I came across SS when I was googling a subject in the area of my first IP purchase. Immediately I became intrigued at the wealth of information this community shares and immediately became a participating member. Post joining, I have seen the forums mention in one of the major property investment magazines (lately Jake Milne contributes on the subject of BAs). Instantly that gives the the feeling these forums are very popular amongst the Australian property investment community. It worries me then when I'm talking about SS to my mortgage broker, CBA personal lender, and financial adviser, and they've never heard of SS. Should I be worried?! I mean, in my opinion, and I see this as the number one source of information to Australian property investors, and if you're dead set serious about building property wealth then you would have at least heard about SS (at least via a google search)!
Should I have faith in my local investment network?
- Thread starter jaspn
- Start date
A lot of these people are not property investors and know b*g*er all about property investing.
Their main interest is often to sell you a product that earns them the fattest commission.
There are obviously exceptions but they are hard to find. I hold millions with the CBA but find that the staff I deal with know little about investing. Usually, they are employees who are on low incomes and are content with their jobs. They are very friendly and attempt to sell me some basic products.
Of course you can successfully invest in property without SS.
The number of property investors in Australia is huge and I'd hazzard a guess the vast majority many who have been around forever have not relied on the internet.
Most would rely on family, friends and/or their accountants and books to learn the ropes.
When you look at the percentage of suburbs with rental properties (many at 30%) you know they couldn't all be formites.
Having said that having confidence in all those people is important. Have you asked them straight out what their experience is (in this case with property)? references? Part of your DD when getting anyone to do work for you, any work, is asking them this.
The number of property investors in Australia is huge and I'd hazzard a guess the vast majority many who have been around forever have not relied on the internet.
Most would rely on family, friends and/or their accountants and books to learn the ropes.
When you look at the percentage of suburbs with rental properties (many at 30%) you know they couldn't all be formites.
Having said that having confidence in all those people is important. Have you asked them straight out what their experience is (in this case with property)? references? Part of your DD when getting anyone to do work for you, any work, is asking them this.
When we bought our first IP in our super " we suck " bank told us that they would only lend us the money if we had a financial plan developed by one of their financial planners . ( we subsequent ally they had no right to do this ..) .
At the start of the process he made a big " headline claim" about what what he would be able to help us develop in germs of a retirement plan . At the end of the process he came no where near his he'd line promise . In fact further down the line, when we came to settle " we suck " decreased the amount they lent us at a point where we wouldn't have had the time to arrange alternative finance .
Our bank Financial planner had no real idea what he was doing and was using a bank prescribed cookie cutter approach . We knew more than he did and , while I don't know how much he was worth , I'd have a bet it was much less than what we're worth .
I was interested to note that the latest adverstising we've received from a property investing expert who was promoting their educational expertise had a property portfolio smaller than ours. Ar the moment I don't consider that we are highly geared , but as the market is starting to change I'm planning on buying more. Maybe I should change my career into a property investing educator .....
The reality is that most of the experts I've met over the last ten years ( with a couple of exceptions of Dale GG and Nick M ) don't know as much about property investing as the long term members of this forum (eg sim , goanna , ruby , mark b , Rixter , Jacques , michael g , yuck , The Wife , Micheal Croft etc ....) just to name some of the ones that I know , and then there's a whole range of people who have come along since I was really active.
You will get more useful and unbiased information on this forum than from any financial advisor . Unfortunately there are also bull ..... Artists who talk big but don't really know what they're talking about. For a newbie it can be hard to tell the difference. But that's the same on any Internet forum ....
Cliff
At the start of the process he made a big " headline claim" about what what he would be able to help us develop in germs of a retirement plan . At the end of the process he came no where near his he'd line promise . In fact further down the line, when we came to settle " we suck " decreased the amount they lent us at a point where we wouldn't have had the time to arrange alternative finance .
Our bank Financial planner had no real idea what he was doing and was using a bank prescribed cookie cutter approach . We knew more than he did and , while I don't know how much he was worth , I'd have a bet it was much less than what we're worth .
I was interested to note that the latest adverstising we've received from a property investing expert who was promoting their educational expertise had a property portfolio smaller than ours. Ar the moment I don't consider that we are highly geared , but as the market is starting to change I'm planning on buying more. Maybe I should change my career into a property investing educator .....
The reality is that most of the experts I've met over the last ten years ( with a couple of exceptions of Dale GG and Nick M ) don't know as much about property investing as the long term members of this forum (eg sim , goanna , ruby , mark b , Rixter , Jacques , michael g , yuck , The Wife , Micheal Croft etc ....) just to name some of the ones that I know , and then there's a whole range of people who have come along since I was really active.
You will get more useful and unbiased information on this forum than from any financial advisor . Unfortunately there are also bull ..... Artists who talk big but don't really know what they're talking about. For a newbie it can be hard to tell the difference. But that's the same on any Internet forum ....
Cliff
The MB and FA are long term property investors (tas only), unsure about the PL. How do you go about sourcing a good network? Do you ask on the phone before setting up a meeting? I have another meeting tomorrow with an accountant and ill be asking them of their experience in IP. If none, I'll get my tax return done and look for someone else for ongoing financial management matters. I am finding it difficult to find a good local network with the same ideals as me. Anybody else have this trouble when first starting out?
So you think the CBA personal lender who writes lots of business would get the same pay as the CBA personal lender who doesn't manage to write any business?
You don't need them to have the same 'ideals', as you call it. A solicitor, say, can be an expert in property contract law without having bought a property themselves. Tax is often an intellectual exercise, from studying case law. A good agent (for you as a buyer) is one who can convince the seller to take a low offer, not necessarily one who owns a lot of property.
I think it's a common thing with newbies. You don't have the knowledge to evaluate your advisors so you look for people who have the same goals. For example, you may find a person with similar goals to you, but they also have no experience, so it's the blind leading the blind (though you feel a lot better about it).
Besides, let's be honest. You're just starting out. You just need solid advice, not high-powered whiz-bank tax structures (though some may convince you of the need for it) or 'ways to buy property at 50% below market'. You need to know enough about what you want from an accountant, solicitor, mortgage broker, etc to evaluate them. When you understand the basics, you don't have to rely on faith based on shared values, you KNOW when they're a good fit for you or not.
Every CBA employee is on a commission reward system. The bank teller that you meet at the front counter gets a commission if they open a new account for you. They get a commission if they sign you up for a term deposit. The branch bank manager gets a commission if their branch opens more than x number of new accounts per month.
That is why when I go to CBA to deposit money, I am always asked in a friendly manner whether I am saving for something? - would i like to meet their loans manager, would i like to meet their financial planner? Even when a teller sets up an appointment for a client to meet a CBA financial planner, the teller gets a commission.
I like their business model because it incentivises every employee to milk the most out of every customer and be nice to them because every customer is a cash cow.
Hence, I own shares in the major banks. As a customer of CBA, I am most worried if I am not hassled for business every time I interact with them because that employee would not be doing their job.
I honestly have no idea. Perhaps he'd receive performance based bonuses every year. Maybe not. I'm only guessing.
Hiya
A CBA personal lender and a broker .......that may result in some interesting outcomes.
How does it work in your instance ?
ta
rolf
A CBA personal lender and a broker .......that may result in some interesting outcomes.
How does it work in your instance ?
ta
rolf
Lol, well, there you go!
Indeed, a strange situation. Long story short was we approached CBA for finance via equity in our ppor because they supply our current finance. In the meantime we thought we'd shop around to see if there were any better deals out there with a MB. CBA may win out in the end, as they gave us a higher valuation on the ppor, meaning more equity to play with. Running in circles so it seems.
I would go back to the CBA with the best deal from your MB and ask them to match it. Or throw it other deal sweeteners such waiving fees on your credit cards / accounts, etc.
I have often done this with term deposit rates and the CBA often will come very close to it and then I am happy to continue my relationship with them.
Do you know what you are shopping for and why?
Has anyone sat down with you to work out what you actually want long term from your portfolio, and therefore work back wards to define what you actually need in terms of lender and product mix at any point in time ?
My guess would be no. Most bankers and brokers run the current deal, and if they are pro active, the next. Few go to the effort to challenge and engage you to show you your real potential using your resources.
ta
rolf
China this is not quiet correct.
Each staff member will have set target, but they do not receive commission like mortgage brokers or financial planners.
They will receive bonuses like most sales staff for reaching sales targets, but theses are reliant heavily on KPIs mainly service which is different to your usual broker or financial planner commission as they will still receive the funds for that actual product sold.
And I would dare say that the tellers probably think that you could increase your wealth quicker in other ways rather then just sitting the funds in the bank (pretty sure most on the forum would agree with that as well)
Not so much the milking of products... but CBA has a massive focus on customer service for many years now
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