Sydney renovators/builders Advice needed

[BestInvest]

Hi All,

I wanted the advice of a Sydney builder or someone in Sydney who already has undertaken something similar. I have never undertaken this, and want to see if its feasible or whether i am biting too much that i cant chew.

I wanted the steps in sequence of what you have to do from day one and next to it the rough ballpark price of doing it (i appreciate you have to see the job and size). If there are any Western Sydney builders who dont mind coming out on a saturday to inspect and give me a free quote or your thoughts, PM me your number.

THE SCENARIO:
Im considering buying a heritage listed terrace house that needs MAJOR renovations. The front wall must remain. What is there is basically the brick walls, you walk through the front door, there is no floor, you see the dirt ground and i think there are a few timber floor frame pieces running across. When you look up at the ceiling there is no gyprock, you see right through to the iron roof above. There is a dismantle electricity box at front, but there is no electricity/ power points/ or light switches (how would you run wires through the brick walls if you dont want the wires/electricty lines sitting on the wall?). No bathroom, i think there are pipes from the old toilet under the ground. there is no kitchen.

So basically picture a square brick terrace, like the ones you see in newtown sydney, 7 metres wide, about 10/12 metres deep. there are 2 rooms on one side, and the other side is the living /dining. no floor, iron roof, and the rest is the blank canvas.

If anyone has further questions please ask.

Appreciate your responses.

 

[DaveM]

Why western sydney builders? Why not someone a smidge more local who wont be charging you for 2 hours a day M4 parking allowance.

By the sounds of the place, you could drop 200k and it would touch the edges. I wouldnt be surprised if it costs 400k+ for a top notch build.

 

[wobbycarly]

WOW! Sounds like you like a challenge!

 

[Propertunity]

We recently purchased a double storey 4brm Victorian terrace for a client. Replaced 2 x bathrooms and a kitchen with all new plumbing, electrical, windows, floors, etc - the works. It came in around $200K.

So you are looking at somewhere between $100K and $200K easily.

 

[depreciator]

Way more than $400K If it's a shell I reckon Dave - the heritage listing adds a whole additional layer of complexity.

Not much point getting a builder over for a chat if you don't know what you want to do. No builder will volunteer a figure without some idea of the scope of works and level of finish.

 

[BestInvest]

Why western sydney builders? Why not someone a smidge more local who wont be charging you for 2 hours a day M4 parking allowance.

By the sounds of the place, you could drop 200k and it would touch the edges. I wouldnt be surprised if it costs 400k+ for a top notch build.

Hi Dave, the terrace is closer to Western Sydney. I doubt it will cost $400k, i could build a brand new double storey free standing house for a little over half that.

 

[BestInvest]

WOW! Sounds like you like a challenge!

YUP, i want to manufacture equity, however i need a good idea of what i am getting into and whether i can afford to maintain the loan + spend on the reno at the same time. My dad and I are quite handy and could do the painting and gyprocking ourselves etc. Never done anything like this before where a whole house needs it.

 

[depreciator]

A new build is always cheaper than the sort of job you're talking about.

 

[BestInvest]

We recently purchased a double storey 4brm Victorian terrace for a client. Replaced 2 x bathrooms and a kitchen with all new plumbing, electrical, windows, floors, etc - the works. It came in around $200K.

So you are looking at somewhere between $100K and $200K easily.

Hi Propertunity,

Thanks for your input. This one is single storey. I think my major cost would be the electrical wiring and the plumbing and installation of a whole bathroom. The rendering, painting, flooring, window installation, kitchen installation, gyprocking i could do myself or get friends and family to assist, and could buy off ebay or at auctions to save on costs.

I dnt want to be kidding myself, but im picturing the terrace, once the electricty is in, plumbing is in, my dad could re do the flooring and then once you render the walls and install the gyprock, its pretty much the home stretch....... if that costs say $60k, then based on what the agent says will be the est sale price, i could have manufactured $200k equity.

I would like advice on pit falls/ obstacles with the heritage listing, the agent said you keep the front wall untouched (which i am happy with) and the rest you can touch and spruce up (dont need to move or knock down any walls anyways as its such a simple floor plan).....

With the flooring, could you re-install the timber framework as it would have been, or would you have to do a suspended concrete floor? i had a friend who said with new building requirments you must do it concrete, but i dont think he knew what he was talking about.... hence wanted to hear form someone with the know....

 

[BestInvest]

Way more than $400K If it's a shell I reckon Dave - the heritage listing adds a whole additional layer of complexity.

Not much point getting a builder over for a chat if you don't know what you want to do. No builder will volunteer a figure without some idea of the scope of works and level of finish.

Hi depreciator, whats the complexity with the heritage listing, I am new to this, so I am naiave, however surely i could work within teh requirments.

I just want to make the house habitable, to an average level.

 

[depreciator]

First thing to do would be to talk to the local council about the heritage stuff. Take no notice of what the RE agent says. What suburb is the place in?
Do you have any photos?

 

[Nathan]

www.mytradespeople.com.au

This goes directly to the guys I use, I have calibrated my team of licensed builders and trades all around the place to do the same results at the same prices I pay.

Enjoy!

 

[akiwinut]

I dnt want to be kidding myself, but im picturing the terrace, once the electricty is in, plumbing is in, my dad could re do the flooring and then once you render the walls and install the gyprock, its pretty much the home stretch....... if that costs say $60k, then based on what the agent says will be the est sale price, i could have manufactured $200k equity.

I would like advice on pit falls/ obstacles with the heritage listing, the agent said you keep the front wall untouched (which i am happy with) and the rest you can touch and spruce up (dont need to move or knock down any walls anyways as its such a simple floor plan).....

With the flooring, could you re-install the timber framework as it would have been, or would you have to do a suspended concrete floor? i had a friend who said with new building requirments you must do it concrete, but i dont think he knew what he was talking about.... hence wanted to hear form someone with the know....

I think you would be looking at more like $100k to do the work, you would be surprised at how things start to add up.

Talk to your local council about the listing but its normally just retaining the front facade as original and any other external building works may need to be sympathetic to the surrounds.

Regarding the flooring, if your replacing the timber you generally need at least 400mm clearance between the dirt and the bottom of the bearer.
A slab may well be quicker and cheaper. I paid $8k for approx 50sqM slab. If it has to be pumped it will cost more.
Your looking at $6-8k to rewire, and at least $4k for the plumbing if its all new, add another $1k for a new HWS. Probably at least $4k for a simple bathroom if you can get cheap fittings and tiles and do the work yourself.
As for kitchens, really depends on the size of it, but at least $8k plus fittings.
Etc etc etc...

 

[depreciator]

Etc etc etc...

It's the etc etc etc where things can add up.

If you're just attempting to get it liveable, as opposed to doing something interesting, then it may cost more like $100K.

It's big job if the place has no floors, ceilings, bathroom or kitchen and needs rewiring and replumbing. I must be getting old.

What condition is the roof in?

If you're planning to do much of the work yourself, don't forget to factor in the holding costs - it's going to take you longer than a builder.


Akiwinut, a bloke I know recently did a reno on a terrace in Marrickville and put a slab downstairs. He reckoned it was much cheaper than timber floors. I have a feeling he may not have prepared it all that well, though. Goodness knows what the new owners will do if they start getting dampness coming up.

 

[ScottyR]

Planning is the key to any building job prior to worrying about cost.

Do the leg work yourself with council to make enquiry on any of the heritage requirements. Additionally, engage a specialist consultant or town planner or architect that specialises in this type of work.

When you have your head around that, work on getting a good set of plans drawn up along with a scope of works and specifications list. This is what you should send off to the builders if you are looking to get competitive quotes. Without this it will be up to you to compare quotes not knowing if they are 'apples for apples'. The less detailed you are with the information, the greater contingency that needs to be built into the quotes so the quotes will not always be the most competitive.

The next option would be for you to work with a suitable builder and QS to design and construct on a cost plus basis. Do the aforementioned planning, get the QS to prepare a detailed budget, engage the builder and have the QS verify the costs as it progresses.

This last method we use extensively for major loss insurance claims for the time saving, which would be for repairs not unlike you are proposing.

 

[akiwinut]

It's the etc etc etc where things can add up.

Akiwinut, a bloke I know recently did a reno on a terrace in Marrickville and put a slab downstairs. He reckoned it was much cheaper than timber floors. I have a feeling he may not have prepared it all that well, though. Goodness knows what the new owners will do if they start getting dampness coming up.

I can well imagine, you really need to prepare the wall to slab join to make sure its waterproof, even then you get water coming up the walls regardless. Dampcourse, whats that then?
BestInvest, have a look at the attached cost plan, its only for an extension I did but you would be wise to sit down and do one for the place you are thinking of purchasing as part of your DD.
Its a bit simple and I have been meaning to sit down and develop a proper pre-purchase renovation cost plan but I ended up getting one from PropertyScapes.

 

[tcocaro]

I am from western sydney, cant imagine charging a client travel for Sydney Metro and I doubt many would unless they dont really want the job in the first place.

Why western sydney builders? Why not someone a smidge more local who wont be charging you for 2 hours a day M4 parking allowance.

By the sounds of the place, you could drop 200k and it would touch the edges. I wouldnt be surprised if it costs 400k+ for a top notch build.

 

[tcocaro]

There is no way your getting 140sqm of asbestos out for $25 a metre.

I can well imagine, you really need to prepare the wall to slab join to make sure its waterproof, even then you get water coming up the walls regardless. Dampcourse, whats that then?
BestInvest, have a look at the attached cost plan, its only for an extension I did but you would be wise to sit down and do one for the place you are thinking of purchasing as part of your DD.
Its a bit simple and I have been meaning to sit down and develop a proper pre-purchase renovation cost plan but I ended up getting one from PropertyScapes.

 

[akiwinut]

There is no way your getting 140sqm of asbestos out for $25 a metre.

Thats what I paid, although it ended up more than 140sqm.

 

[tcocaro]

Between tipping costs and doing the job $25 is umm like working for free. Was it a licenced removal crew? Or did the contractor suit up and do it himself and theres now 140sqm of the stuff sitting in a hole in some farm or part of some guys footings. If the job was in marickville I can guess the natio too - just joking

If you got it for $25 thats cheap, do they have a number ill use them from now on.

Thats what I paid, although it ended up more than 140sqm.