is religious debate banned here?

J

johnduncan2

I noticed that topcroppers thread was deleted because it constituted religious debate, wtf? :confused:
There were some excellent points made and i was hoping to send a link to a friend about it. It's disappointing that religion cannot be discussed here.
I guess this thread should also be deleted as it also falls into this category

http://www.somersoft.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38099

Seems like this is Sim's forum and has nothing to do with Ian & Jan Somers. I'm sure they would be upset if they knew how much debate was being stifled.
 
johnduncan2 said:
Seems like this is Sim's forum and has nothing to do with Ian & Jan Somers. I'm sure they would be upset if they knew how much debate was being stifled.
Click to expand...

Sim is merely policing/moderating (same as other moderators) the forum conditions/guidelines as set by Ian & Jan Somers.
 
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Hiya JD2

Suppose there wont be many religion forums that have property sections............though the Catholic Church is supposed to be the worlds largest land owner.

Everything has a place

ta
rolf
 
There are some topics which we (the moderation team, which includes Ian Somers) have deemed to be inappropriate, or simply too dangerous (mostly for legal reasons).

We also take a strong stance against hateful posts, whether that be racist views, personal attacks, or anything else along those lines.

Religion is one topic which is very emotive and often causes conflict amongst members. The thread you are referring to had some very hateful comments in it and it was deemed inappropriate, which is why it was removed.

So far the other thread you linked to has been pretty well behaved - hence it has been allowed to stay, but will be closed if it gets out of hand.

This is a discussion forum about property and real estate investing. If you want to talk about politics, religion, or even football - there are plenty of other forums out there designed specifically for the discussion of these topics. That's not to say you can't talk about them here - but they will be treated harshly (ie closed or removed) if they break any of our other rules ... just like any other thread would.

FYI - Ian does contribute regularly to moderator discussion, and Rixter is quite right - it is my role to police the rules that Jan and Ian set.

At the end of the day, someone must make the decisions and take the action - and that is my role as administrator, that is what I have committed to do on behalf of Jan and Ian. That can make me unpopular with some people who have been deemed to have broken the rules - and I regret that, but the rules are there because we feel they are necessary and it would be rather pointless having them if they weren't enforced.

The moderation team discuss posts regularly and opinions are sought. No action is taken that can't be reversed if necessary - sometimes a particularly troublesome thread might be removed or closed while the moderators discuss whether it can be salvaged or what other action might be taken, and if it is deemed that it should be put back into circulation, then it can be done very easily.

Quite often there will be quite a bit of discussion about "reported posts" - any post that is reported gets a new thread created in a special forum for the moderators and we discuss it there and decide on the action, or if we've already taken action, we will generally make a note of it there so that the other moderators know what is happening.

I do not act in isolation - I am accountable to the moderation team and especially to Jan and Ian.
 
johnduncan2 said:
Why have moderators if Sim is going to act like a one man band?
Click to expand...

The moderators do remove threads and take other action as necessary.

Amongst other things, the moderators are there to read the threads I can't (between all of us we have pretty good coverage ... even though I think we managed to cure geoffw of his addiction to reading every thread :D ) ... and to keep and eye on threads that might need moving and such ... and to generally help advise on forum matters (as per my previous post).
 
hi all
just a bit of info
it could get deleted so read it fast.
uniting church thou a very big land owner is also a very big funder.
now for me this is a real problem if that funding is into say a pub or bar or worse.
as I can't really see the point in saying these are evil things on a saturday and sunday and by the way we are the funder of the place also.
it is very interesting what the major churchs and church groups do fund.
and if it came out I think alot of people may well keep that $5.00 in there pocket instead of the plate.
church and religious group are not a church they are a industry and no debate on them for me should be barred unless as it is mentioned it breaks the broad rules.
oh and for me thou I don't like alot of the moderators rules they are the rules and if you don't like them the mouse is only one click away.
you can't like everything in this world so get over it
 
Interesting post gross, but hardly surprising. The Roman Catholic Church is the most corrupt organisation in history. They make organised crime gangs and drug lords look like Snow White.

Mark
 
The fact that any religious debate teeters on the brink of "deleted" is proof positive of why all the religious debate on this site should be banned.

If every time a religious discussion turns into a hate session, it directly contradicts what being religious should be about - living a better life, tolerance, empathy, sympathy etc.

But it deteriorates into a "my god is better than your god" slinging match, and worse - we will kill you because our god is better than yours. Give me a break.

This constant hypocracy that surrounds all religions is why I am not religious, and never will be.
 
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Sim said:
...Religion is one topic which is very emotive and often causes conflict amongst members. The thread you are referring to had some very hateful comments in it and it was deemed inappropriate, which is why it was removed.

This is a discussion forum about property and real estate investing. If you want to talk about politics, religion, or even football - there are plenty of other forums out there designed specifically for the discussion of these topics. That's not to say you can't talk about them here - but they will be treated harshly (ie closed or removed) if they break any of our other rules ... just like any other thread would.
Click to expand...

I didn't see any 'hateful comments'; I saw differences of opinion. While I agree there must be some guidelines and boundaries, it does seem that anything that could *slightly* offend someone else is cause for deletion. I made two or three posts in that thread and the fact it was deleted proves the point I was trying to make, that is religion ( and especially Islam ) often hides behind the veil of racism (and violence ) to stop any critique of their behaviour. I'm not talking about beliefs here, but 'behaviour'.

Sure this is a property investment forum, and I enjoy being a member here, but if there is an 'Off Topic' area, there is going to be discussion other than property investing, and religion is, well, off topic. I have seen the slow decline of freedom of speech / debate in this country and I don't believe it is in the interests of Australian society to go down this track.

Phil
 
Sim said:
The moderators do remove threads and take other action as necessary.

Amongst other things, the moderators are there to read the threads I can't (between all of us we have pretty good coverage ... even though I think we managed to cure geoffw of his addiction to reading every thread :D ) ... and to keep and eye on threads that might need moving and such ... and to generally help advise on forum matters (as per my previous post).
Click to expand...

Thanks Sim. FWIW I can't imagine how much time you guys must spend keeping an eye on all the threads, I look at Somersoft several times a day and there are a lot of threads and a lots of words to read, so from me a BIG thankyou for keeping an eye on things thus allowing us to keep enjoying this forum.
 
While the Mods are on the job moderating any "Hate' posts they could look into the bile that spewes out every time anyone posts on the "rich' people of Mosman and Vaucluse- how they deserve to take a hit etc--glad they are all suffering sounds like hate there--Evidenced in the recent thread - re prices in Mosman-
 
In reply:

SIM IS OVERLORD? Everything Sim said is true. And by the way he does a great job. Just because you dont see Peter 14.7 deleted this does not mean i didnot find it, report it, discuss it and checked it. Mods are picked here because of impartiality and experience in property, not IT. Sim is hybrid with both. And you would guess form me, spelling dont matter.

WHY DONT WE GET EVERYTHING? Mods do it for no pay. Jan and Ian provide the forum for no charge. And they do not ask for anything in return, not even advertising for a simple book. Mods have jobs and businesses to run. We cannot reveiw everypost. See anything bad, report it.

RELIGION?
If anyone wanted evidence as to why Religion is forbidden only needs to read the above.

I hope this helps. Have a go at me but dont attack Sim. Without him we would have a crashed forum in about 3 days. He is not overlord, he is an Angel.

Peter 14,7
 
MIZBUF said:
While the Mods are on the job moderating any "Hate' posts they could look into the bile that spewes out every time anyone posts on the "rich' people of Mosman and Vaucluse- how they deserve to take a hit etc--glad they are all suffering sounds like hate there
Click to expand...

If there are posts you have concerns about - please use the "report this post" feature to let us know - makes it much easier for us to track issues and discuss them -
report.gif
 
I, like most, love a good chinwag about religion, but at the end of the day:

a) it's pointless (much smarter people than us have been debating it for years and haven't gotten anywhere)
b) there are plenty of other places available on the net to discuss it
c) most of the discussion has got nothing to do with property investing

Have to say the 'property' + 'religion' stuff is interesting, like what GR posted about the Uniting church.
 
DavidMc said:
I, like most, love a good chinwag about religion, but at the end of the day:

a) it's pointless (much smarter people than us have been debating it for years and haven't gotten anywhere)
b) there are plenty of other places available on the net to discuss it
c) most of the discussion has got nothing to do with property investing

Have to say the 'property' + 'religion' stuff is interesting, like what GR posted about the Uniting church.
Click to expand...

Good point but perhaps we want to discuss stuff like this with people we know instead of bible belt Americans who cannot cope with logic.

I don't think it is the topic itself that needs moderating - rather some of us who don't know where the line is between intelligent discussion and playground slanging matches. No doubt I am as guilty as anyone though I am usually mindful of people's feelings.
 
I thought someone must have stepped over the line.

I have to say I LOVE a good religious debate.

But what Simon says is true. We all should be mindful of other epople's feelings and beliefs and if anyone can't behave and post responsibly, then they should go elsewhere.

I can't see the problem though in some harmless chit chat about it, as long as noone is offensive.:)

Most of us haven't the time to look for religious forums if there even is one and because of the affiliation we have built between members, it is interesting to know member's opinions, beliefs etc. Going elsewhere to discuss this with complete strangers would not interest me.

I do however, "get" that this is a property forum but it doesn't stop us posting jokes, talking about our children etc.

Regards JO
 
I spent 30+ years as a card carrying Christian and the last 8 or so years as an atheist. I'm much happier and at ease intellectually being an atheist, I think I had too much cognative disonance in my Christian phase, LOL.

I'm a Dawkins convert, well at least that he placed one of the big seeds of doubt in my mind. That lead to me doing an internet search on 'dawkins' which turned up pages of religious debate. That found me agreeing with the atheist position more than my own.... oops. :)

So I guess I'm proof that just sometimes debate can change peoples mind :)
 

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