IP Loans

Folks

A friend of mine has used LOC from PPOR to fund part of IP purchase -- say, $50k. The rest is on a separate loan secured against IP.

The IP is sold, so the loan against the IP will be paid off, but the LOC loan will not be paid off. Does the interest of the LOC loan to fund IP purchase remain tax deductible?
 
Personally I'd use the proceeds from the sale to pay off the LOC (although I wouldn't pay it off). The LOC gave money for the IP purchase, it should give it back. Fair to say I also know plenty of people who wouldn't do this.

My own logic is that the purpose of the LOC is no longer to fund an investment or anything else that's tax deductible, because that investment has been sold. I don't imagine it would remain tax deductible at this point.
 
Personally I'd use the proceeds from the sale to pay off the LOC (although I wouldn't pay it off). The LOC gave money for the IP purchase, it should give it back. Fair to say I also know plenty of people who wouldn't do this.
I think you would run into problems if you didn't pay off the loan secured against IP when you sell the IP. Banks don't like to switch loans from secured to unsecured.
 
My understanding is that the LOC is secured by the PPOR and the IP has been sold.

I should also clarify, I wouldn't close the LOC, but I would pay it down to $0 owing.
 
Depends. What did he do with the surplus funds if any ?

My friend (could be a she...) would like to take the $50k and pay down the PPOR mortgage. That is, the security that the LOC is drawn against. Probably then use the equity to increase the LOC to use for more investments.
 
I think you would run into problems if you didn't pay off the loan secured against IP when you sell the IP. Banks don't like to switch loans from secured to unsecured.

Indeed, the loan secured against the IP would have to be paid off first. Bank would make sure of that.
 
My own logic is that the purpose of the LOC is no longer to fund an investment or anything else that's tax deductible, because that investment has been sold. I don't imagine it would remain tax deductible at this point.

Rephrase the situation slightly: sell the IP, get enough to pay the IP-secured loan but there is not enough to pay the $50k LOC secured against the PPOR used for IP deposit, renovation and other related expenses. Would the interest on the loan then be deductible against other income?
 
So you basically want to take the tax-paid cash from the sale of the IP to pay down non deductible debt while leaving the LOC fully drawn and supposedly tax deductible for an IP that no longer exists? That sounds pretty far fetched.
 
So you basically want to take the tax-paid cash from the sale of the IP to pay down non deductible debt while leaving the LOC fully drawn and supposedly tax deductible for an IP that no longer exists? That sounds pretty far fetched.

Thanks, I'll let my friend know.
 
TR 2004/4 considers the implications of the Full Federal Court decisions in Federal Commissioner of Taxation v Brown (Browns Case) and Federal Commissioner of Taxation v Jones (Jones Case).

In Browns Case, the taxpayer partners borrowed to acquire a delicatessen. After a number of years of trading, the business was sold at a loss. The proceeds of the disposal were made over to the bank but were insufficient to satisfy the liability fully. There was no entitlement under the relevant loan agreement to repay the loan prior to its term without prior agreement of the bank.

In Jones Case, the taxpayer, together with her husband, borrowed money to fund a trucking and equipment hire business. After her husband's death, Mrs Jones sold the assets of the business. The proceeds (plus other amounts on hand) were insufficient to pay out the loan and she was unable to fully repay the loan.

Brown and Jones Cases accordingly demonstrate that the occasion of interest expenditure can be found in the relevant income earning activities even where those activities are now defunct and all the borrowings (or assets representing those funds) are lost.

Whether or not the occasion of the outgoing of interest is to be found in what was productive of assessable income of an earlier period requires a judgment about the nexus between the outgoing and the income earning activities.

If the taxpayer:

- keeps the loan on foot for reasons unassociated with the former income earning activities;

or

- makes a conscious decision to extend the loan in such a way that there is an ongoing commercial advantage to be derived from the extension which is unrelated to the attempts to earn assessable income in connection with which the debt was originally incurred,the nexus between the outgoings of interest and the relevant income earning activities will be broken.

sounds like that is what your friend will be doing. interest denied. Computer says NO
 
Computer says NO

<cough> :)

Many, many thanks.

So if the funds from sale were insufficient to pay the LOC then the interest MAY be deductible. However if the loan is not repaid only for tax benefit (read: minimisation) then the deduction may be denied.

I'll let my friend know. :)
 
<cough> :)

Many, many thanks.

So if the funds from sale were insufficient to pay the LOC then the interest MAY be deductible. However if the loan is not repaid only for tax benefit (read: minimisation) then the deduction may be denied.

I'll let my friend know. :)

No need to impute a "tax benefit" and Part IVA. It simply isn't deductible in the first place. "Tax benefit" becomes an issue if you have succeeded in a legal technicality against the intended operation of the law.

TR 2000/2 example 4.

Sell down investment but fail to repay loans and keep surplus funds for a private purpose is a deemed recoupment and redraw for private purposes.

This is all about tracing the use of the borrowed funds.

You are confusing the issue of what is used as security ... being the investment itself. It is the loans/debt that matters.
 
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