramys]

Type one, you have posed some very good questions. I was offered an inspection service by a PM and declined for the reasons that you gave above. Also, the alarm is new, hard-wired and installed by a sparky, with batteries changed regularly. Whilst some cleaning will need to be done from time to time, the alar should last for ages. It will be replaced at about year eight, before the end of the use-by period.

 

[x452]

"Code 135 Residential Tenancy Agreement" states:

20. Smoke Detectors
20.1 The tenant must conduct regular checks to ensure smoke detectors are in proper working order. If the landlord, the agent, or their contractors provide information to the tenant about how to conduct a check. (Note: regular checks are a requirement for the safety of occupants and security of the rented premises)

20.2 The tenant must as soon as practicable notify the landlord or the agent if a smoke detector is not in proper working order.

20.3 The tenant must replace expired or faulty smoke detector batteries with replacement batteries, as the need arises. In any event, on the day in each year proclaimed as the commencement of summer time (daylight saving), the tenant must replace smoke detector batteries with replacement batteries.

20.4 "Replacement batteries" means batteries that are new, of a reputable brand, and of appropriate durability.


So it sounds like the responsibility for yearly checks and battery replacement lies with the tenant. With the landlord being responsible for ensuring the smoke alarm is working at the start of the lease agreement and not near end-of-life and replace if it is.

How often are you supposed to replace the stand-alone battery operated smoke alarms roughly?

 

[jamontoast]

from RTA & REIQ - for QLD

Hi Wylie,
This is no longer quite correct.
- The tenant is still responsible if the battery goes flat within the tenancy however it is the landlord who is responsible for changing the battery and ensuring it works at the start of a NEW and RENEWAL of tenancy..

http://www.rta.qld.gov.au/Resources/Fact-Sheets/General-tenancy-fact-sheets/Smoke-alarms-fact-sheet

"
Under the Fire and Rescue Service Act 1990, administered by Queensland Fire and Rescue Service, both tenants and lessors have responsibilities for smoke alarms in their rental properties.

Tenants: Have obligations for cleaning, testing and replacing batteries for alarms during a tenancy.
Lessors: Have obligations for installing, cleaning and testing smoke alarms and replacing batteries before the start or renewal of a tenancy.
See easy reference table for specific details."

Again
http://www.reiq.com/renting/smoke-alarm-legislation-rental-properties

LESSOR OBLIGATIONS

The lessor must clean and test all smoke alarms at the property within 30 days of the start of a tenancy. This includes renewal agreements.


HERES AN EXAMPLE

If a tenant enters into a six-month tenancy agreement and the lessor offers a renewal agreement at the end of the current agreement, the lessor obligation to clean and test all alarms within 30 days of the start of an agreement again applies.

If it is found that the battery is flat or almost flat at the time of cleaning and testing the alarm, the lessor must replace the battery immediately. If the alarm fails, other than because the battery is flat during a tenancy, the lessor must replace or repair the alarm.

The lessor must replace the alarm before it reaches the ends of its service life.

TENANT OBLIGATIONS

Tenants must replace the battery if the battery is flat or almost flat during a tenancy.

The tenant must clean and test the alarms during a tenancy only if:

? They have a 12 month agreement or longer; or

? They are on a periodic tenancy that is 12 months or longer in duration.

If a tenancy is less than 12 months in length, or a periodic tenancy that is less than 12 months in length, the obligations to clean and test an alarm cannot be passed onto the tenant.

In Queensland the landlord changes the battery and tests the alarms at the start of each tenancy... not sure of other states, and between the start of a tenancy or the signing of a new lease for a further tenancy (same tenants) the tenants themselves are responsible for changing the batteries.

Please check this, but this is my recollection (without checking it).

 

[jamontoast]

What it doesn't quite say is though... do you need to provide proof or evidence that it has been checked or signed?

 

[The Fence]

That there is the sticking point that causes these threads.

We check & replace batteries ourselves but make sure 2 or more people at the time, so a witness.

Better still, get the tenants to witness that they work with new batteries installed and sign off on it (condition report).

In fact last 10 years we have the tenants go around with us doing the condition report together. Works out well and tenants happy with transparency.

 

[ChrisA1]

That there is the sticking point that causes these threads.

We check & replace batteries ourselves but make sure 2 or more people at the time, so a witness.

Better still, get the tenants to witness that they work with new batteries installed and sign off on it (condition report).

In fact last 10 years we have the tenants go around with us doing the condition report together. Works out well and tenants happy with transparency.

Great approach! I like getting the tenants to witness the working smoke alarms.

 

[The Fence]

Great approach! I like getting the tenants to witness the working smoke alarms.

......and everything else !

 

[wylie]

In Queensland the landlord changes the battery and tests the alarms at the start of each tenancy... not sure of other states, and between the start of a tenancy or the signing of a new lease for a further tenancy (same tenants) the tenants themselves are responsible for changing the batteries.

Hi Wylie,
This is no longer quite correct.
- The tenant is still responsible if the battery goes flat within the tenancy however it is the landlord who is responsible for changing the battery and ensuring it works at the start of a NEW and RENEWAL of tenancy..

I think I probably didn't make that clear. I meant that between the start of the initial tenancy and the renewal of the next lease the tenant must change a battery if it starts beeping. It is clearly spelt out in the RTA sheet that at lease start and any renewal, the landlord must change the battery, clean and test the alarm. I just didn't say it too well

http://www.rta.qld.gov.au/Resources/Fact-Sheets/General-tenancy-fact-sheets/Smoke-alarms-fact-sheet

"
Under the Fire and Rescue Service Act 1990, administered by Queensland Fire and Rescue Service, both tenants and lessors have responsibilities for smoke alarms in their rental properties.

Tenants: Have obligations for cleaning, testing and replacing batteries for alarms during a tenancy.
Lessors: Have obligations for installing, cleaning and testing smoke alarms and replacing batteries before the start or renewal of a tenancy.
See easy reference table for specific details."

Again
http://www.reiq.com/renting/smoke-alarm-legislation-rental-properties

LESSOR OBLIGATIONS

The lessor must clean and test all smoke alarms at the property within 30 days of the start of a tenancy. This includes renewal agreements.


HERES AN EXAMPLE

If a tenant enters into a six-month tenancy agreement and the lessor offers a renewal agreement at the end of the current agreement, the lessor obligation to clean and test all alarms within 30 days of the start of an agreement again applies.

If it is found that the battery is flat or almost flat at the time of cleaning and testing the alarm, the lessor must replace the battery immediately. If the alarm fails, other than because the battery is flat during a tenancy, the lessor must replace or repair the alarm.

The lessor must replace the alarm before it reaches the ends of its service life.

TENANT OBLIGATIONS

Tenants must replace the battery if the battery is flat or almost flat during a tenancy.

The tenant must clean and test the alarms during a tenancy only if:

? They have a 12 month agreement or longer; or

? They are on a periodic tenancy that is 12 months or longer in duration.

If a tenancy is less than 12 months in length, or a periodic tenancy that is less than 12 months in length, the obligations to clean and test an alarm cannot be passed onto the tenant.

Again, this is what I was trying to convey, but perhaps wasn't very clear.

What I would say in response to another post, is that until we decided to have Smoke Alarm Solutions do this, we used to change batteries at the start of any lease, and at the renewal of any lease, and we used to scratch onto the battery the date of installation. We would also cover ourselves by stating in the entry condition report that the batteries have been changed, alarm tested and cleaned, and each lease also contained that information.

Still, for $79 per property, we now have this done by a specialist company. That is $79 which saves us lugging a ladder over there, plus the peace of mind that they carry insurance should the worst happen.

 

[Burramys]

The reno is nearing completion. New floors in places, new kitchen, half a bathroom, new ensuite, new floor coverings, new lights, new switch box, new HWS, walls fixed, painted inside, insulation, new steps... I am of the view that this is a substantial renovation.

The BCA provides that landlords must ensure their rental property complies with Australian Standard 3786-1993 and installed smoke alarms as outlined in the Building Code of Australia (BCA) Part 3.7.2.3.

The BCA requires that any property built or substantially renovated after 1 July 1997 must have 240 volt hard-wired smoke alarms installed.

So I'm keen to have the smoke alarms - ten years old battery only - replaced with hard-wired linked (not sure of the term - one goes off the other goes off) to comply with BCA. The advice I have been given is that battery alarms are okay. Wot? Surely a reno as described above is substantial. Any comments?

 

[S.T]

I'd think if you're doing new lights and roof insulation, then it wouldn't be much more effort or cost to get new smoke alarms hard wired.

 

[MickStephens]

Reminds me we need to install new smoke alarms...

 

[Shaz331]

the legislation is slightly different to every state - so check with the relevent electrical licenceing board for your area.
i can tell you that in WA - a rental property is required to have 2 x RCDs and a minimum of 1 smoke alarm.

if you have bedrooms in just 1 part of the house - 1 smoke alarm is sufficient
if you have bedrooms in the front and in the back of the house - then you will need 2 smoke alarms
technically if you are doins student lets and each bedroom has a lock on the door - they all require smoke alarms

hard wired smoke alarms are required unless you have a concrete roof - and then you can get an exemption to install 10 year lithium battery operated alarms instead.

and they only have to be interconnected smoke alarms for new builds. energy safety WA have just revoked the condition that they have to be interconnected for existing buildings as many of the sparkies complained that it was just not practical to do so.

hope this helps

Sharon