Anticon Roof Insulation

[jeffp3]

G'day,

So, almost everyone I speak to, including my builder, says putting Anticon into investment houses is a waste of money. They believe I would be better off spending the dosh on things that give it better resale value.

Its hard to argue against that.

The only person who disagrees with this is my cousin, who is a sparky and works in roofs all the time, and reckons he has never been in a colourbond roof that doesn't t have it. Insulation under the tin makes good sense.

So, spending $6k or so on putting it into my 3 units currently under construction wont give any increased sale value, but I feel kinda guilty not doing it..................

 

[AlmostBob]

Aus is waaaaaay behind in insulation
vapour barrier insulation is the standard here in the frozen north,
the edges of the sheets are taped together to provide a seamless seal to keep air from being able to pass between the sheets.
looking at the brochure, that is not the way the product is installed when it has to work, (r-factor & brrrr factor).
crushed between the roofing sheets and the joists/bearers/trusses, the insulation would be crushed to paper thin, & be useless.
to keep 20[sup]0[/sup]C inside and minus 20[sup]0[/sup] outside, a similar system is installed, But under the joists.
roof sheet,
airgap (around the joists) to reduce transmission
insulation to reduce transmission
taped sealed foil for reflection and no air infiltration,
same quantity of product, r12 instead of r4

We had the expanding foam guys out to insulate under the floor of a (new to us) minihome, on stumps, it gets COLD under there, 3 inches r21 seamless water proof, wind proof
3 hours
we spent a time wintersitting a house in the NSW alps, also on stumps, above the snow line, nothing under the floor, HUGE FIRE that would be used here to heat a huge 5 unit building, damn it was cold
Aus is way behind in insulation

From the building owners perspective, Extra heat/extra cold in the roof hurts the function of plant in the roofspace
Your plant, aircons, heaters
Your cost when its hot enough to pressure vent the operating gas from the aircon,
It wont be long before insualtion becomes a selling point,
as soon as purchasers realise how much difference in running costs real insulation makes

note to anyone interested,
it costs less to heat this 5 unit apartment building in which we and the kids live,
against minus 20[sup]0[/sup] outside,
than aussies pay to heat single homes against 12[sup]0[/sup] outside​

I think insulation is worth it, install cost V ongoing-cost

 

[Scott No Mates]

I can't believe that you would consider not putting insulation under any roof considering that these are new builds. It may be an IP today but when you come to sell, it may well be someone's PPOR.

What do you mean it doesn't give you resale value - buyers look at running costs ie how can I cool the place when it is 40 degrees/warm it when it is only 10 degrees; B&P inspectors note whether it has insulation; in ACT it is essential to provide an efficiency rating.

Don't you have to meet a NABERs rating in WA? The cost of electricity is skyrocketing, this is an energy efficiency strategy along with the LED downlights, low E glass, etc that you have installed.

 

[jeffp3]

I can't believe that you would consider not putting insulation under any roof considering that these are new builds. It may be an IP today but when you come to sell, it may well be someone's PPOR.

What do you mean it doesn't give you resale value - buyers look at running costs ie how can I cool the place when it is 40 degrees/warm it when it is only 10 degrees; B&P inspectors note whether it has insulation; in ACT it is essential to provide an efficiency rating.

Don't you have to meet a NABERs rating in WA? The cost of electricity is skyrocketing, this is an energy efficiency strategy along with the LED downlights, low E glass, etc that you have installed.

Yep, i hear ya, and that's been my view all along, when i sell it will be someone's PPOR, and they would want the Anticon.

However, it does meet the 6 star energy rating without it, so technically isn't required.

 

[westminster]

I can't believe that you would consider not putting insulation under any roof considering that these are new builds. It may be an IP today but when you come to sell, it may well be someone's PPOR.

What do you mean it doesn't give you resale value - buyers look at running costs ie how can I cool the place when it is 40 degrees/warm it when it is only 10 degrees; B&P inspectors note whether it has insulation; in ACT it is essential to provide an efficiency rating.

Don't you have to meet a NABERs rating in WA? The cost of electricity is skyrocketing, this is an energy efficiency strategy along with the LED downlights, low E glass, etc that you have installed.

As standard Jeff's roof will have batt insulation and the whole house will be 6 star compliant. Jeff is considering adding extra insulation in the form of anticon.

Personally for an IP I think the 6 star compliance is enough of a selling point for people that might want to buy it for a PPOR. It already is a value add over other houses prior to the system that might only be 2-4 stars.

My PPOR does have Anticon but this was 2003 and the only pink batts we could use with it were very low R rating.

 

[jeffp3]

As standard Jeff's roof will have batt insulation and the whole house will be 6 star compliant. Jeff is considering adding extra insulation in the form of anticon.

Personally for an IP I think the 6 star compliance is enough of a selling point for people that might want to buy it for a PPOR. It already is a value add over other houses prior to the system that might only be 2-4 stars.

My PPOR does have Anticon but this was 2003 and the only pink batts we could use with it were very low R rating.

Fair call Myf, its still 6 star compliant, and hence lies the quandary.

But Almostbob has a point regarding the "baking" of the aircon and other bits in the roof during summer, and the fact that the tin on the roof will provide absolutely zero protection for the ceiling (which has insulation as you said)

 

[westminster]

I should point out that Highgate will be 7.5 stars and insulated up the wazoo inc low E glass. So I can see both sides and its a one time opportunity to put in at roofing time.
In the scheme of things $2k per villa won't break the bank but if I wanted to add value I'd do it with something more tangible like a $3k solar power panel or something like that.
So I'm not helping - I know! Imagine the $6k and write a list of all the things you can buy with it with Anticon as one of them then rank and choose one. I'd have on there:
- cedar lined alfresco
- stone bench tops to ensuite
- split air con to master bedrooms
- solar hot water system
- rainwater tank and connect it to retic
- upgrade alfresco paving to poured concrete aggregate or wooden decking.

 

[jeffp3]

I should point out that Highgate will be 7.5 stars and insulated up the wazoo inc low E glass. So I can see both sides and its a one time opportunity to put in at roofing time.
In the scheme of things $2k per villa won't break the bank but if I wanted to add value I'd do it with something more tangible like a $3k solar power panel or something like that.
So I'm not helping - I know! Imagine the $6k and write a list of all the things you can buy with it with Anticon as one of them then rank and choose one. I'd have on there:
- cedar lined alfresco
- stone bench tops to ensuite
- split air con to master bedrooms
- solar hot water system
- rainwater tank and connect it to retic
- upgrade alfresco paving to poured concrete aggregate or wooden decking.

The list is a good idea. From your list i already have all of it already bar the solar panels (although i have solar hot water), rain tank, and concrete paving.

My upgrade list is Garage Doors, and render (although ive given up on that one)

Its the ultimate quandary i believe, spend money on something visible and tangible, or on something intangible but logical.

 

[westminster]

Jeff - how much extra was the cedar lining? I could be tempted by that

 

[jeffp3]

Was pretty reasonable actually, just on $3k for all 3.

 

[AlmostBob]

This stufflinked isnt yet available in Aus, probably is under another name
$2000 to insulate a 14*64 , to R21 (3 inches thick is r21) set the gun to spray 1 inch thick and it would eat any of the current standard R4 batts at R7
its fast
relatively easy and cheap to do
If you've seen Holmes on Homes reno repair show you've seen it

 

[westminster]

Was pretty reasonable actually, just on $3k for all 3.

Cool I think I'll add it to Gwelup. I love the look.