The great Oz property crash of 2005.

[Sunfish]

I have no experience of gen Y. I have no idea if they are as scatterbrained and spoilt as you say.

If you are correct, where are the next generation of small businessmen coming from? They can't be fickle and must put in extra hours for years before it pays off usually.

I DO accept that they (Gen Y) are rude and disrespectful on chat forums.

 

[VYBerlinaV8]

Gen Y are an interesting bunch, and are certainly different from me (I'm a classic Gen Xer).

Although Gen Y has some things harder (like property prices) they have some things much easier (like the cost of consumables and travel, and ease of getting a good job). It's easy to overlook the good stuff and complain about the bad.

When I was a teen, international travel was a pipe dream for me. It simply wasn't possible. Nowadays travel is much cheaper, and there is far more information about how to do it well on a budget. Cars are cheaper, too. And these kids earn a shedload more than I did.

I think every generation has its opportunities and it's hurdles. The trick is to recognise your opportunities and make good use of them, because they will likely disappear over time. My standing advice to the younger people I know is to work hard, get your career started, and focus on getting a house or unit to live in, because in ten years when others are starting they'll be telling you how incredibly easy you had it. Then, you can enjoy the fruits of your labour and do the good things when others are still putting in hard yards. And because you started early, your hard yards will, economically, count for more.

I sometimes feel older than my age (35), but I have now entered the part of my life where I can start really enjoying the fruits of my efforts. And it's bloody satisfying.

 

[Felixter]

Hi Felixter,

I was just wondering what experience you have with the young Gen Y's. I've read the newspaper articles about how self obsessed they are aswell, but the ones I deal with seem to have their head screwed on pretty well.

They seem more worldly and 'experienced' (For lack of a better word) than I certainly did at their age.

Let's just clarify here I'm talking the bottom end of Gen Y (18-23)

Plenty of experience with Gen Y ranging from acquaintences, work colleagues, interviewees etc.

As you get older you notice patterns and they pretty much repeat themselves year after year. When I was a young adult my generation like every other generation was brash, arrogant, and thought we knew everything. Nothing has changed - except this generation seems to have a raging case. Perhaps this is brought on by being told from 6 years old that because they are the first generation to go through 12+ years of school with computers that they are going to be be smarter than everyone else? Perhaps because technology has made exponential changes during their coming of age they have misconstrued this good fortune as being automatically better and smarter than others.

This generation are no less talented as you or I, they unfortunately have developed an arrogance where they don't yet know about work ethic and experience. Our man whitegoodhorse or whatever his name is seems to think he is owed an affordable house at 22. He has no concept that in previous generations when affordability was much cheaper that the average person had to make major sacrifices to own the Australian dream. This attitude is typical (read: widespread) in today's youth. This attitude was not widespread in previous generations.

I don't dislike these young people, i don't think they are anymore badly behaved than previous generations, but I'm totally 100% convinced they, more than any similar aged generation before them, have a poor understanding of concepts such as work ethic and experience.

 

[Wunderbar]

Wouldn't you be angry if you started out work, knowing you will be stuck in the rat race for 30 years?

 

[lizzie]

gosh - i'm genX too, and suddenly thought how the genY would go thru life if there was no internet, no home computers and no mobiles phones.

back in the days when you had to stand in line all lunch hour to pay your mortgage with a cheque even if both were at the same bank (no direct transfers). if you wanted to buy a property, you spent your weekend pouring over the paper and drove around to look at them. if you wanted to buy "anything" you had either head out on thursday night shopping or saturday because that was the only time out of work hours that the shops were open ... i could go on but you get the drift.

things have changed - for the better i might add - but i think because it is also so much easier, and the hard slog doesn't have to be put in for the everyday requirements, that the expectation may be that everything should be easy.

 

[Felixter]

If you are correct, where are the next generation of small businessmen coming from? They can't be fickle and must put in extra hours for years before it pays off usually.
.

It will come from the same group. They will grow up and be every bit as good as our generations if not better. There not less talented, they just have skewed attitudes because of the environment they have grown up in.

In the meantime, any chance they can get their hands dirty?

 

[lizzie]

Wouldn't you be angry if you started out work, knowing you will be stuck in the rat race for 30 years?

nope - 20 years ago you just did it because it was the done thing.

 

[Felixter]

Wouldn't you be angry if you started out work, knowing you will be stuck in the rat race for 30 years?

Gen Y don't seem to acknowledge rat race. Most of the ones with some IT savvy (ie they can use facebook and understand how twitter works and some basic networking) think that because the IT landscape has changed so much they will be able to create an Iphone App or a Farmville and be millionaires by 23.

"What rat race? That's for older people who aren't as savvy as me"

 

[greedy2000]

i say let the whingers bleat.

then when they turn 30 and realise they were wrong, they can pretend they never had that view in the first place.

the more they bleat, the more of them fail to buy. that leaves more for me and less competition.

then when they have kids and the missus says "i'm sick of renting, let's buy" they can then plug that 'touchy feely nonsense' into their decade old economics calculator and put a price on their marriage's happiness.

all of a sudden, the "sentiment" has some value and the little snots start to understand what "those fools on SS all those years ago" were talking about when they discussed 80% of the population not caring about values, the simple reason they don't want anyone renting the spare room because 'it's just weird' and that the black and white world of economics doesn't apply on planet earth.

Wow mate, that is some pretty smug, condescending comments there.

What I don’t get is why people who have a house or an IP, lord it over those who don’t and have such utter disregard for people that aren’t servicing a huge mortgage. Why Australians wear a mortgage like a badge of honour is beyond me….

 

[Melbournian]

Gen Y don't seem to acknowledge rat race. Most of the ones with some IT savvy (ie they can use facebook and understand how twitter works and some basic networking) think that because the IT landscape has changed so much they will be able to create an Iphone App or a Farmville and be millionaires by 23.

"What rat race? That's for older people who aren't as savvy as me"

Does being 30 qualify being in the gen X or Y?

It's too hard to make a cut in the IT world - everything you can think of - either someone has done it or will do it and the law can't really define the IP market properly with IT applications.

I was actually deveoping a mobile iphone and android app which can RSS feed and also put inspections list, use inbuilt GPS and inspection reminders to but it's already been created. THen again - Nowadays everyone just goes and outsource IT application work to india, phillipines. AUD250 gives you 2 apps in android and iphone. Why do the hard work when someone else can do it? Some of these indian IT dudes can program apps like in 15 minutes without blinking!

 

[pieman]

Why Australians wear a mortgage like a badge of honour is beyond me….

Personally I liked it and could see the unfortunate position many of the youngsters find themselves in. Im gen x and remember 15 yrs ago some of my friends saying "why do you want to be a slave to a mortgage?" as i was trapesing? round albert park looking for my first dump ppor and borrowing the princely sum of 170k - lots of coin when you are on 29kPA.
Working every pretty much every w/e for many years to support NG ip's and taking some risks finds me with a paid of ppor in Brighton and various ip's.
Took some hard work and sacrifice though...
I would think a dump single fronter in AP or Middle P is about, what 600k now?, so proprtionalty to grad salaries this is a big leap now, still they are some mighty fine inner suburbs.

 

[Melbournian]

Personally I liked it and could see the unfortunate position many of the youngsters find themselves in. Im gen x and remember 15 yrs ago some of my friends saying "why do you want to be a slave to a mortgage?" as i was trapesing? round albert park looking for my first dump ppor and borrowing the princely sum of 160k - lots of coin when you are on 29kPA.
Working every pretty much every w/e for many years to support NG ip's and taking some risks finds me with a paid of ppor in Brighton and various ip's.
Took some hard work and sacrifice though...

160K in albert park? in 1996 - u sure? armadale was like 300K for a townhouse back then

 

[pieman]

160K in albert park? in 1996 - u sure? armadale was like 300K for a townhouse back then

Without going over my entire history (which I have done on here some years ago) I received a redudnacny and had some savings. I purchased a knackered doulble fronted, nth facing (not freestanding house) for 220kish in south melbourne. Single fronters were about <200k for 2 br's and missed out on many in AP some reno'd ones would go for 250k. Missed out on a beauty in stkilda west with a big block for 220 (a dump). Remember this was lots of money and it was 96. I was on 29k PA.

 

[Deltaberry]

Gen Y makes me irk when they:

- proclaim they're some sort of greenie, but are the first to demand a new car and take a loan in the process of doing so;

- complain about how expensive and hard life is but then spend their weekends drinking, take gap years during university, travel to places my grandparents could only dream of going to; and, of course

- talk about how unaffordable houses are and how prices are not sustainable. Maybe try living in NYC, London, HK, Paris (especially without a job like a lot of young people over there)

I must say though I'm guilty of a few Gen Y things, such as:

- being a serial job changer
- travelling to heaps of places
- eat at expensive places ever since I was 22
- cutting corners

But I can prob afford to do some of these things. If I was like some of the ones who apparently can't 'afford' a house I wouldn't do some of these things. Then again my expenses even today are probably less than these people.

 

[Deltaberry]

Personally I liked it and could see the unfortunate position many of the youngsters find themselves in. Im gen x and remember 15 yrs ago some of my friends saying "why do you want to be a slave to a mortgage?" as i was trapesing? round albert park looking for my first dump ppor and borrowing the princely sum of 170k - lots of coin when you are on 29kPA.
Working every pretty much every w/e for many years to support NG ip's and taking some risks finds me with a paid of ppor in Brighton and various ip's.
Took some hard work and sacrifice though...
I would think a dump single fronter in AP or Middle P is about, what 600k now?, so proprtionalty to grad salaries this is a big leap now, still they are some mighty fine inner suburbs.

Not sure if $29k was considered high back then. But assuming it's middle of the road for corporate Australia, here's some food for thought:

15 Years Ago
$170k price
$29k salary
14% interest rates

Now
$600k price
$62k salary
7% interest rates
Grants

 

[whitegoodman]

Not sure if $29k was considered high back then. But assuming it's middle of the road for corporate Australia, here's some food for thought:

15 Years Ago
$170k price
$29k salary
14% interest rates

Now
$600k price
$62k salary
7% interest rates
Grants

what happens in the second scenario if rates go to 14%?

 

[Aaron Sice]

Wow mate, that is some pretty smug, condescending comments there.

What I don’t get is why people who have a house or an IP, lord it over those who don’t and have such utter disregard for people that aren’t servicing a huge mortgage. Why Australians wear a mortgage like a badge of honour is beyond me….

who said anything about wearing a mortgage as a badge of honour?

where am I lording it over anyone?

my point was all these brand new permabear uni graduates spout "affordability", "medians" and "indexes" and yet fail to understand the most basic ideal behind people wanting to buy a home.

and for over 80% of the population, it's NOT something that can be plugged into a calculator.

seems to me like i hit a raw nerve and you're taking my point completely out of context.

 

[whitegoodman]

who said anything about wearing a mortgage as a badge of honour?

where am I lording it over anyone?

my point was all these brand new permabear uni graduates spout "affordability", "medians" and "indexes" and yet fail to understand the most basic ideal behind people wanting to buy a home.

and for over 80% of the population, it's NOT something that can be plugged into a calculator.

seems to me like i hit a raw nerve and you're taking my point completely out of context.

well then it comes down to whether a person regards there home as an investment or there place of residence, if the latter the buy now, buy at any price without analysis probably isnt the best.

 

[pieman]

what happens in the second scenario if rates go to 14%?

Well the 62k salary will be stacks more. We wont have 14% interest rates without serious inflation and that drives up incomes. I will bet my fully paid off house on that.
Best to go and buy an ip, work hard, save and sacrifice if you want a house. The government and tennants will help you afford it and the gov. will spend everything in the cupboard to support house prices in Aus.
If you dont want to buy, i have some rentals available, however, they are all full tennanted now so you will have to wait.

 

[Deltaberry]

what happens in the second scenario if rates go to 14%?

What happens if it goes to 1000%? Or fall to -14%? Imagine the banks pay you interest for borrowing money off them