Smoke alarm service

Hey all,

What requirements are there in QLD for smoke alarm servicing? Is changing the batteries enough? Or do I need to pay someone to check them for insurance and RTA compliance?
 
There are many threads on this. Have a look via the "search" button and you'll find more information than you can read in a day :D.
 
https://www.rta.qld.gov.au/Renting/During-a-tenancy/Maintenance-and-repairs/Smoke-alarms.aspx

Certficates and annual inspections etc are a scam run by dodgy sparkies to milk $99 per rental by suggesting the owner has obligations in excess of that in law. A 9V battery for $99 ??? That the tenant needs to pay for.

AS long as the battery is changed on tenancy change then the owner complies. The catch is end of life. The recommended life is 10 years. There isn't a use by date on most brands.
 
https://www.rta.qld.gov.au/Renting/During-a-tenancy/Maintenance-and-repairs/Smoke-alarms.aspx

Certficates and annual inspections etc are a scam run by dodgy sparkies to milk $99 per rental by suggesting the owner has obligations in excess of that in law. A 9V battery for $99 ??? That the tenant needs to pay for.

AS long as the battery is changed on tenancy change then the owner complies. The catch is end of life. The recommended life is 10 years. There isn't a use by date on most brands.

I don't think it is fair to call it a scam. We never paid for these checks, but when we were offered three years for $60 per property per year, and they carry insurance, we thought "why not?".

I'm glad we did because we had four out of date alarms (that would have meant bankruptcy for us had a fire happened). We also didn't have enough alarms in some properties, or they were placed wrongly. These things could have really hurt us had there been a fire.

They also have, through circumstances, called at a couple of properties three times in the first year. We did everything by the book, scratched the date into the batteries, marked it on entry condition reports and the lease, but missed the out of date alarms themselves.

It is one thing that I'm happy to have a professional take care of. I don't have to lug a ladder around, or lug a husband around to get up the ladder each time we start a lease.

I do, however, think the "blind cord" check is a bit rich (brought up in a recent thread). I won't have any window coverings with cords anyway.
 
Certficates and annual inspections etc are a scam run by dodgy sparkies to milk $99 per rental by suggesting the owner has obligations in excess of that in law.
By "in law", I assume you mean the statutory minimums. But what gives you confidence that the common law duty of care isn't higher than the regulatory minimum?
 
By "in law", I assume you mean the statutory minimums. But what gives you confidence that the common law duty of care isn't higher than the regulatory minimum?

In my uneducated legal opinion i think everyone can rely on the statutory time limit.
 
In my uneducated legal opinion i think everyone can rely on the statutory time limit.
In my not-a-lawyer-but-a-law-student opinion, relying on statute would be a bad idea. :)

To try to draw an analogy that should make sense, imagine you're driving on a stretch of road that has a 60km/h speed limit. Then imagine it starts raining heavily and you go around a sharp corner. If you take the corner at 60, you're not breaking any law because it's within the posted speed limit. But if you have an accident under such circumstances, your negligence will almost certainly be found to be the cause of any damage to property and people that results.

Statute sets the absolute minimum standard of behaviour expected, below which one may be prosecuted for failing to attain that level.

Whether that standard is adequate to save you from an allegation of negligence is a somewhat different matter.
 
Being a tight landlord I usually go with the minimum which is only on tenancy change however in reality I have found smoke detectors missing, broken, beeping because the tenant hasn't changed the battery, etc...

Given REA's backing away from confirming compliance, insurers penchant for denying claims wherever possible, the risk to tenants (even if it's their responsibility), the $99 per year while daylight robbery for the task at hand is really bugger all compared to the possible outcomes.

Andrew
 
Does this Photoelectric And Monoxide Lithium Smoke Alarm for $85 at Bunnings sound to good or what?

No batteries to change or for tenants to take out,10 year life span,

http://www.bunnings.com.au/first-alert-photoelectric-and-monoxide-lithium-smoke-alarm-_p4210885
Sounds great for a PPOR without hard-wired alarms, for sure.

For an IP, as a landlord I'd want to check:

1) Given that many statutes require alarm changes between tenants, would they exempt this requirement for such a product? (Legislation obviously wasn't drafted with such a product in mind, alas.)

2) What are the requirements for quantity and positioning?

The second point is the one that many people seem to overlook with regards to their duty of care towards tenants with respect to fire safety. Apart from your statutory obligation to have alarms and have charged batteries, etc., it's likely that a landlord's common law duty of care extends to ensuring that they have an appropriate quantity of smoke alarms, and that they're positioned correctly. Most landlords don't have that knowledge and expertise.

If you do it yourself, and get it wrong, you'll almost certainly be found to have breached your duty of care.

If you pay a smoke alarm service, and they get it wrong, your having hired experts to do it is likely to be enough to satisfy your duty of care. (Whether the experts did any better than you could have done or not.)
 
Sounds great for a PPOR without hard-wired alarms, for sure.

For an IP, as a landlord I'd want to check:

1) Given that many statutes require alarm changes between tenants, would they exempt this requirement for such a product? (Legislation obviously wasn't drafted with such a product in mind, alas.)
This would be worth looking into,especially seeing as I pay nearly $500 a year for the flats?

2) What are the requirements for quantity and positioning?
Quantity and positioning has already been sorted out by the professionals beforehand and unless there is a major change in the law,the amount and positioning will all be the same.

The second point is the one that many people seem to overlook with regards to their duty of care towards tenants with respect to fire safety. Apart from your statutory obligation to have alarms and have charged batteries, etc., it's likely that a landlord's common law duty of care extends to ensuring that they have an appropriate quantity of smoke alarms, and that they're positioned correctly. Most landlords don't have that knowledge and expertise.
Experts already hired and sorted

If you do it yourself, and get it wrong, you'll almost certainly be found to have breached your duty of care.

If you pay a smoke alarm service, and they get it wrong, your having hired experts to do it is likely to be enough to satisfy your duty of care. (Whether the experts did any better than you could have done or not.)
I have hard wired ionization smoke alarms at rentals at the moment,surely the upgrading to Photoelectric non tampering alarms is a safer bet,legally and morally.

I have just been to Masters where I upgraded all my PPOR hardwired ionization alarms to photoelectric (around $40 each)and I also have beside them new ionization smoke alarms with battery only.Apparently each type has a purpose and I have just found out you can buy a smoke alarm with both Photoelectric and ionization in one alarm.
 
I have hard wired ionization smoke alarms at rentals at the moment,surely the upgrading to Photoelectric non tampering alarms is a safer bet,legally and morally.

I have just been to Masters where I upgraded all my PPOR hardwired ionization alarms to photoelectric (around $40 each)and I also have beside them new ionization smoke alarms with battery only.Apparently each type has a purpose and I have just found out you can buy a smoke alarm with both Photoelectric and ionization in one alarm.

If you read the link I posted on another thread it appears the fire brigade doesn't support the dual alarms. I will try to find the link again. It spelt out the reason but I don't want to put it here in case I get it wrong.

This is the thread I think - http://somersoft.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1229656#post1229656
 
If you read the link I posted on another thread it appears the fire brigade doesn't support the dual alarms. I will try to find the link again. It spelt out the reason but I don't want to put it here in case I get it wrong.

This is the thread I think - http://somersoft.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1229656#post1229656

If I read it right it seems its best to have both types or a dual one,I cant see why if you update to photoelectric and the other is still up to date,why not leave the old one there.
After looking at prices and alarms today at Masters I was surprised at the low prices.


Experts recommend that a home have both ionization and photoelectric
alarms or dual alarms to ensure the fastest response to both flaming and smoldering fires.
 
It must have been somewhere else where the recommendation was not to have just dual ones. From memory is was due to one half going off with false alarms so people dismantle the alarm = nothing at all.
 
It must have been somewhere else where the recommendation was not to have just dual ones. From memory is was due to one half going off with false alarms so people dismantle the alarm = nothing at all.

I understand the problem that might arise in that situation,best to keep both types but in separate smoke alarms,
 
Does this Photoelectric And Monoxide Lithium Smoke Alarm for $85 at Bunnings sound to good or what?

No batteries to change or for tenants to take out,10 year life span,

http://www.bunnings.com.au/first-alert-photoelectric-and-monoxide-lithium-smoke-alarm-_p4210885

10 Year smoke alarms is becoming the norm, and has been in many other countries. Chubb released a range in the past 12 months as well, and to be honest, i'd stick with the known brands.
They have the same 10 year battery lithium battery life (non removable battery) in their range called "Worry Free"

Living Room - http://www.quell.com.au/collections/living-area-alarm-type/products/worry-free-living-area-alarm
Bedroom (Voice Alert) - http://www.quell.com.au/collections/bedroom-alarm-product-type/products/worry-free-bedroom-alarm
Hallway (LED Light for Escape Path) - http://www.quell.com.au/collections...-worry-free-hallway-photoelectric-smoke-alarm
Kitchen (Carbon Monoxide)- http://www.quell.com.au/collections/kitchen-alarm-product-type/products/worry-free-kitchen-alarm

All between $45-$65 at Bunnings.
 
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