US foreclosures - Boholt Seminars - NO

RE: Quick Flip

Thanks Dave, didn't think about vendor finance. What other circumstances may register a lower than normal sale price?

Incidentally, is there anyway to negotiate a nominally higher sale price (since there'll be less CGT to wear in the future), I heard closing cost can be transferred to the seller. Any other methods available?
 
Amazing. Are you heading to US in the near future?
I sure hope to, but I'm looking at apartment complexes rather than houses, and the percentage reduction from asking price is usually smaller. But they're well-priced to start with. I spent a month living in my chosen city last year - took out a proper residential lease, even though short-term - and have visited the States many times.
 
Hi emma

I visit the South US (specifically Florida) pretty much yearly as its a place that I grew up. So I hold a US green card plus SSN plus a few other citizenships. Live in Oz full time.

When I was there in May last year I went through probably 30 foreclosed properties in about 4 days as well as the courthouse auctions etc.

I found if you had the cash then you easily buy a courthouse auction, cosmetic reno and then flip a property quite easily - as seems to be opposite to LV.

In speaking to people I knew they'd be on $35k a year as a full time public school teacher and trying to make ends meet.

Over here our wages are substantially stronger (and the dollar is now too) But the big stumbling block that was apparent was the financing side from US banks. Not just to foreigners but to us residents as well. So i'd guess that from my end if I was running a broking show in the US, if we did 10 loans in a week only 1 would be approved, whereas here the percentage would be significantly higher (i'm thinking 90%+)

So definitely a case where cash is ruling, and shortsales/courtsales prevail.
 
Spectre,

Lawjs talked about how crime/gangs reduced his returns, caused property damage etc. From that POV, that sounds like a significant risk for running a property from afar. To be honest, I haven't heard of crackheads, gangs with guns, people stripping copper from buildings etc in Australia. Is this type of problems confined to particular cities or is South Florida generally safer?
 
So definitely a case where cash is ruling, and shortsales/courtsales prevail.

I've seen short sales mentioned in a couple of the websites. Can you tell me what it means? It surely can't be the same short sale terminology that we use for 'going short' on shares/cfd's.
 
Short Sale is when you can persuade all the mortgage holders (banks) of a property to agree to a sale for an amount less than what is owed. It is better for the borrower, as their credit scores wouldn't be affected, but the banks would have to take a write off. Downsides - You first have get a "yes" from the house owner before approaching the banks, and that may take a long time as well, and the banks may not agree. Upside - it is not an open market, so the prices aren't as competitive.
 
What is a short sale/ zillow list dicrepancies

This is a bit of a simplistic summary but There are basically about four steps a property goes through before it even reaches the foreclosed world. Normally we rarely see them.

Steps to foreclosure

1) homeowner falls behind and gets evil letters from bank. The property owner may then try to sell the property for more than the loan is worth.. Normal sale.
2) if this fails, the homeowner (and loan modification hasn't occurred) may negotiate with the bank to accept less than the loan is woth on the property... THIS IS A SHORT SALE. They put the property on to the market ... Short sales from a purchasing perspective are a massive no go for investors.. Takes months with no guarantee as effectively you are at that point negotiating with the bank...who still thinks the property is worth more.... My real estate agent doesn't touch them as they rarely close.

IN A NORMAL MARKET YOU RARELY GET THE NSXT STEPS....

3) if it fails at short sale, the property goes up for auction easy to buy at but many many caveats here... I haven't touched these yet...
4) if it fails to sell at auction, the bank reclaims title and it is now a bad debt on the books and foreclosed.....go 50cents on the dollar...


THe Zilllow property mentioned... Haven't checked the property but list price I will bet was the short sale price and the final was the foreclosed. You still need an estate agent to send you the MLS (multi listing service) records which tell you preecisely what the status change is but dear god zillow is a great tool. I use it, realtor.com,Clark county records etc. I also get automatic emails for properties in Florida and las vegas daily from my agents there. Still check if flip or not but it will tell yu on the listing record is short sell. For giggles, I will find out the story for whomever brought that property up.

Liens...tax liens you can find from county records... Free search... but other liens are more ambiguous and people have learnt to hold off from filing these until properties change hands.. Thus I only buy bank legit foreclosed properties... I just don't have the time to check everything, banks sell clear titles and by the time foreclosed, this is a vacant property for quite a while. That and yes, title insurance.... $400 odd is lovely peace of mind.

Yes, a great Cup had by all...

Sunfish... No, this isn't a currency play but you do need to factor it in! Any overseas play does. Eg buy at parity and bring back funds down the line at 80 cents... A nice bonus in my mind. Certainly makes US properties a better buy at the moment...
 
I don't profess to be anywhere near as experienced as Emma, but I'll put in my two cents on experiences which have made the path to buying property in the US easier.

The easiest way to get finance is to get a line of credit in Australia. Interest only is an option if you are stretching it. I have been advised US banks right now will not loan less than $100k. That is a positive for investors because if you are going for properties <$100k you will not be up against locals who want to buy cheap houses because they can't get finance. But it's hard for foreign nationals to get credit in the US unless you actually have a credit rating there. Personally I wouldn't bother.

Opening an American bank account will save you a lot of hassles when it comes to showing proof of funds and actually transfering the money to buy property. You do not need a tax ID number to open a US account, they get you to fill out a W8-BEN. It's MUCH easier to open a bank account in person than from Australia, but I understand it is doable to open one from here.

Summerlin is the number one area in Vegas, hands down. If anything, you pay a premium for the name. But the border areas can still be a bit dicey. I like the idea of Henderson and properties are cheap but it is quite a fair way away from downtown Vegas plus the areas you go through to get to it are not really desirable. Having said that, the views that Henderson has is magnificent and it's a nice new community.

Google Earth is your friend. If you can't personally check out the city (strongly recommended), at least check out the area on Google Earth. In Vegas, there are nice pockets but are surrounded by not so nice areas. I understand it's the same in other cities. The saying "if it's too good to be true ..." absolutely is correct. I went from looking at $40k properties to $70k+ properties just due to location and amenities etc. Figure that down the track the nicer properties will produce less hassles plus appreciation will be higher. Do you really want to buy a property that will give you no return because it might not be rented out for six months of the year? Also beware of condo conversions, these have a bad rap.

One really good forum to check out is city-data.com. The posters are local in whichever city/state you are looking at and can help out or you can search past posts. It's helped me when searching for specific streets/HOAs etc and what they are like. If you are looking at Vegas and worried about crime check out http://www.lvmpd.com/crimeviewcommunity/default.asp and http://www.donohueteam.com/Crime/index.html. I've checked other states and they have similar websites to check out crime rates if you are looking at other states.

Getting a real estate agent on board that you can trust if you are heading down that track (ie not going it alone) is so important. I know that sounds funny when they are so untrustable in Australia but they can be found in the US because the laws are a lot more stringent. A good real estate agent can also provide contacts for anything you need for your property so say you find a property that needs repair work, what would seem hard can become easy and gets you ahead of other investors if you are prepared to buy one that needs repairs.

Hope this helps. I've spent hours on the internet looking for info so if I'm happy to help out others.
 
Summerlin is the number one area in Vegas, hands down. If anything, you pay a premium for the name. But the border areas can still be a bit dicey. I like the idea of Henderson and properties are cheap but it is quite a fair way away from downtown Vegas plus the areas you go through to get to it are not really desirable. Having said that, the views that Henderson has is magnificent and it's a nice new community.

Yes, I started with the crime maps and Summerlin North has the least burglaries, assaults, etc. But it is also expensive. 7% cap rate. I suppose equivalent desirable areas in Australia would be sub 2%.

What kind of return did you achieve?

I'll check out Henderson. Thanks.
 
Thanks MTJ

The city-data site was a great add to those of us who didn't know. Like somersoft I think I could spend ALOT of time there learning. crickey it even looks like there using the same format and layout as somersoft which is funny because the software version that SS uses is very old. There goes all my weekends out with the boys down the drain..
 
Hi, Emma. I was looking for a good realtor in LV. I was considering Roger Heller from Re Max. Do you have any opinion on him. I was thinking of perhaps purchasing a fourplex. How viable is flipping in LV ? Consider your self lucky getting turfed by Dymphna. I sat through 2 days of her BS, so many false statements, she was very selective on whose questions she would answer. May be the reason she turfed you was because her line was, that it is very difficult and a mine field to buy property in the USA , you cant do it by yourself and she is the only person with the expertise, from australia who knows how to do it. That was in Sydney 2010 feb. But now strangely in her promo for her new semminar she is saying how easy it is. Thanks for all the great info .
 
Buster ...Excellent point. You need a great agent. Do not think foreclosed listing agents stick to their own rules on how they are going to handle multiple offers or that the banks will follow any prescribed decision making. They change them every second. Your real estate agent can make or break a deal and mine has saved me so many times it isn't funny. The below is hysterical but the most accurate summary of the foreclosed sale market. My agent sent it to me because SHE was made to watch it in training...

MUST MUST WATCH.....you have probably seen but..
Emma Laws The funniest summation of this market:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SM7oWKgCVo4

I don't know what the legalities of recommending someone. I can say that if your agent won't show you properties within 5 minutes of them coming on the market, be willing to show you properties at midnight, write contracts at 2 am so that your offer is first seen by the bank in the morning, you don't have the edge. I went through 10 morons ... Ie, come in, sit down, let's discuss etc... That is BS in the foreclosed market because the properties will be gone by then. My agent rocks and is the only one I have ever signed an exclusive with. She got me my workers, speaks Spanish and is just on the ball. She has also dealt with two other Australians.

Am I allowed to mention her name? I am sure there are other great agents out there in Vegas, just none that I have found who move as quickly as you need. She always sends rental comps, geojet reports and sales comps on any mls listing you are interested in so make sure your agent does that too.

I don't know Roger Heller.

BTW, Henderson & Summerlin would be like St Ives or Mosman of Sydney. where
I invest would be closer to Marsfield, Hornsby and in the "worst" areas, Mt Druitt. Nothing scary.... Depends what you are going for. I haven't seen a 70k come up in Summerlin and do NOT be fooled that old Henderson is a good area.. 89015 is NOT deemed real Henderson... And yes, every man, dog and his child would be bidding on anything under 90k in Henderson so be careful on that...
 
Emma, I don't understand. Why is speed more important than price? Wouldn't the bank want to look at the best offer?
 
Emma, I don't understand. Why is speed more important than price? Wouldn't the bank want to look at the best offer?
The lenders just want to offload these properties. They're in the banking game, not the landlord game, and so they keep the properties empty, meaning the properties cost them money every day in property taxes and the money they have invested in the property.

The bad debt shows up on their books, and the lenders have performance metrics which focus heavily on how much bad debt the lender is carrying, and how old it is. The percentage recovered doesn't vary that much via method of sale to surmount the weighting placed on closing the bad debt quickly. Selling a house for cash today might get you 50% of market value, and if you waited a month or two for a buyer who's using a loan, you might still only get 60-70% of your debt recovered. Holding a bad debt for 3 months rather than 1 month gets the lenders' staff in a lot more trouble than selling a property for 50% rather than 70%. So it's all about speed, and thus foreclosed properties only sell cash unconditional.

They want the best price - but only the best "cash unconditional" price that they can get within a few hours/days.
 
They want the best price - but only the best "cash unconditional" price that they can get within a few hours/days.

How's someone in Australia ever going to do that successfully? Sounds like I'll need to live there to do this.
 
How's someone in Australia ever going to do that successfully? Sounds like I'll need to live there to do this.
Buying any property in the USA is not something you should do on a whim; it's very, very different to Australia, and generally much riskier. Buying foreclosed properties requires even more caution and knowledge.

You don't have to live in the USA, but you certainly need to spend significant time there and spend a lot of time educating yourself on the very different way that they do things. And yes, investors buy with cash much more frequently than in Australia. If you have equity here in Australia, taking cash out of your portfolio here is definitely the way to go.

I would - and have - bought properties unseen in Australia, and I feel quite comfortable with that. I wouldn't contemplate buying in the USA without being physically there and having done substantially more due diligence than I would on an equivalent Australian purchase.

This is not a market to enter lightly. It's much riskier than our market. It's a lot more complex than our property market, and you'll find that very little that you've learned as an investor/landlord here in Australia translates to the American environment.
 
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