WA - construction techniques will have to change.

45dB is pretty quiet!

no probelm with taking the thread OT - it's how conversation at a pub happens, i don't see why it's discouraged personally.....
 
the press goes on about these things like they are a new thing - was involved with a few going up in the north west, about a dozen or so a few years back. question marks over their insurability, but otherwise the reports back were excellent. the designs were sufficient to build the floor, walls ceiling and roof out of the stuff. Mind you the energy guys kept marking us down on the floors so we had to go back to concrete. cost savings... minimal. but very effective in the heat and cyclonically strong.

there's one going up on Elyard Cres in Balga....
 
if anyone is interested, i'm getting some INSANE construction prices back form some builders.

i don't know if they're desperate, but multi-storey developments that would have cost $1800+ per sqm not 2 years ago have just been priced at $1000 per sqm.

that's right - one thousand dollars per square meter - constructed to a "turn key" specification (carpets, blinds, internal paint).
 
It's time for WA to wake up and smell the coffee. We need to dramitically change our construction methods to light weight, well insulated homes with large eaves. Modern homes with Bauhaus and minimialist-inspired facades are fine, but your living areas do not need a 2.143 x 3.61m window facing North with minimal eaves.

You could get that post published in a construction or engineering journal Aaron.
Good work.

I don't go anywhere near domestic building but just peering over fences and the like another difference here is that the roof is made from timber components on site not frames braced and knocked up over a few days. It is a big exercise over here just to get the roof frame up.

Over east (Sydney at any rate) nearly all homes are made from prefabbed mgp pine frames just like the structure for the walls too prefabbed mgp prefabbed pine frames / brick veneer.
 
NRAS - as you lead or follow....

for what it is worth.... this is my experience with the NRAS.
1 The builder did not build in accordance with the contracted plans.

2 The builder did not build in accordance with the approved plans (held by council).

3 The builder built in accordance with the not approved plans without my knowledge.

4 No variations.

The builder did not get any variations for the following:

Example 1: Black colourbond roof and not a light coloured tiled roof (as per my contract).

Example2: Separation wall is a CSR 502 not an "interhome" separation wall (as per my contract).

Example3: One electrical meter box not two (as per my contract plans).

Example4: Pine frames and trusses instead of steel (as per my approved plans held by council).

CERTIFICATION

The building certifiers did not certify my NRAS investment property in accordance with the contract plans.

The building certifiers did not certify my NRAS investment property in accordance with

the approved plans (held by council).

The building certifiers certified my NRAS investment property in accordance with the not approved plans.

All attempts by me to have these issues resolved have failed.

In my view aprox 50K taken from my contract is not a reasonable or an expected outcome from the NRAS.

Lead away ...

Cheers
 
NRAS - as you lead or follow....

completely OT but i'll take a shot.

for what it is worth.... this is my experience with the NRAS.
1 The builder did not build in accordance with the contracted plans.

why not? is it a case of a 3x2 versus a 4x2 or a few walls are out a few hundred mm?

2 The builder did not build in accordance with the approved plans (held by council).

again, as per above.

3 The builder built in accordance with the not approved plans without my knowledge.

all variations to contract require a clients approval. however, good luck at the BRB as now you have an "equivelant" home.

4 No variations.

The builder did not get any variations for the following:

Example 1: Black colourbond roof and not a light coloured tiled roof (as per my contract).

BRB will see it as having "a roof" that "functions" - colour is immaterial unless you can prove financial hardship through lowering of values.

Example2: Separation wall is a CSR 502 not an "interhome" separation wall (as per my contract).

builder may substitute equivelant materials - brand names mena nothing as long as the fire seperartion meets the BCA 60/60/60

Example3: One electrical meter box not two (as per my contract plans).

why would you need two electrical meterboxes? is it a dual key home? do you have council approval for the dual key? if so, this would need to be rectified and the BRB would make the builder act on this.

Example4: Pine frames and trusses instead of steel (as per my approved plans held by council).

again, immaterial. you have a functioning roof of equivelant strength and unless you can prove financial hardship (did you pay more for steel and got timber?)......

CERTIFICATION

The building certifiers did not certify my NRAS investment property in accordance with the contract plans.

The building certifiers did not certify my NRAS investment property in accordance with

the approved plans (held by council).

The building certifiers certified my NRAS investment property in accordance with the not approved plans.

but you still have an NRAS certification? and a house that has a colorbond/timber roof not a tile/steel roof? and it's an investment and you're worried......why?

All attempts by me to have these issues resolved have failed.

In my view aprox 50K taken from my contract is not a reasonable or an expected outcome from the NRAS.

how was $50k "taken" from the contract? in the value of the construction - that's BRB grounds and you'll get that back if what they're charged for isn't what they've delivered. in the value of the house against the market - you MAY get that back subject to two valuer's reports at a minimum.

Lead away ...

is this $50k one you have assigned? if so, i highly doubt you'll get any credibility becasue you've just presented a "he said, she said" argument.

Cheers

for your follow.
 
like another difference here is that the roof is made from timber components on site not frames braced and knocked up over a few days. It is a big exercise over here just to get the roof frame up.
Fair dinkum? BIL was a subby decades ago. He and his mate would "build" the house and it would take them a week to "pitch" a roof. I can't remember when that was last done. Now the roof trusses are factory made with gang nails (spiky plates anyway) and delivered on site on a crane truck. They are lifted and fixed same day without ever hitting the ground.

Soooooo much better. :D
 
The other annoying thing about the 6 star ratings is they don't take into account surroundings. I've heard of people being forced to put awnings over their west windows when they are building in a steep cut and fill site and there's nothing out the west windows but a near sheer rock face. And that light coloured roof? That doesn't count. Your roof could be jet black tile or shiny silver reflective and you get the same rating for it.

Very surprised they put the same legislation on a house in Hobart vs Cairns considering how different the climate is and what works in one surely won't work in another.


Ha ha. I've just done a big extension. On one east facing wing we had a gable roof instead of the others all hip roof. Just because it's a gable, and no eve, we had to put awnings over the two windows that were there to get under the BASICS environmental stuff. But get this! Right over those two windows is a clarret ash tree, giving 100% shade in summer and 95% sun in winter. Perfect!!! But no, it doesn't count as it's a non native tree. What tha!!!:mad:

Gee thats dumb.

Anyway, I didn't put up the awnings, as it would have been totally pointless with the wonderfull tree there, and it wasn't picked up by the inspector.


See ya's.
 
Double brick won't ever go out of fashion here. Blow in or foam panel insulation is easy to install in the cavity and I am already seeing some builders offering it.
 
it wasn't picked up by the inspector.
You actually had an inspector out? :eek:

We had the bank valuation guy turn up 5 minutes after the house was built to make sure we really did build the house we said we would (apparently people seriously get loans to build 5 bedroom houses and then build 2br ones and pocket the difference) but we've never had anyone interested in the energy ratings.

When the bank inspector was here the builder hadn't finished our awnings, they were still in a pile of bits in the middle of the loungeroom. We actually asked for those, they are on two of our small west-facing windows (the big west facing window is 3m from a big blank wall and gets no sun in the late afternoon). I think we had them put on the spec after they worked out the energy rating though ... go figure.

And I've since planted three *gasp* not native deciduous trees on the north side of the house, so I suppose if we ever get an inspector out they will be duly ignored.
 
Is everyone still building double brick in WA? With the sharp rise in the cost of bricklayers i would have assumed the trend to be declining?
 
Is everyone still building double brick in WA? With the sharp rise in the cost of bricklayers i would have assumed the trend to be declining?

Might not be a visible decline yet but I'm helping someone do a project which is totally framed - not a single brick :)

$340k turnkey for duplex 2 x 1.5 x 1 two storey dwellings with approx 90sqm living area (128sqm total inc single garage, store, alfresco etc). Living on ground floor with powder room, 2 bedrooms and semi ensuite upstairs.

Build time around 20wks.
 
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Might not be a visible decline yet but I'm helping someone do a project which is totally framed - not a single brick :)

$340k turnkey for duplex 2 x 1.5 x 1 two storey dwellings with approx 90sqm living area. Living on ground floor with powder room, 2 bedrooms and semi ensuite upstairs.

Build time around 20wks.

Oh wow - sign me up for some of that.
 
Might not be a visible decline yet but I'm helping someone do a project which is totally framed - not a single brick :)

$340k turnkey for duplex 2 x 1.5 x 1 two storey dwellings with approx 90sqm living area (128sqm total inc single garage, store, alfresco etc). Living on ground floor with powder room, 2 bedrooms and semi ensuite upstairs.

Build time around 20wks.

nice work

r60 site?
 
Is everyone still building double brick in WA? With the sharp rise in the cost of bricklayers i would have assumed the trend to be declining?
Almost all new domestic contruction is double brick and colorbond. The few exceptions are concrete for multi-units and the two storey home builders that do non-double brick second storey. For example, 101 Residential uses MasterWall (1) and Ben Trager uses EIFS thermal panels (2). The difference between these systems and double brick upstairs is that double brick thermal and acoustic performance is generally poor whereas an externally insulated facade system has excellent thermal and acoustic properties (3).

That said, there are some exceptions to the norm. One notable example is Josh's House in Hilton, built by Josh Byrne (from Gardening Australia) to live in.
Tired of hearing that sustainable construction has to cost more, Josh and his colleagues set out to prove that resource efficient homes can be built at a comparable cost and timeframe to regular houses.(4)

The external walls of the house is a combination of double brick, reverse veneer brickwork and lightweight timber framing (5). The house has been constructed with 70 channels of data logging to determine the detailed thermal and operational energry performance of the house. The performance to date is very impressive considering the build cost was almost identical to double brick and tile (6). Needless to say, I am a huge fan. Who wouldn't want to live in a house that is a comfortable temperature almost year round but cost no more than a conventional house? The builder was just a run of the mill contract builder, Highbury Homes (7).

There are some more unusual examples too. The Green Swing development at 96 Rutland Avenue, Lathlain uses a combination of straw bales combined with reverse brick veneer construction and passive solar design principles (8). This is a great project where the owners could not afford to build a house each in Lathlain, so they got together, bought a site, build a main residence each and two apartment. The aparments were sold to help pay for the project. I can see the project from the train. It look great! Do I need to mention that getting council approval was a nightmare? (9). Needless to say, the R-Codes don't really set out an assessment framework for grouped dwellings and multiple dwellings on the same lot.

Anyway, sorry for the wall of text but this is a subject that I am very passionate about or perhaps slightly obsessed with :D

(1) http://www.101residential.com.au/faqs/
(2) http://www.bentragerhomes.com.au/the-ben-trager-difference/
(3) http://www.adelaidecitycouncil.com/...ion_for_exterior_walls_and_facade_systems.pdf
(4) http://joshshouse.com.au/about-the-project/
(5) http://joshshouse.com.au/about-the-project/the-property/house-plans/
(6) http://joshshouse.com.au/wp-content...-Year-1-Performance-Report-Design-Version.pdf
(7) http://www.highburyhomes.com.au/about-us/building-green/
(8) http://sustainablehouseday.com/item/the-green-swing-development-unit-2/
(9) http://www.thegreenswing.net/pages/96rutlandave/planningapproval.html
 
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