There is such thing as haunted houses?!

Define what is considered a unicorn first and a tooth fairy first

Can happen :D

Look don't get bogged down in things like defining your hypothesis, as soon as someone does that and it becomes falsifiable it can be disproved. Best to keep it all vague.
 
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Look don't get bogged down in things like defining your hypothesis, as soon as someone does that and it becomes falsifiable it can be disapproved. Best to keep it all vague.

I thougth we're talking about scientific stuff here? The hypothesis need to be defined before it can be tested. Even if it's disproved or proved, the result will be confined within that definition, so unicorn, ghosts, drop bears all exist and nonexistent all at the same time depends on how you define them.

I'm trolling of course.

On the topic of haunted house, there are plenty stories in my home countries - not by something so benevolent like ghosts though :rolleyes:
 
I couldn't handle living in a place where someone has died - especially if it was a tragic, violent death. I know this is silly, irrational, blah, blah, blah, but I am a wimp and it would freak me out. I've only ever lived in just-built or near-new properties that I've known the histories of.


Hubby is an emergency service worker and has seen more dead bodies in houses/units/etc than the average person. He says he couldn't imagine living in any of the properties where the person has lay deceased for more than a day (even from natural causes) such is the mess, smell, etc. But I suppose if you were unaware anything had occurred...

Back around the time that we were expecting our first child, we were planning on moving into one of our IPs - a family sized house. Having been a rental property for 10 years, it was in need of a good makeover and I had all sorts of plans for how I was going to do it up and make it nice for our little family once we moved in. I couldn't wait to get started and we only needed to wait for the tenants to move out after giving them notice.

Knowing how we both felt (especially me) about living in a place where someone had died tragically, imagine the horror hubby felt when hearing over the radio whilst working, the report of a horrible suicide... and the address was our IP :eek:! He said he's never driven to a job so fast. Fortunately for us (and even more fortunately for our tenant) he was still barely alive, but alive nonetheless, and thankfully, recovered (or atleast that's what hubby tells me ;)). We moved in and all was fine :).
 
Having bought and sold many beds (and other furniture) on GumTree to survive last year, a question that was more common than I ever expected was "Did anyone die on the bed'? I was amazed that so many people were concerned that someone had passed on a bed.

We surely have to be more than the sum of our parts, our cells regenerate every few years and yet we remain. So there has to be something non-physical, something spiritual. So it is certainly conceivable that this spiritual part does not journey back to the spiritual realm when the physical body has ceased.

It's interesting to read how many accounts here include those of children. I believe that children are much more open to seeing more than adults, as adults we have been told that it's no okay to see many things so we don't.

I believe that if you have a house with spirits, it is possible to release that house with cleansing and the intervention of a spiritual medium. It's probably less freaky and risky than asking the local real estate what your property is worth...!
 
Having bought and sold many beds (and other furniture) on GumTree to survive last year, a question that was more common than I ever expected was "Did anyone die on the bed'? I was amazed that so many people were concerned that someone had passed on a bed.

We surely have to be more than the sum of our parts, our cells regenerate every few years and yet we remain. So there has to be something non-physical, something spiritual. So it is certainly conceivable that this spiritual part does not journey back to the spiritual realm when the physical body has ceased.

It's interesting to read how many accounts here include those of children. I believe that children are much more open to seeing more than adults, as adults we have been told that it's no okay to see many things so we don't.

I believe that if you have a house with spirits, it is possible to release that house with cleansing and the intervention of a spiritual medium. It's probably less freaky and risky than asking the local real estate what your property is worth...!

Agreed. I think every parent of little kids here will tell you that kids never make stuff up like imaginary friends, and they never believe in fanciful things such as Santa, the tooth fairy, and unicorns etc, and most of all little kids never lie.

So yes suspending all we know about nature and it's natural laws based on some second hand info of what some little kids claimed is a very good idea.
 
But you are assuming we know all about nature and natural laws, the rest of us are assuming that we don't.
If everyone looked at what they know right now and say "yep, that's enough for me, that's all there is" then society in general and science in particular would go nowhere.
I have heard it said that the phrase a scientist most wants to hear when conducting an experiment/research is not necessarily "hooray! I've proved it" but rather "hmmm, that's strange" as that is what leads to further investigation and even more discoveries.
But that is fine, there are many people who don't like to challenge/question what they know so you are certainly not alone.:)
The rest of us can enjoy terrifying others around the bonfire and have some fun.
 
But you are assuming we know all about nature and natural laws, the rest of us are assuming that we don't.
If everyone looked at what they know right now and say "yep, that's enough for me, that's all there is" then society in general and science in particular would go nowhere.
I have heard it said that the phrase a scientist most wants to hear when conducting an experiment/research is not necessarily "hooray! I've proved it" but rather "hmmm, that's strange" as that is what leads to further investigation and even more discoveries.
But that is fine, there are many people who don't like to challenge/question what they know so you are certainly not alone.:)
The rest of us can enjoy terrifying others around the bonfire and have some fun.

I don't believe in something until there is evidence for it. You are mixing up your examples here.

A scientist doesn't get excited hearing about things with a very long history of having no evidence, or having evidence to the contrary.

Even to form a hypothesis there has to be some evidential basis. Scientific journal articles tend to begin with a literature review.

It would be very bad science to, for example, believe something without evidence and that goes against all established evidence for the laws of nature and then proceed in that belief without testing your beliefs and seeing whether or not there is evidence for that belief.

A scientist has an open mind based on logical hypothesis, logical observation, and previous established evidence. And then they will seek to make their hypothesis falsifiable so it can be proven incorrect.

If possible they will operationalise the variables, the independent variables that you will manipulate and the dependant variables that you will measure. They will then seek to find a correlation between those variables and eliminate extraneous variables in order to ascertain a theory around causation.

Extraneous variables are just "mess" variables. Stuff that affects the dependant variable (what you are measuring) but isn't what you want to test and manipulate.

For example in the ghost example, seeing things other people aren't seeing. To establish the relationship between seeing such a thing (the dependant variable) and the correlating independant variable i.e the presence of a ghost, you would have to rule out all extraneous variables. You do this by measuring them and seeing if they correlate with the dependant variable.

In this case you would need to get a mental health assessment. Measure for carbon monoxide leaks. Test for evidence of drug use. Test for evidence of issues with diet. And measure all sorts of other things such as stress levels, lack of sleep etc... etc... As all these extraneous variables can impact on the dependant variable.

Then a scientist, once all these "known" extraneous variables are accounted for, will proceed with a theory. If the method is good enough, it will get published in a scientific journal. Other scientists will then seek to replicate the previous findings and perhaps measure other things also in order to find out whether or not there are any other extraneous variables.

A scientist will have to have a large amount of evidence for ghosts before suspending all the decades of scientific evidence against ghosts.

Edit: Sorry that's all pretty long winded. To put it very simply, what you are describing i.e a scenario where scientists should get excited about the idea of ghosts, is similar in it's issues as an idea that scientists should get excited about the idea of rocks curing cancer.

(1) It goes against established laws of nature
(2) There is no scientific evidence for it
(3) Even if there were a case where a cancer patient recovered after being given a rock, it's a safe assumption that there is most likely another explanation for the recovery.

However a scientist would start to get excited if despite all of this, a certain type of rock consistently led to patients recovering from cancer and all other explanations were systematically ruled out.
 
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Is there a natural law that the existence of a ghost would violate?
What natural law is that?

Anything that is "super" natural by definition goes against the established laws of nature. However you are going to have to research a bit more for all the exact laws a ghost would break. I'm guessing you'll find a few.
 
What law of nature is it? I wouldn't even know what the "laws of nature" are without googling. You reckon the existence of a "ghost" is against nature. I am just asking, how? I am guessing that it is based on the assumption that there is no spiritual component of a human, but this is not proven.
You are the one who is so certain, I am very interested in a law that proves your point.
 
What law of nature is it? I wouldn't even know what the "laws of nature" are without googling. You reckon the existence of a "ghost" is against nature. I am just asking, how? I am guessing that it is based on the assumption that there is no spiritual component of a human, but this is not proven.
You are the one who is so certain, I am very interested in a law that proves your point.

See above post.
 
Thanks for that, interesting. The first paragraph does say that "nothing is ever proven in science" and I tend to think of science as a changing thing as our knowledge increases.
With the first law that you cannot destroy energy it just changes forms, wouldn't that mean (in the context of ghosts) that a human is made up of energy that maybe turns into a ghost, otherwise what other form is it turning in to?
I also like how it says that if ghosts exist they must be made of energy....says who? So they are taking an abstract idea (the ghost) applying their own set of parameters to it ( it must be made of energy) and then saying no it doesn't fit so therefore they don't exist. Who knows what a "ghost " might be made of?
My physics is very rusty and I get where you are coming from, but for myself I believe that we have a lot to learn and have barely scratched the surface of what the universe holds.
It's like trying to imagine infinity, you can't. The human mind just keeps putting a limit on it.
 
It's like trying to imagine infinity, you can't. The human mind just keeps putting a limit on it.

Ive been banging on about this for infinity.

Im quite happy with infinity and the fact that there is no end, except for life of course, there is no boundary to "space", it's endless. Absolutely no argument can be made otherwise.

Lets say there is a boundary or some sort of limit.

So what is beyond that?

Yeah, thought so, more space.

have fun!:)
 
Thanks for that, interesting. The first paragraph does say that "nothing is ever proven in science" and I tend to think of science as a changing thing as our knowledge increases.
With the first law that you cannot destroy energy it just changes forms, wouldn't that mean (in the context of ghosts) that a human is made up of energy that maybe turns into a ghost, otherwise what other form is it turning in to?
I also like how it says that if ghosts exist they must be made of energy....says who? So they are taking an abstract idea (the ghost) applying their own set of parameters to it ( it must be made of energy) and then saying no it doesn't fit so therefore they don't exist. Who knows what a "ghost " might be made of?
My physics is very rusty and I get where you are coming from, but for myself I believe that we have a lot to learn and have barely scratched the surface of what the universe holds.
It's like trying to imagine infinity, you can't. The human mind just keeps putting a limit on it.

Sorry again a copy paste answer to your question as it's already been answered:

Q: If energy is neither created nor destroyed, what happens to the energy within our bodies and brains when we die? http://www.askamathematician.com/20...rgy-within-our-bodies-and-brains-when-we-die/

And everything is made of energy. Ghosts are a "thing" which is probably why the physicist applied that principal to them.

Sorry another copy and paste: "With his famous equation E= mc2, Albert Einstein proved that when you come right down to it everything in the universe is energy. Both in the physical plane of our reality of matter and the abstract reality of our mind are made up of energy patterns"
 
It would be really interesting to hear from people, if they believe in ghosts, what would they consider evidence that ghosts don't exist, and how could that be measured.

The very first test of a good theory is if it has the ability to be proven wrong.
 
It would be really interesting to hear from people, if they believe in ghosts, what would they consider evidence that ghosts don't exist, and how could that be measured.

The very first test of a good theory is if it has the ability to be proven wrong.

I don't believe or not believe. I don't believe that thousands of people are necessarily wrong just because science cannot prove them wrong.

Scientists once thought the world was flat. That was wrong.

Can science prove there are no ghosts?
 
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