Definition of Frugal

ABSOLUTELY!!!! I couldn't agree more. :D Why anyone living in a country where there is perfectly clean, free-flowing, drinkable water, would opt for an expensive, highly commercialised substitute (benefitting only the health of the manufacturer's wallet) is totally beyond my comprehension!! :confused:

Some of us buy bottled water in a cafe rather than say a coffee or soft drink and then refill it many times from home. I don't see that as extravagent. 95% plus of the water I drink is from the tap.
 
Just another example of the extreme tightarse-ed-ness (look at that, I just made up a word!) of a number of the members of the forum. Personally, I prefer to focus on how to make thousands rather than worry about the loose change in my pocket.

Mark
 
I love the taste of Brisbane water.... hate the taste of Gold Coast water and buy the Gatorade style strong, tough bottles that we then refill dozens of times with good old tap water.

I don't do this because I am a tight ar$e but because I know how environmentally wasteful it is to make billions of bottles that are used once and then clog our earth.
 
Just another example of the extreme tightarse-ed-ness (look at that, I just made up a word!) of a number of the members of the forum. Personally, I prefer to focus on how to make thousands rather than worry about the loose change in my pocket.

Mark

This argument comes up every few months.

I guess it depends on your income level to a degree.

Generally, (and I've been both higher income and lower income earner) the higher income earners have the more flippant attitude towards spending money. Understandable; everything is easily affordable; why worry?

But, from my experience, many of them have no real nett worth - lots of depreciating "toys" though.

The lower income earner has to adopt Wylie's approach (and my approach is like hers), whereby they (we) try to maximise their lifestyle while minimising expenses.

To me it's just solid financial management - why spend more on liabilities than you need to? I'd rather minimise the total dollars of spending on liabilities (but still buy them), and use the saved funds to buy more income producing assets. That way, my assets can replace the PAYE income sooner, and you can have the doodads as well.

Things like bottled water; I'm with Wylie - we fill up the empty ones with either tap water, or occassionally we buy the bulk 5 gallon number and use it to refill them.

To some, this is being tight.

To me, it's maximising my investment dollars, the water tastes fine anyway and I'm still drinking water, and I'm doing my miniscule bit towards recycling.

I still buy the odd bottle of water if I'm out somewhere and need a drink, but normally I've got a few handy.
 
Just another example of the extreme tightarse-ed-ness (look at that, I just made up a word!) of a number of the members of the forum. Personally, I prefer to focus on how to make thousands rather than worry about the loose change in my pocket.

Mark


Mark

Could you please explain what you mean cause i am confused. You say you don't spend money on many of the items on the list and use milk bottles for water but you think other people are being "tight". Maybe I have misread the tone of your post.

What is tight? What is being environmentally sensitive? What is just buying what you individually need to live the life you want?

I am finding how people look at it exstremely interesting.

For me being tight is when you have the money but you rarely pay your own way (and expect others to!), don't spend things on items you abslutely need (perhaps at risk of your health). Tight is an issue when it impacts on your quality of life and your relationships. Tight is not about failing to live up the expectations of others ideas of normal consuming.
 
LAA and GoAnna,

There's a big difference between not spending money on stuff you don't want and worrying about spending $2 on a bottle of water. I mean, seriously it's $2, who cares. I don't have a mobile phone or car not because I'm a tightarse, but because I don't want either of them.

I wouldn't spend $2 on bottled water either, but just don't get why people are all 'ZOMGZ! You spent $2 dollars on a bottle of water! What a waste of money!' like $2 is a big deal. Catching public transport costs more than that. It's not a big issue. People need to get out of the mindset of holding tightly onto the change in their pocket.

Mark
 
Mark, why not do some type of google search and see how much that empty bottle costs the next generation?

For many of us it has ZIP, ZERO, ZILCH to do with money or being tight.
 
I wasn't being very frugal this morning when I bought two pairs of Reebok Runners dropped down from $185 each to $69.95.

Then there was 20% off socks. - Well who could resist that?

So I said, "Well you might as well throw in that Soccer ball for a mere $14.95.":D

Regards Jo
 
LAA and GoAnna,

There's a big difference between not spending money on stuff you don't want and worrying about spending $2 on a bottle of water. I mean, seriously it's $2, who cares. I don't have a mobile phone or car not because I'm a tightarse, but because I don't want either of them.

I wouldn't spend $2 on bottled water either, but just don't get why people are all 'ZOMGZ! You spent $2 dollars on a bottle of water! What a waste of money!' like $2 is a big deal. Catching public transport costs more than that. It's not a big issue. People need to get out of the mindset of holding tightly onto the change in their pocket.

Mark


It's not the $2 Mark.

It's the cummulative effect of ALL the $2 over a period of time. If you add to this one item every other consumer item you spend money on, over a year it ends up being in the thousands of dollars.

Many people with the same mindset as yours end up at the end of the year with no savings, still in credit card debt etc, and wonder where their money goes, and say they can't save. It's all too common unfortunately.

But of course; they can't see this.

I'm not saying YOU will, as simply by being here you are in the smarter minority of society who is getting off their backsides and trying to do it themselves, so you're on the right track.

Being an investor is the same as being a business owner, and one of the keys to a successful business is cashflow management - minimise expenses, maximise income. So we need to adopt the mindset of a business owner when following the path of property investment - especially if you plan to accumulate and hold a number of properties.

All these "mortgage stress" sales that the D&G'ers love to warn us will occur are a result of bad money management in various forms.

I know this is probably telling you how to suck eggs, and I'm sorry it seems like this, but you did ask.

Another factor I forgot to mention earlier is WHERE you are in your journey of wealth creation.

Often times we get newbies here who are just starting out, and want to know where to start, and in many cases their mindset and financial management practices is where they need to start.

The beginner needs to adopt the mindset that Wylie and I (and others) advocate to get to the starting line sooner, while the more established people can take a breather and spend more freely.

There is nothing more dangerous (to themselves) than the newbie investor with loads of income to use for investing, but bad money management skills and not a lot of knowledge. Their easy access to finances makes them careless. It's often a time-bomb sadly.

Look at the USA over the last 2 years. Many of those foreclosures were on really nice houses - expensive houses.
 
LAA and GoAnna,

There's a big difference between not spending money on stuff you don't want and worrying about spending $2 on a bottle of water. I mean, seriously it's $2, who cares. I don't have a mobile phone or car not because I'm a tightarse, but because I don't want either of them.

I wouldn't spend $2 on bottled water either, but just don't get why people are all 'ZOMGZ! You spent $2 dollars on a bottle of water! What a waste of money!' like $2 is a big deal. Catching public transport costs more than that. It's not a big issue. People need to get out of the mindset of holding tightly onto the change in their pocket.

Mark

So you are saying it's fine to be refilling bottles with tap water if you are doing that for say convencince or environmental reasons but to do it to save $2 is nuts? That its the mindset that money is scarce that you are against not the action itself?

If that is what you mean then I both agree and disagree with you. Living with a poverty mentality when spending even on low costs items is against your mindset is not a great way to live and I would think this could hinder the wealth creation process and make it hard to enjoy the wealth along the way and at the end of the journey.

BUT I would have to agree with LAA that much of the population lives well outside their income and thinks nothing of this small purchase here and this small purchase there and if they are on limited incomes it soon adds up and before you know it their credit card limit is blown. They don't pay $2 on one bottle of water - they spend money on pretty much everything their heart desires. Knowing people who have been or are in this situation let me reassure you it aint pretty and it causes enormous stress.
 
What on earth are you talking about wylie?

Mark

Mark, what part of this are you having the most trouble with. Let me spell it out....

Making that plastic bottle uses a pile of energy, oil etc etc. It gets one use, and it is chucked in the landfill, beside the road or recycled. Even if it makes it to the recycling plant, it still cost waaaaaaay more than I want to waste in both time and money but mostly resources. I have kids who will have kids. I want to leave the earth a little cleaner than you obviously do.
 
It's the cummulative effect of ALL the $2 over a period of time. If you add to this one item every other consumer item you spend money on, over a year it ends up being in the thousands of dollars.

I always refer to this as Velocity. One of my favourite concepts and a very powerful one when combined with compounding and time.
Maybe by changing my bank account structure, I saved myself $4 per month. Some would call me a tightar$e. But that's $4 per month x 12 months per year x X years. Do that with enough "small ticket" items, then get the Velocity effect happening and it really pays off over time.
Same principle applies to deals that make money. Like share trading. Most successful traders don't make big killings. They make small percentages consistently over time. A small percentage gain repeated over and over really adds up over the year.
 
It's not the $2 Mark.

It's the cummulative effect of ALL the $2 over a period of time. If you add to this one item every other consumer item you spend money on, over a year it ends up being in the thousands of dollars.

Many people with the same mindset as yours end up at the end of the year with no savings, still in credit card debt etc, and wonder where their money goes, and say they can't save. It's all too common unfortunately.

But of course; they can't see this.

I'm not saying YOU will, as simply by being here you are in the smarter minority of society who is getting off their backsides and trying to do it themselves, so you're on the right track.

Being an investor is the same as being a business owner, and one of the keys to a successful business is cashflow management - minimise expenses, maximise income. So we need to adopt the mindset of a business owner when following the path of property investment - especially if you plan to accumulate and hold a number of properties.

All these "mortgage stress" sales that the D&G'ers love to warn us will occur are a result of bad money management in various forms.

I know this is probably telling you how to suck eggs, and I'm sorry it seems like this, but you did ask.

No need to apologise friend, everyone is entitled to their opinion. It's all about perspective. I personally don't see the point in worrying about spending a couple dollars on a bottle of water. If you're thirsty and want some water, just buy a bottle, no biggie.

Another factor I forgot to mention earlier is WHERE you are in your journey of wealth creation.

Closer than most. If things keep going the way they are, I'll be done and dusted in a little over two years. Hopefully sooner!

Often times we get newbies here who are just starting out, and want to know where to start, and in many cases their mindset and financial management practices is where they need to start.

The beginner needs to adopt the mindset that Wylie and I (and others) advocate to get to the starting line sooner, while the more established people can take a breather and spend more freely.

There is nothing more dangerous (to themselves) than the newbie investor with loads of income to use for investing, but bad money management skills and not a lot of knowledge. Their easy access to finances makes them careless. It's often a time-bomb sadly.

I understand this perfectly, having been there, done that. But like I said, it's perspective, really. To me, buying small items for a couple of bucks just doesn't register. As I said earlier, I feel it's more important to focus on creating wealth rather than pinching pennies. I know all about spending less than you earn and all that stuff.

With my system, I have a set amount for discretionary spending, which I can use to spend on whatever I want. It's a good mix as it allows me to monitor how I spend, but at the same time I'm not wringing my hands feeling guilty about spending the money on things "I shouldn't be buying". I have the freedom to buy the thngs I want, knowing I have a set amount of money that has to last a set amount of time.

I don't sweat the small stuff.

Mark
 
You've obviously never tasted Brisbane water then. Until we got our water purifier I bought a 12 litre cask of purified water simply because I like to drink water - not chlorine, flouride and a host of other toxic chemicals the govmint thinks I need in my system.:mad:

Come to Adelaide and try our water then :eek:. It is pretty much essential to have a filter taps on your sink. 10L casks of water are very big sellers here. We always notice when we are interstate how much smaller the water section is in the supermarket than in SA
 
I'll quite happily pay $2 for a bottle of water. Reason; I'm thirsty. Benefit; solves that problem nicely. So then, I'm not thirsty and that makes me happy. $2 is a small price to pay.

And besides, it costs less than buying something that'd probably rot my teeth anyway.

Cheers

James.

I agree!
I pay for bottles of water on a regular basis when I'm out and about, it solves the problem as James said and allows me to focus on what's most important. Infact I don't skimp on anything I want.

suprisingly it has not compromised my investment strategy ;)
 
Geoff - I'l get that email to you tomorrow morning.
Thanks Mark.

Though that is off topic, out of the scope of the thread.

I have no problems that people know I'm doing business with Navra.

But the comment could not be understood by anybody else but the two of us. So I'd just suggest that a private communication be responded to in private in the future.

For the sake of the forum. I have an SMSF, with Navra shares amongst others.

Accounting and audit fees are rising steadily. I entered into the SMSF with grand ideas about controlling my own future.

But when accounting and audit fees exceed my annual contributions, it's time to switch out. Especially when the fund has had about ten transactions for the year.

My understanding was that Navra has an option to switch my funds from an SMSF to a managed fund- which is what I'm asking Mark about.

Other share holdings will have to be sold, and the proceeds put into other managed funds.
 
Really? Coming from Melbourne I reckon Brisbane water is great. Melbourne tap water tastes like crap, but I like the tap water up here cause it looks and tastes much cleaner.

Mark

Ugh. Once you get used to drinking pure water you can't go back to tap - it really does taste disgusting and stale. Darwin water is not too bad though.
 
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