Well done Jen, it must be a good feeling to have it over with and the tenants in place. Sounds like you guys also learnt a lot that will help for the next one. Looking at your prices i reckon you did pretty good, especially the dishwasher, sink & tap, window & floor coverings. [thumbs up icon]
Jen's-can't change a lightbulb-reno attempt
- Thread starter Bandita
- Start date
Hi JenD,
Thanks for sharing those figures.
I'm not sure how others here calculate and judge the profitability or financial success of their renovations, but I was wondering the following...and only if you are happy to elaborate further of course...
In your reno., what would the following look like...
Purchase price + 'purchasing' costs (eg. initial loan costs, conveyancing, LMI, buyers agent's fees) + stamp duty + loan interest payments whilst property vacant (+/- loan principal payments if P&I loan whilst property vacant) + renovation costs + other costs of holding the property + 'mistakes' costs + other 'unexpected/unaccounted for' costs = X...
I would be very interested in this value 'X', and its comparison to the actual new property valuation that is pending...
People here may agree or disagree as to its relevance though.
Thanks again.
GSJ
ADD: And in case people start posting for me to stop being 'critical' etc..., I do appreciate that regardless of the 'numbers' the knowledge/experience gained from this reno. is probably invaluable to you.
Hi GSJ,
I think the "number crunching" of the the purchase costs depends on the purpose of buying the property. If it was a buy, reno, sell, all the "costs of buying the property" are very very important. However, we were planning on buying and holding an IP with or without a reno - so the costs of buying were always going to be there, and something we'd hope to absorb overtime with the capital gains.
But, I'm happy to share the numbers (these are rough estimates though):
Purchase price: $235k
Stamp duty/transfer/other fees: $10k
LMI and other costs: $3k
Legals: $500
Total Purchase costs: $248,500
Total Loan amount: $227,500k (Interest only at 7.27%)
Had we NOT done the reno:
Rental: ~$180 per week x 5 months: $3,900 income
Interest: ~$1378 x 5 months: ($6,890)
Net: ($2,990)
Total cost of Property at 5 months:
$248,500 + $2,990 = ($251,490)
Value of property after 5 months (assuming 7%-10% growth pa): $242-$245k
Net (Loss): ($9,500 to $6,500)
WITH Reno:
Reno costs: ($25,000)
Loss of rent: ($3,900)
Interest Costs: ($6,890)
Total: ($35,790)
Total cost of Property at 5 months with reno:
$248,500 + $35,790 = ($284,290)
Value of Property after reno: $300-$330k
Net Gain: $15,710 - $45,710
So we are in essence at worst case (assuming best growth without reno and worst value with reno) $22,210 better off having decided to do the reno.
Oh, and added bonus is new rental of $300 per week!
This, of course, all depends on the reno valuation......I don't think we're too far off though.....
But, again, the property purchase costs and interest costs were going to happen anyways - we wanted an IP for the long haul and those are some of the costs that you just can't avoid no matter what
Cheers,
Jen
Thanks GSJ (and of course Sailor!),
Yes, I hope our costs breakdown will help others in planning their reno - especially with the things you never think of!!! - I'm pretty confident on the valuation, but even if it comes out awful, as I've said many times before - this reno has been truly invaluable to us for a number of reasons - and if there are others thinking about it and you have the spare cash behind you and of course can see some value adding in your property, don't be scared, you CAN do it!! Just expect alot of time, dust, dust, dust, patience, unexpected craziness, more dust, difficult tradies (oh, reminds me - have I told the toilet story - tell me if I haven't, definite classic!), more dust, more time, and more dust!
And blocked toilets
Cheers,
Jen
Yes, I hope our costs breakdown will help others in planning their reno - especially with the things you never think of!!! - I'm pretty confident on the valuation, but even if it comes out awful, as I've said many times before - this reno has been truly invaluable to us for a number of reasons - and if there are others thinking about it and you have the spare cash behind you and of course can see some value adding in your property, don't be scared, you CAN do it!!
Just expect alot of time, dust, dust, dust, patience, unexpected craziness, more dust, difficult tradies (oh, reminds me - have I told the toilet story - tell me if I haven't, definite classic!), more dust, more time, and more dust! And blocked toilets
Cheers,
Jen
I like your style, Kenster!! You've seen "The Secret", haven't you?
BTW, what an outstanding job, Jen!!!!! I just logged on here yesterday and read all 15 pages of this thread all afternoon. Couldn't tear myself away. Well done, if your figures are correct, you have achieved something pretty amazing. I was going to offer you some advice, but it seems I don't need to! Congrats!
BTW, what an outstanding job, Jen!!!!! I just logged on here yesterday and read all 15 pages of this thread all afternoon. Couldn't tear myself away. Well done, if your figures are correct, you have achieved something pretty amazing. I was going to offer you some advice, but it seems I don't need to! Congrats!
Thank you all so much for your comments, yes, we're pretty happy with the result.......but encouraged by a few PM's I should tell the full "end of reno" story with the toilet plumbing ---strange enough the exact same thing happened in the brand new house we've just moved into---so I definitly consider it a "tradies issue" to watch out for!!
So, Geoff and I are back from my brothers wedding, getting ready to leave for our own wedding and doing the final clean of the property for the new tenants to move in (it had been cleaned thoroughly before, but as I said, the dust is incredible and after 2 weeks it had settled again, time for one last clean - during our holiday, we needed the tiler to come in to finish off the splashback in the kitchen - because there wasn't enought tiles for the splashback that we initially estimated....and then there was the fire that burnt our tile place down!!...and then we also needed the hadyman to do the finishing touches)........anyways, we were doing the final cleaning, and Geoff decided to use the toilet (thank god it was just to pee).....he flushed and within 5 seconds it was....oh ****!!!....toilets overflowing.......to make a long disgusting story short......I had my arm fully into the toilet (through the drain, yuck, yuck) i pulled out a piece of "paper" (i.e cardboard) that the tradies had obviously used as toilet paper at the end of the reno......the water FINALLY went down......a flush later and it was still overflowing......I repeated my flexible arm movements and pulled out another cardboard piece of paper.......2 flushes later, and all was good...then right before we left we decided to flush it one more time.....overflowing toilet...there was still more cardboard stuck in the toilet (got to love these water saving toilets - they won't flush anything!!)......so my arm goes in again......can't feel anything....we don't know what to do - we have tenants moving in tomorrow do we call a plumber at midnight and pay a bucketload to get this fixed???.....no, we get clever....it's midnight, we have no plumber, we have nothing - we even tried to stuff the garden hose from the courtyard down the toilet to push the cardboard down - the toilet itself has SO many twists, it was useless)........so back to my arm - didn't work, this stuff had obviously made it fully through the tiolet maze.......so we got the "drinking cup" from the bathroom (that's ALL we had the size that could take out water).....and cup by cup I pulled the water out of toilet, dumped it into the sink - Geoff thought I was crazy - but I knew we were going to get nowhere with a clogged full toilet.......right when I got to the point that the cup was too big to take out anymore water, the suction I was waiting for happened, and whatever it was, was sucked through......and the toiled flushed like it was brand new again!!
Geoff and I vowed to NEVER speak again of where my hands had been that night......but I feel it's acceptable enough to post on a reno thread.....lesson learned - either make the toilet the LAST part of the reno, or provide toilet paper - the tradies will put anthing and EVERYTHING down your toilet (remember, it's not their place, they DON'T care!!)
The hilarious part of it was, that about a month later, we moved into a brand new rental house which has the bedrooms and main bathrooms upstairs....but their was a toilet downstairs and the owner met us and was complaining that she couldn't understand it, but the downstairs toilet kept overflowing.......I asked her if there was tradies in the house and if she'd provided toilet paper....she said no, it wasn't finished, didn't think to put in toilet paper......the next day the plumber pulled out as much cardboard as I had at the Ormond Reno......
yuck yuck yuck!!!!
Cheers,
Jen
So, Geoff and I are back from my brothers wedding, getting ready to leave for our own wedding and doing the final clean of the property for the new tenants to move in (it had been cleaned thoroughly before, but as I said, the dust is incredible and after 2 weeks it had settled again, time for one last clean - during our holiday, we needed the tiler to come in to finish off the splashback in the kitchen - because there wasn't enought tiles for the splashback that we initially estimated....and then there was the fire that burnt our tile place down!!...and then we also needed the hadyman to do the finishing touches)........anyways, we were doing the final cleaning, and Geoff decided to use the toilet (thank god it was just to pee).....he flushed and within 5 seconds it was....oh ****!!!....toilets overflowing.......to make a long disgusting story short......I had my arm fully into the toilet (through the drain, yuck, yuck) i pulled out a piece of "paper" (i.e cardboard) that the tradies had obviously used as toilet paper at the end of the reno......the water FINALLY went down......a flush later and it was still overflowing......I repeated my flexible arm movements and pulled out another cardboard piece of paper.......2 flushes later, and all was good...then right before we left we decided to flush it one more time.....overflowing toilet...there was still more cardboard stuck in the toilet (got to love these water saving toilets - they won't flush anything!!)......so my arm goes in again......can't feel anything....we don't know what to do - we have tenants moving in tomorrow do we call a plumber at midnight and pay a bucketload to get this fixed???.....no, we get clever....it's midnight, we have no plumber, we have nothing - we even tried to stuff the garden hose from the courtyard down the toilet to push the cardboard down - the toilet itself has SO many twists, it was useless)........so back to my arm - didn't work, this stuff had obviously made it fully through the tiolet maze.......so we got the "drinking cup" from the bathroom (that's ALL we had the size that could take out water).....and cup by cup I pulled the water out of toilet, dumped it into the sink - Geoff thought I was crazy - but I knew we were going to get nowhere with a clogged full toilet.......right when I got to the point that the cup was too big to take out anymore water, the suction I was waiting for happened, and whatever it was, was sucked through......and the toiled flushed like it was brand new again!!
Geoff and I vowed to NEVER speak again of where my hands had been that night......but I feel it's acceptable enough to post on a reno thread.....lesson learned - either make the toilet the LAST part of the reno, or provide toilet paper - the tradies will put anthing and EVERYTHING down your toilet (remember, it's not their place, they DON'T care!!)
The hilarious part of it was, that about a month later, we moved into a brand new rental house which has the bedrooms and main bathrooms upstairs....but their was a toilet downstairs and the owner met us and was complaining that she couldn't understand it, but the downstairs toilet kept overflowing.......I asked her if there was tradies in the house and if she'd provided toilet paper....she said no, it wasn't finished, didn't think to put in toilet paper......the next day the plumber pulled out as much cardboard as I had at the Ormond Reno......
yuck yuck yuck!!!!
Cheers,
Jen
Hi Jen
I am glad to see I'm not the only one willing to stick my arm down a dunny.
Trust me your hand (with glove thank you) and a scourer and some CLR is the only way to clean a disgusting toilet, when every one else thinks you need a new one.
I always have toilet paper around, or else paper towel.
By the way Jenny I am in Melbourne for the grand final get in thurs 27/9 morming and leave the following monday morning, I would like to see if we can catch up for a coffee?
I am glad to see I'm not the only one willing to stick my arm down a dunny.
Trust me your hand (with glove thank you) and a scourer and some CLR is the only way to clean a disgusting toilet, when every one else thinks you need a new one.
I always have toilet paper around, or else paper towel.
By the way Jenny I am in Melbourne for the grand final get in thurs 27/9 morming and leave the following monday morning, I would like to see if we can catch up for a coffee?
Hi Jen,
Love the photos and reading your story, could you please tell me what work you plumber did for $1500.00. l am just trying to work out if the plumber we hired overcharged us for similar work we did to our investment property.
Thanks
Love the photos and reading your story, could you please tell me what work you plumber did for $1500.00. l am just trying to work out if the plumber we hired overcharged us for similar work we did to our investment property.
Thanks
