Options?

Howdy all,


A couple of questions.
If I wanted to offer an option on land, that would expire in three years. How do I calculate the option price?

What is the best way to calculate market value of property in three years time?

Cheers.
 
Hiya

Lots more info required. where and what type of property is it. I guess you could start at using a 5% growth. Are you trying to sell an option on property you own or are you trying to pay an option to buy a property?

pompey bentos said:
Howdy all,


A couple of questions.
If I wanted to offer an option on land, that would expire in three years. How do I calculate the option price?

What is the best way to calculate market value of property in three years time?

Cheers.
 
Owen,

You really can't calculate the option price based on the predicted property value in three years, only on it's current value.

There are no archaic formulas for options prices on property that I am aware of - so whatever you & the other party agree is fair is fair.

Alternatively call a broker & ask them to convert the formulas used for share options to your purpose.

BTW - no-one knows what the market value of ANY asset will be in three years time. That's why there is risk attached to investments. There are many ways to predict value - mostly based on the past, which has proven time & again to be a rough, but ready guide provided there are no major market shifts.

Try taking the average CG for the property in the area for the last 20 years (over several cycles) and applying it over the next few years. Then take into account a fudge factor for additional infrastructure & services in the area that may increase it's development value.

Cheers,

Aceyducey
 
I am looking at land at Nairne in the adelaide hills. It is outside Mt Barker which was one of the fastest growing towns in oz last year.

Most of the area is farm land with titles of 2 hectres or more, which seldomly come on the market. I am considering approaching owners in the area with option offers.

Most of the produce is beef, for reasons I do not know, the farmers are struggling to keep afloat.

Current market price for 2 hectres with no dwelling is around 200 000.

andymack said:
Hiya

Lots more info required. where and what type of property is it. I guess you could start at using a 5% growth. Are you trying to sell an option on property you own or are you trying to pay an option to buy a property?
 
Ok, for whats it worth, here's my approach.
I'll not use option formulaes because i want to keep it simple and i'll presume a low volatility.

Presume that the current markt value is 200k, and that it has already seen a lot of growth, so I'll assume a 5% growth over the next few years. I'm going to buy an option with a strike price at the current market price, with a 3 yr expiry. I'll also assume the earning capacity of the property is equivilant to the cost of money, thus balancing each other out. (i know this is rarely the case)

200k projected 3yrs at 5% growth in simple terms is 231k.
Therefore as a seller of the option I'd want at least 31k for such an option (this should be discounted just as bonds are - but we'll keep it simple atm). However if I thought ther's a possibility that we could experience twice that growth then I'd want more than 31k (this is where volatility figures into it), i may want 41k.

Now If you wanted to increase your leverage, then you'd want to buy an option at say 230k and pay 10k premium. It is ofcourse much more risk.

Now if the cost of money is significantly more than the earning capacity , which on cattle land i would presume to be the case, you would have to discount the premium accordingly



pompey bentos said:
I am looking at land at Nairne in the adelaide hills. It is outside Mt Barker which was one of the fastest growing towns in oz last year.

Most of the area is farm land with titles of 2 hectres or more, which seldomly come on the market. I am considering approaching owners in the area with option offers.

Most of the produce is beef, for reasons I do not know, the farmers are struggling to keep afloat.

Current market price for 2 hectres with no dwelling is around 200 000.
 
Put and Call Options

I have heard so much about P & C Options lately...are they actually legal as they avoid Stamp Duty and has anyone palced one?
 
Nickof

They certainly are legal. Just ask a good solicitor.

However there are not too many situations where they are feasible. In the case blocks of land or units in a development, the developer may be restricted by their 1st mortgage lender.

And in the case of dealing with the general public, most sellers (or their agent) don't know the first thing about it, and their basic conveyancing solicitor will probably tell them that it is not as secure as a standard contract.

We have used them before in purchasing blocks of land in a subdivision, and found them to be extremely flexible in assigning the option to a different entity in the settlement period when circumstances changed. Costs were also significantly reduced when selling.

I would recommend a really good lawyer on your side though to make the Option contract tight. Cannot stress this point enough!

Regards

Brendon
----------------------------------
Acute Mortgage Reductions
www.acutemr.com.au
[email protected]
 
Would a forum member be so good as to explain how developers use put and call options (with an example)?

I am currently writing put options in relation to shares (receiving premium income) and have an understanding of how both sides of put and call contracts work in relation to shares.

Cheers Ajax
 
Ajax,

I've sold a few OTP units using a Put and Call Option (and buying would be the same process), here's what happens:

A price is agreed upon and the P & C is drawn up by the vendor's solicitor and the Contract for Sale that is to be executed on a later date is attached to the P & C. The P & C is signed by all concerned, but the contract is NOT signed. The P & C will have a predetermined excercising date and a predetermined excercising price. The P & C will also have a option fee written into it which is payable on the signing of the P & C. This amount later becomes the deposit when the Contract is exchanged. Once all parties have signed, the P & C is exchanged in the same manner that a normal Contract is exchanged.

Note that the P & C does say that the purchaser is obligated to complete the Contract through to settlement, and that any rescission will result in legal action as per a normal contract.

When settlement is due, notice is sent to the purchaser that he is required to excersise his Put option within 7 days. Within that time the purchaser is required to sign the Contract that was previously attached to the P & C. The vendor is also required to sign his counterpart Contract that was attached to the P & C. This is then exchanged like a normal Contract. Once that is done you have an exchanged Contract with settlement due to occur on whatever date was written into the Contract that was attached to the P & C at the time of signing it.

If the purchaser does not excersise his Put (which is what happened to us in one situation), the vendor has the right to excersise his Call option. This basically forces the purchaser and gives the purchaser a further 7 days to sign his contract and exchange it. It basically gives the purchaser notice that if he doesn't sign he will be pursued. If he doesn't, then he's subject to the normal penalties that one would be subject to should they decide not to settle on an exchange contract.

I don't know what happens if the vendor decides not to excersise his Call...maybe someone else can clarify that.

We've done a couple of these, and most went well with the purchaser onselling prior to his completion date, and everyone was happy. In one of our situations we had to excersise our Call, and the purchaser refused to settle still, so we had to resell the property and recover the difference in price plus penalties plus plus plus....

P & C's are used by purchasers who want to onsell their purchases for higher than what the purchaser has paid for it and avoid stamp duty, but the advise from my solicitor at the time was that the stamp duty loophole was closed and the purchaser who onsold would still be liable for stamp duty anyway.

A P & C is an enforceable contract, hence our ability to recover costs etc, however, I found it to be a ridiculous system with way too much paperwork and too many parties involved if the purchaser has been successful in onselling, and pointless given that any stamp duty avoidance loophole had been closed.

It's also risky if you're planning to onsell, as you will be required to complete the contract whether you've onsold or not, so you'll have to have yourself organised for that event should it occur.

I think that's the system that our solicitor worked by, but if anyone else could clarify that would be great.
 
Hi Joanna

Well explained! I assume when you refer to the stamp duty loophole being closed, that you are referring to NSW? As far as I know here in QLD the purchaser of the option only pays stamp duty on the option fee(Need a solicitor's opinion here for other states)

One other benefit of a P&C option is that if a purchaser does not have the correct structure set up yet, they can use a P&C with the view to later assigning the option to a company/trust(please consult a professional). Or in the case of debt/equity partnerships, a structure that includes the partner.(Not advice, just passing...w..er..thoughts, need an accountant's opinion here)

Thanks again for the clear description.

Brendon
----------------------------------------------
Acute Mortgage Reductions
www.acutemr.com.au
[email protected]
 
Hi Brendon,

yes, I was indeed referring to NSW.

Your point about a P & C being used if the purchaser hasn't got the correct structure set up is a valid one, and one I hadn't thought of...but isn't it just as easy as signing a contract as Purchaser and/or nominee?

Just a thought....
 
HI Joanna

Must be different in NSW again, as far as I know that attracts double stamp duty in QLD. Not 100% sure about that though.

I see your point about making things easier for yourself, as never has it been a smooth uncomplicated process when using P&C's. The extra paperwork and legal fees add to the hassle too.

Brendon
-----------------------------
Acute Mortgage Reductions
www.acutemr.com.au
[email protected]
 
Another point to consider is that you may place the Option in a Pty Ltd structure and then decide to sell the shares in the Pty Ltd rather than the property itself.

As long as the Pty Ltd Company is not considered Land Rich then there will be no Stamp Duty payable as SD is not payable on share transfers.
 
Any opinions on what happens if the vendor has a change of heart and refuses to then sign the contrcat and sell the property? Do you then just sue the vendor?

BUNDY
 
Yes according to my solicitor adding a and/ or nominee clause does attract a double stamp duty in QLD.

Darryl
 
First post y'all so put the guns away if I get something wrong please !

Joanna - from my reading you get both a P&C, & pursue the buyer if they choose not to buy. This confuses me as in Shares/Index options the use of an option (other than for hedging) is normally to exploit a 'potential' opportunity i.e. a Call is a right to buy X # of shares at $.$$ on or before a future date. A Call is NOT an obligation to buy so if the share price drops, you just do the dough on the option i.e. maximum risk is what you paid for the option.
In your example it looked like there was both a right AND an obligation to buy at the pre-determined price by a future date.
I would've thought you'd use an option to give you the right to buy at a pre-determined price by a future date, so if the property appreciates you can buy & make some money, if it devalues, you lose what you paid for the option but aren't obligated to buy the property.
Maybe this is my 'pre-conditioning' & I just haven't worked it through yet, but I can't see the advantage of an option other than a possilbe avoidance of stamp duty.
Does it make sense why I'm confused ? :confused:

Look forward to clarifications & yay I've got my name on the board (hope I've been polite enough & haven't made any sweeping assumptions, I've seen what happes to us newbies who do that !) :D

Cheers
Mark
 
Hi Mark and welcome to the forum!

To my knowledge P & C's used in property transactions did originate from the Shares P & C.

What I have explained above is the use of a P & C Option when we sold some units off the plan..

It was the right AND obligation to buy, ie...i was able to force the purchaser to settle his contracts.

Please note that it is very possible that i mixed up my puts with my calls!

The reason the purchaser wished to buy using P & C's was because he wanted to onsell prior to completion of the building with the hope of avoiding stamp duties.

There is another Option, which I simply refer to as a Deed of Option, which gives you the right, but NOT the obligation to buy at a predetermined price before a predetermined date and you lose nothing but your option fee should you give up your right to buy.

Like I said in a previous post, I thought the whole process was stupid, and pointless, and expensive, and I'll never do it that way again.

Hope I've clarified a little for you.
 
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