And who is the 'market', people behind that making decisions....?
Wage disparity
- Thread starter BayView
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And who is the 'market', people behind that making decisions....?
Start your own business or get a job in sales or join MLM - no discrimination there.
What you make WILL depend on your leadership skills, influence and visibility and credibility. The market does not care if you are male, female or hermaphrodite. You get what you put in.
If you waiting on someone to pay you then you will be at the effect of all their discrimination. Why go there?
What you make WILL depend on your leadership skills, influence and visibility and credibility. The market does not care if you are male, female or hermaphrodite. You get what you put in.
If you waiting on someone to pay you then you will be at the effect of all their discrimination. Why go there?
What about women tennis players compared to male?
Female actors compared to male?
Neuorosurgeons, not sure you could even find enough female neurosurgeon to make a statistically aignificant comparison Dex.
Latest data from Australia college of surgeons quotes the female percentage of surgeons as 8.5% (over all specialties). Othopods - 3%, neurosurgeons 10% female 90% male. If I was a betting man I would wager that the women earn less.
Female actors compared to male?
Neuorosurgeons, not sure you could even find enough female neurosurgeon to make a statistically aignificant comparison Dex.
Latest data from Australia college of surgeons quotes the female percentage of surgeons as 8.5% (over all specialties). Othopods - 3%, neurosurgeons 10% female 90% male. If I was a betting man I would wager that the women earn less.
I covered this in my opening post.
These are the sorts of things that skew the ABS stat.
Basically; more males at the pointy end - it doesn't necessarily mean they earn more at that end, and it doesn't mean females can.,t get employment at that end either - just less of the females to get their numbers up for the averages in the survey.
My take on this is a little different.
I agree with the previous posters on a lot of the points, but I want to focus on a year 10 school leaver with minimal skills and relatively low education.*
I stand corrected if I am wrong in this post as I don't have stats to back me up, just observation and discussion.
My observations are that lower educated women have more difficulty earning good money in 'socially acceptable' jobs, for example enrolled nurse, retail, Beauty, cleaner, hairdresser, teachers aide, restaurant work. The feedback I get is that women struggle to get more than $20 per hour in these positions.*
I have male friends and male clients who earn either close to 6 figures or in some cases over, yet these blokes don't have an academic background. For example, I guy I know works on the roads, and earned over $2000 in the past week, he knocked back shifts because he doesn't like paying tax...
Guys that hold a stop/go sign I believe have a casual rate of $40 per hour, http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/vi...QQFjAA&usg=AFQjCNFHGUE6FUT8yF558e55Tn6kNe41gg
I know another bloke who works shocking hours through the night setting up for major events, for example the Foo Fighters gig a couple of days ago, but earns really good money (over 6 figures).*
Panel beaters are another area where I believe they get good money.*
That's enough from me, I'll leave it for you all to dissect.*
- people pay more to see men play tennis so it's fair they get a bigger pay cheque.
- female actresses in their 20's get paid more than men but they generally have less pulling power so it's fair they get a lesser cut of the box office.
- female super models get paid more than male models.
- female porn actors get paid more than the men.
- female specialist surgeons probably get paid less then men because they're not as skilled. People will choose their specialist surgeon based on their work and the reviews they've read. Your statistics show there's not as many as males in the industry but whose fault is that?
I think you'd struggle to name one place where women are paid less for doing the same job because they'd be sued for it: Mcdonalds, Bunnings, Woolworths, BHP, Price Waterhouse, Caltex, nurses, teachers, police etc.
- female actresses in their 20's get paid more than men but they generally have less pulling power so it's fair they get a lesser cut of the box office.
- female super models get paid more than male models.
- female porn actors get paid more than the men.
- female specialist surgeons probably get paid less then men because they're not as skilled. People will choose their specialist surgeon based on their work and the reviews they've read. Your statistics show there's not as many as males in the industry but whose fault is that?
I think you'd struggle to name one place where women are paid less for doing the same job because they'd be sued for it: Mcdonalds, Bunnings, Woolworths, BHP, Price Waterhouse, Caltex, nurses, teachers, police etc.
Im not even sure wherher you are arguing that there is or isnt a disparity but in regardes to your tenniS
Lets lay out the basics
Prize money is identical for the tournaments, yet men play best of five and women best of three for the grand slams
Doubles gets paid less then singles regardless of gender
maria sharapova is the highest paid female and although she is good, she isnt the best, however she is one of the best looking
as for crowds, the men draw a bigger crowd in general.
Training to become a surgeon is an arduous and lengthy process. Basically, for a woman, it means putting on hold or choosing not to have children. Even putting on hold babies for a surgeon is difficult, as surgeons have a shorter career than most other Drs. This is single biggest reason why there are not more female surgeons, CEOs etc etc. Unfortunatley, we can't change biology.
Wage differences are not about "equal pay for equal jobs" it's a lot more complicated than that.
Wage differences are not about "equal pay for equal jobs" it's a lot more complicated than that.
It's a non-issue these days.
Very few positions would have an obvious disparity between men and women and more; hence the BS and wildly inaccurate claim with that ABS stat..
I can't think of one (forget sport and other non-job careers - performers and athletes are not "jobs" as such, and are driven largely by public appeal and demand).
It's all about total bums on seats - and at which end of the income ladder those bums are.
The "glass ceiling" issue is another topic, but we are seeing more and more women in the top jobs; so we can't use that as a strong argument..
Completely agree with Bayview.
In the corporate IT world in which I work, men and women are paid exactly the same (and so they should! This is a great thing).
In fact, when I was a graduate at a large American software company (and accidentally stumbled across everyone's salaries in an Excel spreadsheet on the LAN), I found that female juniors (graduates to 5 years experience) actually got paid MORE. This didn't make sense until I realised that our best looking female consultants were constantly billable and won more business. They were of equal skill and experience as any of the guys. I suspect this was because, given the choice most male client decision makers would choose them (all else being equal). Perhaps it was also to encourage them to stay working and not leave to have a family.
I've seen it more than just a few times on LinkedIn. Just 'friend' up an attractive young female in her 20's and watch her career progress from being a receptionist, to a PA or some kind of facilities/office manager to a highly paid executive assistant or HR manager without any real tertiary qualifications in a relatively short time frame.
Now don't get me wrong, that's not to say these people weren't skilled, smart or hard working or not deserving of their success in the slightest, I'm just saying this phenomenon does exist at least to a minor extent.
I would go as far to say that people who are pushing this agenda (third wave feminists) are not really seeking equality, they are seeking special treatment over and above equality.
Equal work for equal pay is a great thing however we already achieved that a long time ago.
In the corporate IT world in which I work, men and women are paid exactly the same (and so they should! This is a great thing).
In fact, when I was a graduate at a large American software company (and accidentally stumbled across everyone's salaries in an Excel spreadsheet on the LAN), I found that female juniors (graduates to 5 years experience) actually got paid MORE. This didn't make sense until I realised that our best looking female consultants were constantly billable and won more business. They were of equal skill and experience as any of the guys. I suspect this was because, given the choice most male client decision makers would choose them (all else being equal). Perhaps it was also to encourage them to stay working and not leave to have a family.
I've seen it more than just a few times on LinkedIn. Just 'friend' up an attractive young female in her 20's and watch her career progress from being a receptionist, to a PA or some kind of facilities/office manager to a highly paid executive assistant or HR manager without any real tertiary qualifications in a relatively short time frame.
Now don't get me wrong, that's not to say these people weren't skilled, smart or hard working or not deserving of their success in the slightest, I'm just saying this phenomenon does exist at least to a minor extent.
I would go as far to say that people who are pushing this agenda (third wave feminists) are not really seeking equality, they are seeking special treatment over and above equality.
Equal work for equal pay is a great thing however we already achieved that a long time ago.
I don't get your point, all of those 'socially acceptable' jobs you listed cater to men also and as others have stated an employer would be sued if they paid a woman less. As far as all of the other jobs you listed, women can choose to work in any of those professions, in fact several young women I know work on road construction as traffic controllers and do quite well from it, would be boring as hell if you ask me though.
Yep case closed. Women do get paid the same as men so let's shut this thread down and not dwell on this urban myth. In fact not only do women get paid the same as men but they often have better conditions for the same job, e.g. women are required to lift less than men in places like McDonald's and Bunnings.
Yep, you can't have your cake and it too.
Fair comment.
However, yesterday at work my collegues bought me cake, and I ate it too
It's definitely something to think about. I understand people might want to dismiss this issue by saying "Women in position X get as much as Men in position X" and let it be.
I tend to think about the issue of why female dominated occupations tend to get paid less than male dominated occupations. Some of it may well be market driven, but mayhaps there's also a historical component to these disparities.
To get off track a little bit more, I also wonder why political organisations have trouble recruiting, retaining, developing, and subsequently promoting female members on merit. Is there something broken in the political system that some parties feel to try and redress the problem with quotas, which don't really fix the problem but rather try and hide it?
I tend to think about the issue of why female dominated occupations tend to get paid less than male dominated occupations. Some of it may well be market driven, but mayhaps there's also a historical component to these disparities.
To get off track a little bit more, I also wonder why political organisations have trouble recruiting, retaining, developing, and subsequently promoting female members on merit. Is there something broken in the political system that some parties feel to try and redress the problem with quotas, which don't really fix the problem but rather try and hide it?
Why do they need to separate the competitions? Let the women play the men, if they win the get the same prize money?
Maybe the chicks are smarter, and get fed-up with all the BS that goes with being in Politics long before the blokes do, and say: "to hell with these BS artists; I'm outta here!"
Maybe the chicks are smarter, and get fed-up with all the BS that goes with being in Politics long before the blokes do, and say: "to hell with these BS artists; I'm outta here!"
Yeah, I understand that's tongue in cheek, but if the system is disenfranchising half the population it proclaims to represent, then it's the system that's broken. Buggered if I know how to fix it though, I checked out of party politics years ago and suddenly realised what a poisonous effect it was having on my life =/
There was an interesting article recently about the 'sexual orientation' pay gap.
http://www.smh.com.au/business/the-...less-but-women-earn-more-20150227-13qmxk.html
When you look at our discussion above through the eyes of 'masculine energy' and 'feminine energy' (rather than a persons sex) this also makes sense to me.
In fact, this to me is evidence it's not a sex based thing.
http://www.smh.com.au/business/the-...less-but-women-earn-more-20150227-13qmxk.html
- Gay men were paid less on average than straight men.
- Lesbian women were paid more on average than straight women.
When you look at our discussion above through the eyes of 'masculine energy' and 'feminine energy' (rather than a persons sex) this also makes sense to me.
In fact, this to me is evidence it's not a sex based thing.
