business names (not property, per say)

[TheCamel]

I'm currently considering some options in my life - specifically, starting an IT contracting/consulting business on my own. I figure if I've got this much passion for my job, and I put all my heart and soul into it, I may as well do it for my own benefit...

anyway, we're trying to work out business naming. I want to do things right straight from the start, and with a long term view, so sole trader won't cut it, as if it works, I want to be in a position later to hire others, so I recognise needs to be either a trust or a company structure.

A business name does not have to be a trading name, but the trading name has to be available in the state (or states) where we wish to trade under that name ?

Ie, I could could the Business itself, Direct IT Pty Ltd
and then a trading name of TheCamel Solutions in Victoria where I live
THen, later on, hire a contracter on NSW, and find that TheCamel Solutions is not available, am I correct in this regard ?

this is a good example to use actually.. cause DirectIT Is in use, but we don't really want to use it...however I can see it as an Entity name, and a Trading name..

an entity name is the actual name of the business, and the trading name is the name it trades under.. but they CAN be one and the same ?

 

[gcad]

I have a little bit of experience in this matter having recently setup a couple of businesses - certainly no expert though!

Yes the entity and the trading name are one and the same. For example I am the director of a Pty. Ltd. company that has one ABN for the 2 businesses that I operate - however I don't actively advertise the company name - it only appears on business documents like invoices as Company Pty. Ltd. trading as Business XYZ. When people recommend my business to others they don't say "you should try Company Pty. Ltd." it's "you should try Business XYZ". If I only planned on running one business I may have decided to register the company as Business XYZ Pty. Ltd. to save $77 on the business name registration fee.

As for registering your business name in other states - it all depends on where your business is located. If you have an office in Victoria but do some work in NSW you would only need to register a business name in NSW if you had a physical location there. I am based in Victoria but one of my businesses makes sales interstate and internationally - that doesn't mean that I need to register a business name in every state or country that I make a sale in.

 

[jaycee]

Put it this way.

There's 2 names Legal name (entity name) and Trading Name (what goes on your shop front and what you advertise.

Can they be the smae- probably.

Does it make a difference - probably not !

http://abr.business.gov.au/(yl3azmz...52c0%252c0%252c0%252c%252c0%26amp%3bstart%3d0

 

[grossreal]

hi
business name is important
company name is not
and they should be separate and different
the reason is you may well want to sell the business
now if the business is abc consuling and the company is abc consulting pty that makes it difficult to sell the business without the company
you could have assets in the company that bare no relation to abc consulting and maywell not want to sell these assetts
now if you had abc consulting and blue mountain pty then you could sell abc without affecting blue mountain in anyway and you can have abc cdb efg all under blue mountain and sell them of as need be
the same goes for developing or buying property
the idea is to have multy companies under the one umbrella
adn as you need to op[en or close these companies the head stays the same and never changes
with re gard to the business name it need to be some thing that explains what you do
ultraclean
does not sound like its a thai restaurant or a computer consulting business as its not
its a business name and no won't give any clues what it does
but you need to get a name as close as possible to what you do and then use a company at the back of it and that can be any name.
you can use a unusual name like apple which is a non distinct name and then push it into the market.
horizon
virgin
bluestone
scope
and the list goes on
this are words that people know but do not bring into there minds a business
so you have to put the recognition in there and thats where advertising etc comes in.
I use non distincts as they are easy and the name is easy to register.

but that a choice thing.
the name really depends on how or what you are going to be doing and if you want to be seen in your own right or you want a corporate placement john reed consulting is fine but when it become large enough everyone will ask can I speak to john reed please even telemarketers and that does caorse a problem as most will say its personal and half your day is taken up with I am not interested.
and you don't want then to change to reeed consulting as the cost and the loss of that buildup client base or word of mouth has just gone
the business and its name does need to be planned and how you want to be seen in 5 to 10 years.
and also when everything goes to custard how to get rid of this and hold the structure together and that is a very big planning part
I would recommend to talk to a receiver or an accountant that works with insolvency and set the company up correct from the start to be armed is to be for warned and if set up from the start does go very well.
setting up a business to succeed is not just a matter of a name and a company( they usually fail)( sorry to say but most good ideas are on the scrap heapof business failure)
its great to go into business but just the same as learning to drive
you need a good instructor
a good vehicle
some reasonable to good fuel(ideas)
a good accoutant to make sure your expenses do not get more then your income
and a road to drive on (the path of life)
and the rest is upto you
does do the above and you have a more then 5 in 100 chance ( which is about 5 time less chance of success then if you bet 21 black at the casino) of crashing
welcome to the world of business

 

[TheCamel]

thanks folks

I appreciate the time you've taken to explain it, GR in particular you've given me much more than what was asked for
I do recognise that we should talk to a startup consultant, but I need some more stuff down first

 

[evand]

I think the best thing is to just register a business name ($100 bucks or so from Fair Trading office) and then when you can get consistent customers and start making money. ie: when your business is a business that is making decent profit, then consider forming a company that can own your 'business'.

Too many people put the cart before the horse in starting up a business. Don't commit too much till you know you're backing the right horse.

 

[TheCamel]

so I could do that evand, register a business name, get an ABN for the business, and a business account.

then, in say 6 months when it's making money (not profit, but money) I could form a company, and then sell the business to the company ?

 

[Pushka]

Also, see if the domain name is available that matches your desired trading name. Then everything is branded well - website address and email name.

 

[TheCamel]

the vic consumer affairs site says i must begin trading within 2 months of registering the name..

are they able to find out if I don't ?

 

[Pushka]

the vic consumer affairs site says i must begin trading within 2 months of registering the name..

are they able to find out if I don't ?

Probably not......and it depends what 'trading' means too. You could be open for business but have no customers. Does that mean you have satisfied their definition? I would have thought so.

 

[TheCamel]

but if i register the business name and create an abn, bank accounts, tfn etc, knowing i'm going overseas for 12-18 months, and will definitely not be trading.. that'd be stretching it...

although there is a possibility i might have occasional contract work from my current employer, or a contact through my current employer..

still talking about it a bit with my partner, and will discuss in depth with the inlaws (financial planner fil, and both with banking backgrounds) over christmas...

I definitely appreciate all the feedback

(and anyone who needs small-medium business IT support in the melbourne region, I'm up for it )

 

[grossreal]

hi
trading does not mean making money
to be trading means that the business is operating you can set up the business go away and send flyers back and the business is operating
as for supplying more then is asked thats fine my business is a relationship building business so the more I assist the more I progress never know you may join one of the syndicates even might end up in one of the businesses.
you can set up the company later without any real problems
I don't like that process as the name usually is non distinct so can be used for anything.
so say steel or vault, rainbow,flying fish, jet and fan are all names that can be used for anything for me these names are fine.
oh as for IT do you do web design and a very cheap web site.
don't want anything fancy three pages of text and maybe a couple of photos
we want it as cheap as possible free is a good place to start

 

[Terryw]

so I could do that evand, register a business name, get an ABN for the business, and a business account.

then, in say 6 months when it's making money (not profit, but money) I could form a company, and then sell the business to the company ?

This could be risky. A business name is not a separate legal entity, so your personal assets would be exposed. These days it costs about $440 to form a Pty Ltd company and it is worth it for the limited liability they offer.

 

[depreciator]

Just going back to the business name thing, I reckon the best names are the ones that tell people what you do. The one you mentioned - DirectIT - sort of does that.

I modestly reckon 'Depreciator' was a brilliant name for a business that does Depreciation Schedules.

Scott

 

[Cherry Pro]

I modestly reckon 'Depreciator' was a brilliant name for a business that does Depreciation Schedules.

Scott

I second that !