Trusts and Death

Following on from my post on SMSFs and death I would like to point out what happens to 'your' trusts when you die.

A trust is not a legal person or entity but a relatonship between the trustee, the property and the beneficiaries. A trustee owns the property for the beneficiary.

If a trustee dies
A trustee holds property for others. If a trustee were to die this property doesn't pass into their estate because the property doesn't belong to the trustee. The trustee will keep going and a new trustee will come in. Who and how this trustee will be appointed will depend on the terms of the deed. Often, or maybe usually, the next trustee will be nominated by the appointor.

If appointor dies
What if you are the appointor and the trustee and you die? Again you need to read the deed to see what happens. In some deeds the next appointor is spelled out. It is always good to have a backup appointor.

In others it is the person nominated in the will of the last appointor - so make sure you do nominate a successor appointor in the will.

In other trust deeds it could be the legal personal representative of the last appoint. This is the executor or administrator of the estate. This is unwise or even dangerous. Imagine you die and nominate uncle Harry as executor - Harry dies before you, or has dementia, or just isn't capable and cannot do it. In these cases it is often the public trustee or a private commercial trustee company that is appointed. They will essentially be the appointor of your trust, complete strangers.. The Appointor has the control to appoint the trustee so the stranger will be in control of the trustee postion and the trustee controls the trust and who will receive income from it. They will be taking fees for every phone call too. In a NSW Supreme Court case from a few years ago there was a dispute over a Dr dying and willing her trust assets (mistakenly) to a charity. The executor of the estate was a professional trustee and from the judgment you can see one of the first things they did was take over the appointor position and sack the existing company trustee and replace it with a company they controlled.

Also if an executor dies mid way through administering an estate it could be their legal personal representative that takes over their role and therefore you trust.

Death of a beneficiary
Noting much happens if a beneficiary dies. The trustee will simply stop distributing to that person. But there may be estate planning opportunites here with increasing assets into a testamentary trust and thereby tax free income to children - see your tax advisor about this.

Death of a director of a trustee
Trustee company is controlled by a director. If director dies control of the company passes to new director(s). This may be good or bad depending. If A dies and Z takes control of the company and B takes control of the Appointor postion it is possible that Z can make a resolution to distribute all the trust assets to himself or his family. B could sack the company as trustee, but this could take time. When someone dies changing trustees is often not thought about straight away.:D

Death of shareholder of trustee company
Shareholders essentially control who the directors are. Make sure you plan who you leave your shares to as they will vote to replace or appoint a new director and thereby control the company which controls the trust - very important in SMSF too.

Death of a unit holder
Units in a unit trust are property. If they are owned by a person individually then they can be left in a will. If a discretioanry trust owns the shares they remain in the trust when the person behind the trust dies


I see a lot of clients with existing trusts already set up. Probably less than 10% know who the next appointor is. Everyone thinks trusts are good for asset protection, but they often forget about asset protection upon death.

Having assets in a trust can provide protection from the will being challenged. If the will is not valid - not witnessed, no capacity etc then this generally won't affect the trust assets. If the will is challenged by a family provision claim (ie leaving someone out of a will and/or not providing adequate provision) the trust assets could be safer too, but in NSW there are provisions where the assets could be attacked - via a notional estate order.
 
Important:
- Is there a will that address the above? You dont want a tough question about trusts to be in hands of NSW Govt Public Trustee. They likely to appoint themselves as appointor !! Their past experience is to take huge fees and sell EVERYTHING and vest it to the dec'd estate. Then a trust beneficiary may not be a estate beneficiary leaving them nothing.
- Appointor who is an adviser is not recommended. That problem saw Michael Hutchence's estate vanish.
- Where are the deeds !! A will that leaves control of a trust is close to useless without the trust deed.
- Who is legal personal representative ? If its joint can they make mutual decisions ? What happens if they cant ? (Fmily lawyer to arbitrate ? - What if they are dead ?)
 
ADeath of shareholder of trustee company
Shareholders essentially control who the directors are. Make sure you plan who you leave your shares to as they will vote to replace or appoint a new director and thereby control the company which controls the trust - very important in SMSF too.

s17A SISA permits a SMSF to have a LPR stand in place for a member following death. SISA through convoluted process involving non-compliance basically says if s17A is not complied with then APRA becomes trustee. (SAF) The view many have is "after" six months but this is the final date - APRA can be appointed earlier.

The member can leave shares in SMSF Trustee PL to anyone they like. Valueless and no powers over super as s17A doesnt allow a trustee relationship other than LPR. Difficut to see fiduciary duties fulfilled if a s17A isnt complied with to access a deceased members super. Corps Act offence at least. Courts happy to enforce this. All members are trustees / trustee Directors rule.

The member can only have a LPR as their alternate on death. Issue is more about who the LPR is and to ensure they are involved so that other member doesnt breach rights - The lack of prudential protection is a concern here. Sometimes it actually easier to appoint APRA (or a SAF Trustee Co) as trustee under estate planning. SAF Fees arent that high.
 
A question for our learned experts: how do testimentary trusts differ from discretionary trusts, unit trusts etc? Who becomes the appointer etc of the trust? (sorry Terry I had written this before I had fully read your previous response mentioning tt).
 
A TT can also be a discretionary trust !! Its basically a will that says on death some / all of my assets will be held on trust for beneficiaries until.....(they die, they turn a specific age etc). It can restrict so they cant use capital or limit what it can be spent on. The proposed deed is attached to the will. It should be made in conjunction with Guardianship (to provide finance for children), power of attorney and even possible a deed of mutual wills,

A TT is just a trust created by death. Its predominant benefit is to avoid assets of the deceased passing to the deceased estate. (They bypass the estate) This means estate beneficiaries such as kids wont own those assets. It can be drafted so Mums assets are on trust pending dads death and then all are on TT. (The DMW helps that)

TTs can be very effective where the potential deceased has concerns about a beneficiary wasting the estate (gambling etc) or where the beneficiary may be at risk (a high liability risk, vulnerable people etc). Good for preserving estate assets for future benefit of children etc too.

TT should be tailored by a lawyer competent in advanced estate planning, super and trust law who also has taxation experience and skills. Its not a DIY "off the shelf" matter. If a TT is too robust it could be contested.
 
A TT is a type of discretionary trust that is created on death as part of a will.

One other advantage is that income from testamentary trusts distributed to minors are taxed at adult rates.
 
s17A SISA permits a SMSF to have a LPR stand in place for a member following death. SISA through convoluted process involving non-compliance basically says if s17A is not complied with then APRA becomes trustee. (SAF) The view many have is "after" six months but this is the final date - APRA can be appointed earlier.

The member can leave shares in SMSF Trustee PL to anyone they like. Valueless and no powers over super as s17A doesnt allow a trustee relationship other than LPR. Difficut to see fiduciary duties fulfilled if a s17A isnt complied with to access a deceased members super. Corps Act offence at least. Courts happy to enforce this. All members are trustees / trustee Directors rule.

The member can only have a LPR as their alternate on death. Issue is more about who the LPR is and to ensure they are involved so that other member doesnt breach rights - The lack of prudential protection is a concern here. Sometimes it actually easier to appoint APRA (or a SAF Trustee Co) as trustee under estate planning. SAF Fees arent that high.


s17A says a fund doesnt cease to be a SMFS if the LPR becomes trustee or director. The LPR may not necessarily become director or trustee. But even if they did they could still fullfil their fidcuial obligations and pay out the benefits to the 'wrong' family member
 
Important:
- Is there a will that address the above?

Not really because the trust is outside the will and not related usually. If the deed states the LPR becomes the next appointor etc then in the will you could cover this to an extend by appointor to benefit the estate as much as possible. But this raises whole lot of other issues.
 
A question for our learned experts: how do testimentary trusts differ from discretionary trusts, unit trusts etc? Who becomes the appointer etc of the trust? (sorry Terry I had written this before I had fully read your previous response mentioning tt).

A testamentary trust is just a trust formed upon death. It could be discretionary, unit or a bit of both. The trust comes into existance after death - the deceased is the settlor.

Some lawyers just draw up a will and staple a discretionary trust deed to it. But this is not suitable because it needs be be tailored to the family. For instance if there are 2 children you may want to have 2 testmentary trusts with each child controlling one. The main beneficiary would generallybe the appointor but not always. Each trust may have different restrictions - beneficiaries could have the power to take property of the trust directly if they want (needs careful planning around asset protection) or you may have it so the capital cannot be distributed.

I also put in flexibility so the beneficiary could take assets directly if they desire or even renounce their interest in the trust. Also incorporate a superannuation proceeds trust to keep any super separate as this can save lots of tax.

ALso should point out that under s102AG children can receive income from a will or testamentary trust and get taxed at adult rates. ie about $20k pa tax free.

A testamentary trust can also be set up in up to 3 years after the death - but with a lot of restrictions.
 
A TT is just a trust created by death. Its predominant benefit is to avoid assets of the deceased passing to the deceased estate. (They bypass the estate) This means estate beneficiaries such as kids wont own those assets. It can be drafted so Mums assets are on trust pending dads death and then all are on TT. (The DMW helps that)

Good for preserving estate assets for future benefit of children etc too.

TT should be tailored by a lawyer competent in advanced estate planning, super and trust law who also has taxation experience and skills. Its not a DIY "off the shelf" matter.

Thanks Paul. From what I am told it wasn't cheap as it involved estate planners, accountants etc.

One other advantage is that income from testamentary trusts distributed to minors are taxed at adult rates.

Thanks Alex


Ah the joys of knowing that good advice was sought with foresight, not complaining about something with 20/20 hindsight.
 
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