What does your accountant do for you?

[Delilah]

Over the years I have mostly hired an accountant in the year that we purchased a property and in the years we haven't I've done it myself. The accountants I have hired didn't seem to do anything I couldn't.

The thing I am wondering is, I do all the leg work, I type up a spreadsheet for all our IPS etc and add up all our costs etc. So all they are doing is taking my work and typing it into the boxes.

Is this what most people do (prepare all the work for them?) or do you hand them all your filing/paperwork and let them do the leg work?

I am also wondering if you just call your accountant whenever you have questions and ask them without having to book a meeting in with them? I quite often just have a question I'd like to ask via email but don't want to go in and see them but I feel like this isn't something I should do more than once or twice a year.

I guess now that we have several IP's and they charge per property, it is costing us quite an amount. And while I appreciate that they are professionals and need to earn a living as well, I just feel that even if I did miss a few things here or there, it would never add up to the amount they charge.

I feel like the only professional missing from my team is a good accountant but not quite sure if I really need one?

 

[Paul@PFI]

That's a good question and probably an important one for all tax clients to ask themselves to ensure they get value for the cost.

As a accountant and tax adviser I see the return preparation as a simple task. Take the client info and shove it into the boxes and then it calculates an estimate, print it, sign it. Lodge it. But its only part of what I do.

Sure I can identify a tax issue before I even prep the return....HELP debt issues, private health insurance etc....Most DIY taxpayers assume that what they did was correct...Is it ? Here is a simple test and I see a lot of DIY errors on this - Do you BOTH have private health insurance ? Do you report your defacto etc as a spouse if you don't to get around the problem ??? Its really easy for this to be detected. It takes about two years but they do find it.

There is a bit more to it and that's where the good ones do a good job and the bad ones show their value....

1. I review the client summary - Can I write things off, bring fwd borrowing deductions, Depn advice. What is normal that has been missed. Give guidance on repairs and what is deductible.
2. Suggest strategies...This week a new client I suggested he buy half of his wife's house they live in at present (they intend this to be an IP soon). No stamp duty, no CGT, higher CGT cost base. Increase deductible loan and reduce PPOR loan (non-ded) but overall their total borrowings wont change.
3. review mistakes of the past !! I often find things missed in prior years. eg Depreciation. I might then have to amend.
4. Most clients have questions....
5. CGT guidance, questions about developing, reno's, deductions, changes to employee remuneration etc etc....

By the time I'm done I'm confident that the return that is lodged represents the best possible outcome that is legal. Neither overpay or underpay tax is the aim.


I must ask - Why, why, why Delilah ??

 

[Delilah]

So do you charge a set amount, plus additional per property? Or do you charge per/hr of time it takes you?

You obviously get a mix of people who do as I do and give you it all in spreadsheet form and also others who just hand you all their paperwork? Do you charge differently for this?

I guess the two prior accountants who I have hired, really haven't been as helpful as you have explained Paul. I have just taken their printouts from previous years to make sure I covered everything they did.

 

[Aaron_C]

You are paying to ensure that the right numbers go into each box.

 

[jim1964]

You are paying to ensure that the right numbers go into each box.

And as my accountant has recently found out,this isn't always that straight forward in this game.

 

[EN710]

And as my accountant has recently found out,this isn't always that straight forward in this game.

And after dabbling with eTax 2014, some of the boxes can be confusing so I go back to my accountant haha... this is the cost of not knowing how to do your tax return

 

[Paul@PFI]

So do you charge a set amount, plus additional per property? Or do you charge per/hr of time it takes you?

You obviously get a mix of people who do as I do and give you it all in spreadsheet form and also others who just hand you all their paperwork? Do you charge differently for this?

I guess the two prior accountants who I have hired, really haven't been as helpful as you have explained Paul. I have just taken their printouts from previous years to make sure I covered everything they did.

For SS clients I prefer a fixed agreed fee. Typically subject to CGT issues of substance. eg selling a property etc.But if you do that well then its no extra. I will check you got it right.

I offer this form of fee for personal returns, trusts and for SMSFs where property and shares are involved. . I do expect a reliable summary to offer that sort of fee. If the client is disorganised it will take me longer and cost you more.

If you want a quote just send me a email to my direct email below.

Did you know I can access the ATO records directly and in some cases can do a return without the client sending me a thing...(Simple taxpayers with dividends, interest, salary, pensions , super etc)

 

[zimby]

That's a good question and probably an important one for all tax clients to ask themselves to ensure they get value for the cost.

As a accountant and tax adviser I see the return preparation as a simple task. Take the client info and shove it into the boxes and then it calculates an estimate, print it, sign it. Lodge it. But its only part of what I do.

Sure I can identify a tax issue before I even prep the return....HELP debt issues, private health insurance etc....Most DIY taxpayers assume that what they did was correct...Is it ? Here is a simple test and I see a lot of DIY errors on this - Do you BOTH have private health insurance ? Do you report your defacto etc as a spouse if you don't to get around the problem ??? Its really easy for this to be detected. It takes about two years but they do find it.

There is a bit more to it and that's where the good ones do a good job and the bad ones show their value....

1. I review the client summary - Can I write things off, bring fwd borrowing deductions, Depn advice. What is normal that has been missed. Give guidance on repairs and what is deductible.
2. Suggest strategies...This week a new client I suggested he buy half of his wife's house they live in at present (they intend this to be an IP soon). No stamp duty, no CGT, higher CGT cost base. Increase deductible loan and reduce PPOR loan (non-ded) but overall their total borrowings wont change.
3. review mistakes of the past !! I often find things missed in prior years. eg Depreciation. I might then have to amend.
4. Most clients have questions....
5. CGT guidance, questions about developing, reno's, deductions, changes to employee remuneration etc etc....

By the time I'm done I'm confident that the return that is lodged represents the best possible outcome that is legal. Neither overpay or underpay tax is the aim.


I must ask - Why, why, why Delilah ??

And ontop of this find time to post on the forums

 

[Jamie M]

I couldn't imagine not using my accountant - not just for business but for IPs too. A good accountant makes life so much easier IMO.

Cheers

Jamie

 

[Blair007]

Do you BOTH have private health insurance ? Do you report your defacto etc as a spouse if you don't to get around the problem ??? Its really easy for this to be detected. It takes about two years but they do find it.

So myself and my partner both don't have private health insurance. i am subject to the medicare levy surcharge but last year my girlfriend wasn't - we did a joint tax return and avoided the surcharge, does this mean i have done something wrong?
This was advice given to us by a tax accountant aswell?

The thing that gets me is that with accountants i find that one can tell me one thing and another something completely different. I guess the same goes for a lot of professions but with accounting you can really see in $$$ terms how much incorrect advice can change things.

 

[D.T.]

To me, the tax return once a year (per entity) is the easy bit and normally handled by August or September.

Accountant's value is in what they do the rest of the year. I always have random questions, some of these are pretty basic such as "is xyz deductible?" and some are a bit more advanced such as "what structure do i use for this deal?". Their ability (and willingness) to quickly come up with accurate answers that are in plain English is what sets one apart from another i think.

 

[Patosan]

Well our accountant handles the trust too, this has been valuable at various times over the years. To be honest there are times when I wonder, like Delilah, whether they're worth the coin ... this usually happens after a few years of no new activity. In such cases the only things that change are drepeciation rates, or some such small thing ... maybe.

Guess I think of them as my shield against, future unforeseen financial adversaries. You usually don't need them, but it only takes one stray arrow to pierce your chest ... so I'd rather have a shield than not.

PS Hey Paul I just took a look at your Co site. I've got to ask what does "We do more things for fewer people" mean ?
"fewer" being the point I don't get ! Am I alone on this ?

 

[Delilah]

Accountant's value is in what they do the rest of the year. I always have random questions, some of these are pretty basic such as "is xyz deductible?" and some are a bit more advanced such as "what structure do i use for this deal?". Their ability (and willingness) to quickly come up with accurate answers that are in plain English is what sets one apart from another i think.

Yes this is why I mostly need one as well but so far I have only hired an accountant in my purchasing years, so I feel like I can't just drop them an email question unless I continue to hire them every year.

A few of you have said you are paying for them to ensure the right numbers go into the boxes or to shield yourself (from mistakes?). Well I am more than competent to get my numbers right, file and keep receipts correctly.

I guess I find it surprising that so many people who own IP's do so much diligent research on where, what, when to buy but they don't continue to research and understand their own tax to the same degree.

 

[Paul@PFI]

And ontop of this find time to post on the forums

Thanks Mum...I manage my time an dont charge the client. I can do that with agreed fees.

Its my personal marketing budget.

 

[Paul@PFI]

Well our accountant handles the trust too, this has been valuable at various times over the years. To be honest there are times when I wonder, like Delilah, whether they're worth the coin ... this usually happens after a few years of no new activity. In such cases the only things that change are drepeciation rates, or some such small thing ... maybe.

Guess I think of them as my shield against, future unforeseen financial adversaries. You usually don't need them, but it only takes one stray arrow to pierce your chest ... so I'd rather have a shield than not.

PS Hey Paul I just took a look at your Co site. I've got to ask what does "We do more things for fewer people" mean ?
"fewer" being the point I don't get ! Am I alone on this ?

Actually I dont understand your post. Wasnt sure if you were being humorous or offensive ? Or perhaps thick. Fewer means lesser, or a smaller numerical quantity. I do more for those people. More than others. I include more for the same price. ...Oh **** do I have to explain ??

Today alone I spoke with several new potential SS clients and others too. In every instance I explained how I could do more for a lower cost than they presently pay. I'm not interested in churning through tax returns lodgements - Did that a while back. My delivery is in value.
Todays issues :
- One client is transferring half their house t spouse for no CGT, no stamp duty, increased IP deductions.
- Another will save 60% GST by using the margin scheme
- Another didnt realise their existing accountant didnt explain depreciation and will get a QS report for 4 properties and claim three years x $16K and get a much bigger refunds
- A decease estate mistake made by a lawyer who told the client the wrong CGT info.

 

[The Y-man]

Actually I dont understand your post. Wasnt sure if you were being humorous or offensive ? Or perhaps thick. Fewer means lesser, or a smaller numerical quantity. I do more for those people. More than others. I include more for the same price. ...Oh **** do I have to explain ??

I actually don't get it either - might be very thick too mind you.

It sounds kind of negative - like "we don't want you"...?

The Y-man

 

[Jaggannath]

Exclusivity... he's saying he takes on less people so that he can provide them with a better service. Perhaps he needed to say higher quality by keeping numbers low, but I got it.

 

[Terry_w]

some people want an accountant that does this:

received shoe boxes full of original receipts
adds them up for me
keeps my original documents safe
posts them back to me 4 times per year whenever I ask
answers complex emails with tax advice for free

and only charges $400 pa.

 

[EN710]

some people want an accountant that does this:

received shoe boxes full of original receipts
adds them up for me
keeps my original documents safe
posts them back to me 4 times per year whenever I ask

add - documents need to be available at a quick notice, after all, you have it in your system so not supposed to be that difficult right A jest of course, I took 10 mins to find my previous tax return in a pile of documents...

I bet SS is a good marketing investment, especially for really good service provider - otherwise they'll get chopped into pieces in public