Target 2020! My retirement goal - some advice please?

A good article on retiring at age 40. Is seven years too short and ambitious a time frame to be making three mil?

http://au.pfinance.yahoo.com/money-...ement/article/-/13718769/how-to-retire-by-40/

Interesting. One of the things a lot of these articles raise is the 'safe withdrawal rate', in this case identified as 3%.

This seems very low to me. I have generally used 5%, simply because that is the target yield of my investment portfolio.

Presumably the authors of such articles assume that assets will be sold and the money invested into 'safe' places, like term deposits or bonds. I disagree with this. To me it seems much smarter to keep your money in the property/shares/businesses that you used to grow your wealth in the first place, for several reasons:
1) You have a much better understanding of the assets you used to grow your wealth in the first place
2) Reduce or remove CGT
3) If your investments continue to generate 5% yield (for example), the why not simply use that as your income (ie LOR) and allow the underlying portfolio to continue growing.

Point (3) implies more risk, but I don't think this is the case. In the early years of retirement or living off your assets you will be more susceptible to market downturns, but as time goes by you become more and more insulated due to your asset base (and income) growing more quickly than inflation. If after 10 years your portfolio takes a 25% hit due to a major economic shock, I'd argue that you're probably still better off than if you'd dumped the assets and gone to cash. You're also much better placed to ride the recovery when it eventuates.

My personal strategy also includes not spending ALL the available cash every year, but gradually building a contingency (perhaps 10% of the yield each year) to allow you to smooth your income, or have the occasional OS holiday or new car. If you get too much cash accumulating you can always buy some more assets (which further increases your income).

What do other people think of this? Have I missed anything obvious? Are there risks that I haven't considered here?
 
Ditto....I can foresee the moaning around 2016 when the market tanks in some markets.......it always happens.

The ideal LVR is around 40-50%.....:)

do explain further, which markets do you see will tank in 2016,

isnt Syd at the bottom about 1 year ago, and now its the start or middle of the growht/boom phase,
brisbane similar
melborune at the bottom
WA- at the top possible (not sure as I dont do the WA market)

if the above were correct, then the tank/plateau should be 2016 at the very earliest to 2018
 
Interesting. One of the things a lot of these articles raise is the 'safe withdrawal rate', in this case identified as 3%.

This seems very low to me. I have generally used 5%, simply because that is the target yield of my investment portfolio.


3) If your investments continue to generate 5% yield (for example), the why not simply use that as your income (ie LOR) and allow the underlying portfolio to continue growing.


My personal strategy also includes not spending ALL the available cash every year, but gradually building a contingency (perhaps 10% of the yield each year) to allow you to smooth your income, or have the occasional OS holiday or new car. If you get too much cash accumulating you can always buy some more assets (which further increases your income).

What do other people think of this? Have I missed anything obvious? Are there risks that I haven't considered here?

Hiya Mr V8

This schedule may help you in seeing whether your money will outlast you:D

http://www.mutualofomaha.com/tools/.../im-retired-how-long-will-my-savings-last.php


I agree with you...recently i have come to a realisation that people plan to invest TO retirement when they should plan to invest THROUGH retirement:p
 
I believe interest rate cycles also have a bearing...I am of the opinion that IR rates will start rising mid to late next year. It then needs another 6-12 months to peak which takes to mid to late 2015. The another couple of months for the higher interest rates to bite so mid to late 2016...is where I see the market peaking. Obviously each state will differing circumstances.

Agree about Sydney on the upwards cycle....it started this year so 3 years is a reasonable if it goes that far. The way prices are pushing up (rapidly) who know how long it would run. Sydney is also the market that feels the IR increases the most as it is the most expensive. WA is slightly ahread of Sydney...but is still have very affordable areas 25-40 klms away.

Brisbane is not moving yet..agree with Melbourne is at the bottom. So these two could go past 2016..if prices don't explode and due to affordability.

do explain further, which markets do you see will tank in 2016,

isnt Syd at the bottom about 1 year ago, and now its the start or middle of the growht/boom phase,
brisbane similar
melborune at the bottom
WA- at the top possible (not sure as I dont do the WA market)

if the above were correct, then the tank/plateau should be 2016 at the very earliest to 2018
 
I believe interest rate cycles also have a bearing...I am of the opinion that IR rates will start rising mid to late next year. It then needs another 6-12 months to peak which takes to mid to late 2015. The another couple of months for the higher interest rates to bite so mid to late 2016...is where I see the market peaking. Obviously each state will differing circumstances.

So there may be room to grow in Sydney - given prices have risen, MsAli and I will be ready for an IP each by the end of the year - still deciding whether Sydney is worthwhile or we may benefit more buying else where. Decisions, Decisions!!
 
So there may be room to grow in Sydney - given prices have risen, MsAli and I will be ready for an IP each by the end of the year - still deciding whether Sydney is worthwhile or we may benefit more buying else where. Decisions, Decisions!!

Holding costs will be huge factor, if prices continue to rise sharply and IR will eventually start to rise.

Fortunately there are always other markets to play in, we know Brisbane is starting to tighten and Melb inner city has moved, they are both a little way behind, just watch the markets closely and be prepared to pull the trigger when the timing is right.
:)
 
Hi i2009

I don't think it is intended to be negative, but investors who have been through a couple of cycles will know how it works and how you always need to cover your a...e

LVR is very important, markets run in cycles and they do crash, properties go backwards or stay flat for 7 years plus we have seen this happen in Australia, Perth, QLD, Syd. Could you imagine what would happen to your portfolio during this period if you were 80% LVR and you were relying on equity to pay back debt:eek:

MTR

+1000

great post MTR

its called risk management, nothing wrong with that.

The trap a lot of investors get into (property/developers/share market traders) is falling in love with spreadsheets and assumed rates of return.

When you assume a rate of return being highly leveraged is always the best strategy. You just keep making more and more money when you plug more debt into your spreadsheet.

The realities can and will be very different.

My goal would be to do as follows:

1) eliminate PPOR debt
2) Establish strong positive cashflow from IPs
3) reduce Investment debt using positive cashflow from above
4) eliminate investment debt altogether (may require the sale of the odd IP)
5) Retire

I don't feel that I would be truly free to retire until all of my debt was repaid.
 
+1000

great post MTR

its called risk management, nothing wrong with that.

The trap a lot of investors get into (property/developers/share market traders) is falling in love with spreadsheets and assumed rates of return.

When you assume a rate of return being highly leveraged is always the best strategy. You just keep making more and more money when you plug more debt into your spreadsheet.

The realities can and will be very different.

My goal would be to do as follows:

1) eliminate PPOR debt
2) Establish strong positive cashflow from IPs
3) reduce Investment debt using positive cashflow from above
4) eliminate investment debt altogether (may require the sale of the odd IP)
5) Retire

I don't feel that I would be truly free to retire until all of my debt was repaid.

I like your goals:)
I would like to add, purchase properties on development sites, this will speed the process. In my situation I buy 3/4 unit site, sell 2/3, own one outright, do two per year and it wont take long.... good bye day job:p

There are so many investors on SS doing some amazing stuff, check out posts by
Westminster, Sanj, Oc1.
 
That article is a bit silly.

Someone ambitious enough to want to retire at 40 and capable enough to pull it off is hardly going to be satisfied with a 3-5% overall yearly return on their portfolio
 
Of course.....the action has been predominately in the West and Northwest.

The Northern Beaches and the South are not as strong.

Sydney is not one market...once the West and NW peter out...other areas of Sydney will keep going.

The flow onto the Central Coast, Wollongong, and Newcastle are starting to move also.


So there may be room to grow in Sydney - given prices have risen, MsAli and I will be ready for an IP each by the end of the year - still deciding whether Sydney is worthwhile or we may benefit more buying else where. Decisions, Decisions!!
 
That article was fantastic! Very similar to the approach i am taking, or trying to take.

My version of Retirement is to do what I want, and if I hit 2020 that would mean a job I like around 41 years old.

Really like the thinking on the numbers and that was something I have done with the finance team I am working with.
 
Thanks again to China for that article. I just re-read it. Really good content.

I thought I would give a bit of an update on my Target 2020 plan.

Over the past few months I was mulling over a NSW based investment, then back to Vic, then not sure. Buying interstate was going to be difficult, and at the risk of raising the ire of some on the forum, I didn't see the value in employing a buyers advocate to help. Based on my negotiation and research skills, it would have been basically an inspection only service.

Separate to this I was growing weary of the daily commute. For the last 13 years I had been driving an hour plus each way, each day, between the city and the suburbs. With 2020 some time off, it wasn't going to get any easier! Especially with the population growth!

So we had a look at housing options closer to Melbourne, and after some thorough research settled on Newport, Spotswood, Yarraville and Williamstown as the target area. Around 10km from the city, this area would reduce my commute down from 1 hr 15 each way average down to worse case 25 to 30 minutes. Very compelling, saving up to 7 working weeks each year, currently spent in the car! Oh, and we could afford it! (Fairly important!).

Inner Melbourne is tough to buy property! I'd never tried at auctions before, had a couple of hard luck stories, was very close in one post auction negotiation, but no cigar. So we've made a decision which I believe should help us ensure Target 2020 is delivered.

We've now rented out the PPOR in Berwick, and signed a two year lease in Newport. Financially, I believe this is awesome. Rent in from Berwick is 450 a week, rent out 460 per week in Newport. Very small sacrifices to deliver a closer commute and more importantly a financial boost thanks to the good people at the ATO.

With this freeing me up, I've bought two properties in Williamstown, my first ever Unit purchases. Bought for 365k and 420k respectively, both were in good locations, renovated, 2 bed 1 bath 1 car properties in boutique style buildings. I wanted to buy in a preferred area for insurance, liked the investment opportunity and was able to secure some quality stock.

So we've hit double digits in properties. And are working to plan. Yippee!

LVR has taken a hit due to my no money down strategy, but I've promised our finance team I would not buy now until at least two years when I will look to buy a new PPOR in the new area of choice. Current LVR is 87%, portfolio size is $3.5 Mill+.

Fingers crossed for a quiet couple of years and some big savings! :eek:

Now to shares to keep me busy (and help with a bit of diversification!).
 
Great article and well done on your achievements thus far. 2 questions:

- With your LOC did you secure this against 1 property or multiple properties so that you could leverage more from this loan for your next purchase?
- Are all your purchases in your individual names or have you purchased via a Trust structure with your last couple of purchases?

Cheers
 
Hi there,

LOC is secured against multiple properties, draw down and added to LOC as possible only for investment costs.

The last property, #11, was a SMSF purchase. I had some cash there and decided to use it to invest in property, on top of shares.

All others bought as Tennants in Common, 99/1 with wife who doesn't work currently. Allows tax dedication and on death ownership to her. Looked into trusts, just hadn't fully bought into that yet.

Might do for the next ones as they will be adding up land tax wise if I brick to Vic!
 
Hi there,

LOC is secured against multiple properties, draw down and added to LOC as possible only for investment costs.

The last property, #11, was a SMSF purchase. I had some cash there and decided to use it to invest in property, on top of shares.

All others bought as Tennants in Common, 99/1 with wife who doesn't work currently. Allows tax dedication and on death ownership to her. Looked into trusts, just hadn't fully bought into that yet.

Might do for the next ones as they will be adding up land tax wise if I brick to Vic!

dreadful structure. Very asset protection unfriendly.
 
That article is a bit silly.

Someone ambitious enough to want to retire at 40 and capable enough to pull it off is hardly going to be satisfied with a 3-5% overall yearly return on their portfolio

Yearly Return or Withdrawal Rate?
 
Back
Top