"Vulture Lawyers" and "crazy" legal claims.

Should litigation lending be outlawed?

  • Yes-stop the ratbag claimants in their tracks

    Votes: 7 21.2%
  • No- let's help out these hedge funds and lawyers in making a quid in these tough times

    Votes: 5 15.2%
  • Depends on what litigation the funds are used for

    Votes: 11 33.3%
  • I don't know or care and I'm not going to read the link to that trashy Murdoch rag The Australian

    Votes: 10 30.3%

  • Total voters
    33
Following the "Hey Dazzler" thread I thought I would start a separate thread covering some of the issues raised there after I read the following article on litigation funding:

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...r-representative/story-e6frg97x-1226300891483

(hope the link works- The Australian has a log on feature I bypass by cut and pasting the topic to Google and it lets me read the whole article that way)

Whilst it seems I am on my lonesome on this forum as regards people's "rights" who have the temerity to sue landlords or other negligent parties I can see this will be a factor in the floods litigation about to arise here in Qld.

I personally won't be sunig ( I was flooded- business lost for a week and emotional shock of living at the in laws for a week) I imagine many will. The state government may cap by statute damages but more likely the insurers involved will pick up the tab but negotiate a further erosion of claimant's rights like they did in 2002 post Sep 11 and HIH collapse.

Are litigation funders "vultures?" Are they bigger or smaller vultures than lawyers? Should litigation lending be outlawed?
 
I assume you are not just talking about the floods, but about litigation "in general".

We are becoming a society (and I include canada) of victims. It's always everyone else's fault.

On the news yesterday was the family of the 14 yr old boy who hanged himself in 2008 because of bullying.Family to receive $1 mil. The school, from my understanding, is to pay.
This is a sad story. Is the school the only ones to blame here? No..IMO.
The family needs to accept some blame. If they thought the situation was this serious, why didn't they move. Probably because they didn't know it would go this far. How is that any different than the school?
The family must have known this child was having difficulties. Why are parents allowing the kids to have mobile phones etc, at such a young age?
The child could have been homeschooled. There were options.

The floods in Qld. Why aren't all houses in floodprone areas on stilts? They used to be,right?
As many here on SS have stated many times, they know there will be floods, and that's why they have insurance. Australia is known for floods, fires, and droughts. Everyone seems surprised when it actually happens though !
The average rainfall is just that, and average. To me, that would be a couple years of drought (or more), followed by floods.

No one has the right to make it the other person's fault.
Living each day is a hazard. It's really a wonder we make through it.
Owners should the right to mitigate their losses but removing some of the barriers. Apparently, even the police can't force them off the property...so what chance does the owner have?
Slip and falls. Why couldn't the person walking see the spill on the ground? They expect the owners to see it.

Peanut allergies in school. If a child dies will the school be sued, or the child who sneaked in a PB & J sandwich? Why do we never hear about workplaces that are peanut free? Does the allergic child never go to shopping malls?

People and their "rights"? They have the right to buy their own house and shop online!

Nothing will get better, until the criminal and civil court system is changed.That is where the problem lies.
 
Can only see the first 2 paragraphs.

Try cut and paste article title, insert in google and pick the highlighted page you've already visited.

Heres a paste of article-interesting bits only:

ONE of the most senior representatives of the US business community has warned that the risk of doing business in Australia will rise if the federal government adopts a light-touch approach to regulation of the litigation funding industry.

Lisa Rickard, who is executive vice-president of the US Chamber of Commerce, is concerned that if the oversight of this industry is left to the courts "there is no doubt about the fact that it will add to the risk of doing business".

Her warning came soon after notes from draft regulations drawn up by federal Treasury suggested a licensing requirement for litigation funders was considered to be "excessively burdensome".

This was because Treasury believed other measures such as court orders for funders to provide security could be used.

However, the Australian Institute of Company Directors has told Treasury that the draft regulations underestimate the difficulty of obtaining security for costs orders and that these orders are traditionally limited to the parties to proceedings, not third parties.








.
. .
The AICD also raised concerns that a key provision in Treasury's proposed regulatory scheme for litigation funders appeared to be ultra vires -- or beyond power -- and therefore potentially invalid.

This view about potential invalidity is in line with the assessment of leading litigation funder IMF (Australia), which is the only litigation funder to hold a financial services licence.

The AICD and the US Chamber's Institute for Litigation Reform, which is led by Ms Rickard, have urged the government to expand the draft regulations to include a licensing scheme.

Ms Rickard, who is visiting Australia for talks with peak business organisations, addressed the American Chamber of Commerce in Sydney this week about trends in anti-business litigation in the US and Australia.

She told The Australian she feared the combination of class actions and lightly regulated litigation funders meant Australia was at risk of embracing the worst of the US litigation culture.

"When the prospects are there for lawyers and the financing companies to make a profit out of class action litigation, it is just too great a draw to ignore," she said.

She believed it was not her place to outline detailed proposals on how Australia should go about regulating its litigation funding industry.

"We are not here to tell Australians how to administer their justice system," she said.

"We are here to share our experience."

However, the Institute for Litigation Reform suggested to the Australian Treasury last year that safeguards should be put in place to prevent abuses by companies that finance court cases for a proportion of any financial settlement or damages award.

She said the purpose of her visit was to share information about the factors that had led to the rise in the US of what she described as "the extortion model" of class actions against business.

The US Chamber of Commerce decided to embark on a fact-finding trip to Australia after it became concerned over the presence in the US of foreign litigation funding companies.

Those companies include Bentham Capital, a subsidiary of IMF (Australia).

Bentham Capital's US team is led by Ralph Sutton, who helped found and run the litigation funding operations of Credit Suisse in the US.

According to Fortune magazine, the leading players in the US litigation funding industry include aggressive hedge funds such as Reservoir Capital of New York and Eton Park of London.

Other players in the US market are Burford Capital, Juridica, Credit Suisse, and the recently launched US funders BlackRobe and Fulbrook.

According to Fortune, "England and Australia have embraced litigation financing even more enthusiastically than America has."

Ms Rickard said there was a high degree of concern about the potential impact of Australian and other foreign litigation funders in the US.

"So we wanted to come, we wanted to study it here."

She said she was equally concerned about the impact on US companies in Australia of class actions financed by lightly regulated litigation funders.


In the US, she said, the combined impact of class actions and unregulated litigation funders "creates a somewhat toxic cocktail from our perspective".

Many American companies had found it impossible to withstand class actions run by well-resourced plaintiff firms that commissioned aggressive public relations campaigns and frequently stood to gain far more financially than their clients.

"They know companies are going to settle . . . they show up on Wall Street and they go and talk to your institutional investors and analysts, and a company cannot take that," she said.

"From the companies' perspective there are a lot of issues to do with reputational harm and the impact on stock prices."

She said Australia was still a long way from becoming a "jackpot jurisdiction".

"The US is, far and away, ahead of the pack on class actions and the financing of litigation through the plaintiffs bar and the use of contingency fees."
 
The problem with litigation funding is that it exploits a loophole in the professional rules. In Australia, a solicitor is forbidden from getting a % of any settlement/damages from a win in a court case. They can (and do) work on a 'no win, no fee' basis, however. This is to prevent these exact type of overzealous lawsuits from happening in the first place. In the US attorneys are allowed to participate in a % of the damages awarded.

However, litigation funders aren't 'solicitors' and hence do not fall under the same prohibition. Very, very strange situation at play.
 
Do you do normal lawyering stuff....or just litigation .....ever do good deed type work....not pro bono...but deals n such ??
 
The problem with litigation funding is that it exploits a loophole in the professional rules. In Australia, a solicitor is forbidden from getting a % of any settlement/damages from a win in a court case. They can (and do) work on a 'no win, no fee' basis, however. This is to prevent these exact type of overzealous lawsuits from happening in the first place. In the US attorneys are allowed to participate in a % of the damages awarded.

However, litigation funders aren't 'solicitors' and hence do not fall under the same prohibition. Very, very strange situation at play.

Not the case in Qld anyway and it is really a common law prohibition. Litigation funders charge 18-22% interest, not a contingency
 
People always whinge about lawyers, until they need one. Most never talk about the Pro Bono- or voluntary work that comes with the profession.
 
Do you do normal lawyering stuff....or just litigation .....ever do good deed type work....not pro bono...but deals n such ??
Do lots of normal lawyering stuff but am currently overworked so not taking new stuff. Am moving away from litigation except for Deceased estates, some commercial and of course Personal injuries.
People always whinge about lawyers, until they need one. Most never talk about the Pro Bono- or voluntary work that comes with the profession.
True- but if a lawyer does pro bono work he or she should shut up about it and not advertise the fact as "what a great firm we are" or use it indirectly as a marketing tool.

you only need a lawyer because of lawyers.

Tell that to the police as they are delivering a few kidney punches to you after wrongfully arresting you:D
 
Tell that to the police as they are delivering a few kidney punches to you after wrongfully arresting you:D

Oh what a load of nonsense.

The only ones that need lawyers when in Police custody are those that decide to have an attitude, continue to struggle, swear, spit in the face of, and generally act like complete pork chops.

Those citizens that comply with what the Officer is directing them to do, and calmly go thru the process of being processed, never need to fear anything at all.

Your fanciful wrongful arrest issue will be sorted out by the courts at a much later date. It is not for the citizen to struggle and swear and yell "I know my rights". They do not have the authority to determine for themselves at the time of arrest whether they are being wrongfully arrested, and is absolutely no basis for resisting arrest, which causes all of the extra attention in the first place.

In the heat of the moment, the impartial Police's opinion over-rides the citizens opinion. That's the bit most people with attitude struggle with.
 
Oh what a load of nonsense.

The only ones that need lawyers when in Police custody are those that decide to have an attitude, continue to struggle, swear, spit in the face of, and generally act like complete pork chops.

Those citizens that comply with what the Officer is directing them to do, and calmly go thru the process of being processed, never need to fear anything at all.

Your fanciful wrongful arrest issue will be sorted out by the courts at a much later date. It is not for the citizen to struggle and swear and yell "I know my rights". They do not have the authority to determine for themselves at the time of arrest whether they are being wrongfully arrested, and is absolutely no basis for resisting arrest, which causes all of the extra attention in the first place.

In the heat of the moment, the impartial Police's opinion over-rides the citizens opinion. That's the bit most people with attitude struggle with.

Here I thought I was the only one who thought like this.

When there is no respect for the police, what chance does society even have.
 
Oh what a load of nonsense.

The only ones that need lawyers when in Police custody are those that decide to have an attitude, continue to struggle, swear, spit in the face of, and generally act like complete pork chops.

Those citizens that comply with what the Officer is directing them to do, and calmly go thru the process of being processed, never need to fear anything at all.

Your fanciful wrongful arrest issue will be sorted out by the courts at a much later date. It is not for the citizen to struggle and swear and yell "I know my rights". They do not have the authority to determine for themselves at the time of arrest whether they are being wrongfully arrested, and is absolutely no basis for resisting arrest, which causes all of the extra attention in the first place.

In the heat of the moment, the impartial Police's opinion over-rides the citizens opinion. That's the bit most people with attitude struggle with.

Tell that to Barry Mannix I think his name was from the Gold Coast back in the 80's. He wasn't even "arrested" at the time of his 12 hour "questioning" to which he (as a 19 year old) confessed to murdering his own father (wrongly it turned out- he didn't even know the 3 blokes who robbed his father's shop and shot the father.)
Spent a long time in jail- pre trial- until by luck the three were caught after the murder of a prostitute and the truth came out- repercussions for the police involved? nil- because the Police service and the now defunct Police complaints tribunal shared the exact attitude you have just articulated.

And that's just one of many stories I know of. I have lived a normal life but I have been exposed through my work to various social stratas so I have an idea of how scary it is to have a society mobilize against you when you are accused (either rightly or wrongly) of a crime.Police will frequently think the law doesn't apply to them so they need to be held accountable in all instances.
I remember Western Australia had a high deaths in custody ratio- no real concern to anyone but young aboriginal males (and their families I suppose). A bit rough since we got rid of the death penalty in the 196o's I think.

EDIT: Just saw this- but of course he had it coming and I'm sure it will be sorted out to the satisfaction of all in the upcoming legal proceedings
http://www.news.com.au/national/man...n-dies-in-sydney/story-e6frfkvr-1226302868915

Now back to the topic-litigation lenders. I'll wait a few more posts /votes before a give an example of how it works in real life.
 
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