Is full-time investing realistic?

[LucasK]

I've just started university with an arts degree. Originally I planned to apply for a transfer to law after my first year (this year), but now I'm having second thoughts (law is extremely dull, but I've never really faced up to that fact).

I thought perhaps a commerce/arts degree would be better (much easier to transfer to as well). However, I'm quite confused about where my life is going to go. Someone mentioned I could get into property investment full-time after working a few years.


Do any of you plan to work all your lives, while accumulating property investments? Or work for 5-10 years before quitting work?

And is full-time investing a realistic option, especially in Australia?

 

[Jakk]

Originally posted by LucasK

And is full-time investing a realistic option, especially in Australia?

G'Day LucasK,

Maybe, maybe not, but if someones got to do it, what the heck, it might as well be me.

regards

 

[WillG]

Hi Lukas,

I plan to accumulate IP's so I can choose where and when I want to work. In 10 - 15 years I should have enough passive income to provide a simple way of life ($30k / year) without working at all.

I see investment as a tool to help me 'not have to work' from time to time so I can concentrate on things that are important to me like family, health, playing guitar, woodwork, renovating ...

 

[Aceyducey]

Originally posted by LucasK
However, I'm quite confused about where my life is going to go.

Lucas,

I appreciate where you are and it's great you are on this forum asking questions. I wished I had the forethought and courage to do this when I started uni as it would have saved me ten years of working to meet other peoples' goals.

Your life will go where you choose it to go. if you refuse to set the direction, others will set it for you - but not in the direction you want.

University cannot tell you what you want in YOUR life.
Your peers cannot tell you what you want in YOUR life.
Your family cannot tell you what you want in YOUR life.

They can, however, provide invaluable support in achieving your goals, but YOU must control the goal setting process and YOU must screen your relationships and education to ensure they support YOUR goals.

Forget about which course to do, whether you should become a property investor, or whatever.

FIRST:
1) Read some books on goal setting.

2) Set goals for yourself over both the long term (25+ years), mid-term (next 5 years) and short-term (next week)

3) Choose the degree that will get you to these goals - or if no degree suits, leave uni and go do what will get you there in the timeframe you have set

4) Reread your goals as often as you can - keep them foremost

After you know what you want you can achieve it. Most people don't know what they want, which is why they change course so often and live with regrets.

Originally posted by LucasK
And is full-time investing a realistic option, especially in Australia?

Yes, there are people doing it full time.

There were two on A Current Affair in the last week, there are several on this forum, and there are a number of books out there about and by people who have achieved this.

And these people CHOOSE to work as investors full time, you can always choose to continue to work in your profession - working is more fun if it's a choice not a necessity.

Remember that investing full-time IS a job. You have to keep records, make decisions, attend meetings, learn how to buy and sell, just like many other jobs - it's not an opportunity to lay on the beach and surf all day. Generally wealthy people work at least as hard as poor people - they just work differently (focusing on their goals).


Never stop learing!

Cheers,

Aceyducey

 

[Brenda Irwin]

It is very possible to invest full time.
Hint: Start out with a cheap IP 'house' in a desirable area.
Look for something structurally sound but which is very grubby with looong unkept lawns & overgrown gardens.
Get stuck in to it, mowing & pruning, washing & a little painting.
Is it tenantable yet? Get a good PM to rent it 1yr then sell for big fat profit.
Meanwhile, do it 4-5 times a year to keep you busy.
As the years pass you will tire of the hard work so keep a few dozen IP's for yourself to retire on the rental income.
A cushy law degree would guarantee you could pay someone else to do all the mowing & cleaning till you have enough IP's to retire on.
Half the fun of wages is being able to claim all the IP tax deductions against your income.
Don't miss the fact that quite a number of successful property investors started out working in supermarkets. If law is too had a slog do what you heart tells you & enjoy life.
Cheers Brenda

 

[kierank]

Aceyducey,

What an awesome post with a great message!!!

KieranK

 

[john doe]

Hi Lucas,

I agree with AceyD. It's so easy to go through life trying to meet other people's goals (especially our parents). It's even easy to convince yourself that they are YOUR goals too.
And if you're an intelligent and determined person, you will fulfill those goals even if they aren't REALLY what you want. But you won't feel completely happy and complete until you determined what YOU really want.

The best thing to do is to really think about what you want in life and what makes you feel happy. I recommend reading "Follow your heart" by Andrew Matthews. It's simple to read and helps put you on the track to determining your goals for your life.

John

 

[LucasK]

Thanks for the advice, everyone. Its got me thinking about what my future options are.


My goal is simply to live comfortably. Since investment seems the best option for that, I've always looked into investment as a source of income. When I look at people working from 7-5, then working 4 more hours at home, it kind of makes me wonder what the point of life is.



I understand that investing itself is hard work. However, with investing, every action I do and every hour I spend means more money, whereas with a job, it seems like day after day of menial labour without really achieving much (especially if you get dismissed).

One of my concerns is whether it is realistic to work hard for 5-10 years, then getting into investment as a primary source of income. I've heard some say they could do it, while others say it may not be possible.

For those 5-10 years, it would likely be some job from a commerce Monash degree.

 

[geoffw]

Here's a contrary view.

I'm in a job where I get paid by the hour.

I've been through some absolute s**t periods in this job.

But I love the work I'm doing now. It is really, really rewarding. I know that what I am doing is appreciated, and I know that it is contributing something positive to the world as a whole.

I'd like the freedom not to have to do it 40 hours a week 51 weeks a year. I'd like some of that time with my family.

But I would not ever miss out on what I'm doing now.

I've had lows, and I've had highs.

But the highs far outweigh the lows.

People tell me I'm middle aged now. So I have to plan for that time when I can't get that job satisfaction for a fair pay.

Lucas, my advice would be to look to investing as a long term goal. (how long term depends on a lot of factors- including your own goals).

But in the shorter term, look towards life satisfaction in your chosen profession.

If you look at future earnings- do it only to help you reach your goal more quickly- make sure that you can get satisfaction out of that job while you plan to get out- and also plan for a life after you've been bale to get out of that profession.

If you do become a full time investor- just make sure you will get satisfaction doing that.

But, for me, I'd need about 20 properties before I became full time. Not because I didn't like it- but because, once established, each property takes so little time to take care of.

(I'm not counting renovating properties. That could be full time- but I couldn't see myself doing that full time just yet).

 

[Aceyducey]

Originally posted by LucasK


My goal is simply to live comfortably.

Lucas,

I think you need to dig a bit deeper to define your goals.

You want to live 'comfortably' - what does comfortable mean to you?

Two porshes in the garage & a holiday home on the French Riviera? A large & loving family? Not having to worry about how you'll pay the electricity bill next month?

There are many levels of comfort and generally the less well-off people are when being brought up the lower the bar they set.

Define what you want in terms of net income, lifestyle (travel, adventure sports, a log fire, etc) and personal achievements (learning to scuba/sky dive, supporting 100 kids in a third world country, etc).

Then you will have a clearer insight into your own definition of comfort.

Actually, one of the greatest barriers to success is comfort - people go out into the world, find a niche and either are or convince themselves they are comfortable. Then they stop learning & improving themselves & never challenge their own comfort zone.

Once you have determined what would make you comfortable, why not find something that makes you uncomfortable & go and overcome it - it will give you an enormous buzz & better understanding of your capabilities

One of my concerns is whether it is realistic to work hard for 5-10 years, then getting into investment as a primary source of income. I've heard some say they could do it, while others say it may not be possible.
For those 5-10 years, it would likely be some job from a commerce Monash degree.

It is possible, I have done this. I had a commercial degree from UTS.

Don't worry about what people say - watch what they do - it's a secret all kids learn & forget once they grow up.

The people who don't believe it is possible to achieve will not be able to do it. Belief is very powerful - just look at the history of any great movement & you'll see they were almost all fuelled primarily by belief

Generally I've found that very few people wake up one morning and realise that they've managed to break a barrier that they believed was insurmountable.

Only the people who believe they can overcome the barriers actually do

And guru hat off - sorry I mispelt learning in the last line of my first post in this thread - 'never stop learing' has never really worked for me

Cheers,

Aceyducey

 

[Sunstone]

Aceyducey,

The people who don't believe it is possible to achieve will not be able to do it. Belief is very powerful - just look at the history of any great movement & you'll see they were almost all fuelled primarily by belief

You really have hit the nail on the head!

I have always said this myself. If you think you can you can. If you think you can't you can't.

You create what you can do. Don't accept things are they are............... Always ask HOW we can change it to make it how we want it.

Good to hear others say it at the right time.

Cheers,

Sunstone.

 

[angel_may]

Hi Cookie monster Geoff,

People tell me I'm middle aged now. So I have to plan for that time when I can't get that job satisfaction for a fair pay.

That's impossible, you will be forever young to your fans.
Have always enjoyed reading your posts. Please keep it up.

 

[Les]

G'day all,

I see quite a lot of comments like this:-

What an awesome post with a great message!!!

If you find an awesome post, go to the very last post on the thread. Below it, you'll find a box titled "Rate this thread" - in there, you can give a thread the rating it deserves.

Then (and you'll see quite a few in this forum) you'll see a number of stars to the right of the thread title. Makes it easy to see which threads have impressed others.

When you are simply "surfing", click on threads with 4 or 5 stars, and you'll find "The Best". Of course, until rating becomes natural to many, there are still some "hidden" gems out there.

Regards,

 

[Queen Bee]

Excuse me - but how old is "middle aged".

Myself and my partner have had lots of arguments about this. He reckons I'm middle aged now. I don't think middle aged is until you're about 55.

 

[geoffw]

Originally posted by Queen Bee
Excuse me - but how old is "middle aged".

Myself and my partner have had lots of arguments about this. He reckons I'm middle aged now. I don't think middle aged is until you're about 55.

Middle aged is when you feel it.

I figure I'll be about 75 chronologically before I'm middle aged (at current rates)

 

[XBenX]

From my perspective anything over 30 is middle aged

Just fishing ppl...

 

[brains]

People have no choice about being middle aged but can be young and immature all their lives

Couple of points.

Why does everyone assume (especially Robert Kiyosaki) that all people hate the job they do and want to get out of the rat race to invest? Im with Geoff, i love my work (even tho i hardly do anything these days).

Theres lots of successful people that havent set a goal in their life. That structured approach isnt for everyone. Sometimes i think people can outperform the goals they set, so might find them limiting. And if they continually revise their goals, why set them in the first place.

I think success is all about being a certain person (and mindset), and more importantly the "who wants it baddest" factor.

Being hungriest will get you there wether you invest or do PAYG or whatever.

Now im rambling.....

 

[JoannaK]

Originally posted by brains
Theres lots of successful people that havent set a goal in their life. That structured approach isnt for everyone. Sometimes i think people can outperform the goals they set, so might find them limiting. And if they continually revise their goals, why set them in the first place.

I think success is all about being a certain person (and mindset), and more importantly the "who wants it baddest" factor.

Being hungriest will get you there wether you invest or do PAYG or whatever.

Now im rambling.....

Excellent points Brains.

 

[coolstyle]

Hi Guys,

It is funny how asking such a simple question can bring such class and 'poetry' from people such as Aceyducey.

I will not try to replicate .. simply give some insight to me...

I'm about to leave work (which I don't enjoy) ... I don't enjoy it because of the subject matter. this point is plain and simple. I'm about to head to the workshop of a performance car business of which I'm the business development mgr (if you will) ... and this I love ... property is an avenue for me to invest cash from activites in cars and earnings from work ... (and i've not purchased my 1st yet)

If I was 5 years younger again - I would still study Commerce, but I would not go into the corporate world. I would save a lot of cash as best I can, and learn a lot more about ways of making money.. I woul get involved in more entreprenuerial projects while at uni, etc .. trying to make money the easy way as I go ..
don't underestimate the value of uni --> it can a free environment to think, meet likeminded people, and learn about what you don't want out of life. On the other hand it can drag you rcurrent thinking down into the low risk corporate approach.

The greatest risk is for you to ignore your current feeling of not wanting to work 12 hr days in a job you don't enjoy from 23 - 65 ... make your own way and you will not risk a thing.

I found study (while young) was great as it kept the judgemental types (family, peers, my own concience) off my back to allow myself time to workout the right directions to travel. ..

The most important point I would make is, DO WHAT YOU LOVE DOING. It is as simple as that. If you love property above any other job - then go for it without thinking twice. But you may find that you cannot invest in many projects without solid cash and solid income streams from other than property.

If you don't know what you like doing ... then goto uni and try everything ... it would be a mistake to start working in a 'dead-end' job while not knowing what you want to do ... get to uni and try everything ... and i don't mean classes .. meet people and experience as much as possible until you find your passion.

Look at the big picture, make those goals, then trace back and it will simple be a scientific equation to success ...if you stick to it you will feel ritch from day 1.

Cheers,
Coolstyle
(a bit wishy washy but I'm all to keen to leave job no. 1!)

 

[Aceyducey]

Originally posted by Queen Bee
Excuse me - but how old is "middle aged".

Myself and my partner have had lots of arguments about this. He reckons I'm middle aged now. I don't think middle aged is until you're about 55.

I've been middleaged for several years now, will go back to my twenties next year I think.

I accept that we have to celebrate birthdays, but why celebrate them in order - get the bad years over early & then live the good ones

Cheers,

Aceyducey