1million in Equity!

Dear Alex,

1. Perhaps, that is the way that the Japanese Govt has originally intended things to be so, as the appropiate way to cushion the adverse consequences arising from its housing bubble burst, on its peoples through a prolonged "deflationary" economy;- as this would result in less social casualties suffered, which in return, would then be politically more acceptable for the ruling regime.

2. Another way of looking at things as they are, is that the housing bubbles that have occured in Australia so far, have been less extremes/un-sustainable, less "intensively speculative" and smalller in scale, in the first place. Consequently, Australia is able to achieve a soft landing after each of its property market booms have occurred in the past. Thus, it is able to avoid a real housing market crash, much unlike what was previously experienced in Japan and other Asian countries like HK, Singapore etc as well as the present US housing markets.

3. Personally, I will give "kudos" to the able leadership and excellent fiscal management under the ex-Australian RBA Chairman, Mr John MacFarlance and his RBA Team who are able to successfully steer Australia out of the few global financial crisis, like the 1997 Asian Financial Crisis and the 2000s DotCom Stock Market Crash etc, relatively unscathed. Even Alan Greenspan, the ex-American Federal US Bank Chairman has commended and spoken well of John MacFarlance's personal acumen and sharp mind as a person as well as the Australian RBA's performance during John MacFarlance's office term as the RBA Chairmanship.

4. With the recent change in the Australian RBA chairmanship to Glenns Steven, it is too early at this point, to judge or say whether the RBA will continue to be able to skillfully manage its fiscal policies well during a financial crisis, as during John MacFarlance's office term.

5. For your further comments and discussion, please.

6. Thank you.

regards,
Kenneth KOH
 
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1. Perhaps, that is the way that the Japanese Govt has originally intended things to be so, as the appropiate way to cushion the adverse consequences arising from its housing bubble burst, on its peoples through a prolonged "deflationary" economy;- as this would result in less social casualties suffered, which in return, would then be politically more acceptable for the ruling regime.

Yes, because the Japanese people are rather more docile and there is no credible alternative political party in Japan. Australia, however, is different. The two parties are equally credible (at least in that they have actually been in power this side of the war). In any case, we have more independent institutions (such as the RBA).

4. With the recent change in the Australian RBA chairmanship to Glenns Steven, it is too early at this point, to judge or say whether the RBA will continue to be able to skillfully manage its fiscal policies well during a financial crisis, as during John MacFarlance's office term.

If backbone is one characteristic of a good RBA governor (and I believe it is) then Stevens has so far proved himself willing to stand up to the government by raising rates this close to the election. Tomorrow, if the RBA raises rates, will cinch that.

Who knows how Stevens will do, but I do believe that a country with at least two viable political parties and an independent reserve bank, with traditionally lesser excesses (relatively) will NOT perform as badly as a country with basically no political opposition, a dependent central bank and historically high excesses (partly due to culture, I think. The Japanese are notoriously unlikely to change their mind and addmit that they're wrong).
Alex
 
TAX FREE Income Money Machine

Hi Rixter,

Back onto the original topic of '$1m in equity'

"For ease of calculation lets say we buy a property for $250k, so in 10 years its now worth $500k. Now lets say we do that each year for the next 7-10 years. Now you can quit the rat race.

So in year 11 ( 10 years since your 1st Ip) you have 250K equity in IP1 you can draw out (up to 80%) Tax free to fund your lifestyle or invest with. In year 12 you do exactly the same but instead of drawing it from IP1 you draw it from IP2. In year 13 you do the same to IP3, in year 14 to IP4, etc etc etc. You systmatically go right through your portfolio year by year until you have redrawn from each property up to year 20.

So what do you do after you get year 20 I hear you say ?? hmmm..well thats where it all falls into a deep hole - You have to go get a JOB - nope only joking!

You simply go back to that first IP you purchased as its been 10 years since you drew upon it first time around and its now doubled in value ($1M) yet again - so you complete the entire cycle once again. Infact chances are you never drew each property up 80% lvr max , so not only have you got entire property cycle of growth to spend you still have what you left in it first time round that compounded big time. Now you wealth is compounding faster than you can spend it! What a problem to have

Well thats the Basic Big Picture of CGA. Once its set up its a self perpetuating, TAX FREE Income Money Machine."

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This seems like a good strategy but is it really TAX FREE to fund your lifestyle? Surely if you draw money from an IP via a LOC then you have to account for the dollars spent. Wouldn't this income be taxable? I hope you are right.

Cheers,

Bazza
 
This seems like a good strategy but is it really TAX FREE to fund your lifestyle? Surely if you draw money from an IP via a LOC then you have to account for the dollars spent. Wouldn't this income be taxable? I hope you are right.

Yes, it is.

If you draw money from an IP, it's not income, so it's not taxable. However, the interest on that amount will not be tax deductible. No one will dispute that. If you don't declare the interest as a deduction, the ATO doesn't care what you spend it on.
Alex
 
This seems like a good strategy but is it really TAX FREE to fund your lifestyle? Surely if you draw money from an IP via a LOC then you have to account for the dollars spent. Wouldn't this income be taxable? I hope you are right.

The funds you withdraw is not "taxable income", therefore income tax free :D

The interest on funds withdrawn for non income producing purposes ie lifestyle, is not tax deductable. But you have been LOE without any tax deductability which is worse case scenario anyway.

Hope this helps.
 
Thanks Alex and Rick - great. I like the concept.

1. What if the IP is held in a HDT - I guess that case is different since unit shares have to be paid to individuals which attracts tax?

2. Do you need to withdraw the money in a lump sum?

3. Say I have an IP worth $400k and $100k LOC. Can I withdraw the $100K then sell the IP to reduce the CGT on the sale?

Thanks. Much appreciated.

Cheers,

Bazza
 
2. Do you need to withdraw the money in a lump sum?

Depends on the loan. Some loans may require a minimum withdrawal.

3. Say I have an IP worth $400k and $100k LOC. Can I withdraw the $100K then sell the IP to reduce the CGT on the sale?

No, because you're not changing the tax cost base of the property when you draw equity out of it. In the same way, refinancing and using the extra money to buy shares, another property, etc doesn't change the CGT payable on the original property.

But the point of LOE is NOT to sell, so you never have to pay CGT.
Alex
 
I see Alex.

So you still have to pay the CGT eventually if you sell the property but if you never sell then what the heck. So, it's not actually tax free money but who cares when your dead.

Cheers,

Bazza
 
No. You can set it up so you can go to the ATM or over the bank counter and withdraw it out as you need it same as any savings account.

Hope this helps.
You almost can though. Setup the LOC and then also set up a standing order with the bank every month to transfer $1,000 out of your LOC account into your savings account. Then you can go to the ATM and pull the cash straight out of your savings account. In a way, the LOC transfers become a proxy for salaried or passive monthly "incomes".

Cheers,
Michael.
 
You almost can though. Setup the LOC and then also set up a standing order with the bank every month to transfer $1,000 out of your LOC account into your savings account. Then you can go to the ATM and pull the cash straight out of your savings account. In a way, the LOC transfers become a proxy for salaried or passive monthly "incomes".

MW, all I do is access my LOC direct at the ATM. I have it linked to the Cheque account button, so when it asks me what account I simply press the Cheque button and it debits my LOC account.

Hope this helps.
 
Cool!

I misread your original post to argue that this wasn't possible due to the special treatment of LOC accounts. Hadn't tried linking one to my card myself though I do have a few LOCs in place, one of which is not fully drawn.

Makes it that much easier again if you can draw it straight out of the ATM without the added burden of transfering it to a "cash" account.

Too easy really...

Cheers,
Michael.
 
So you still have to pay the CGT eventually if you sell the property but if you never sell then what the heck. So, it's not actually tax free money but who cares when your dead.

Is it as simple as that though ??

When doing our testamentary trust paperwork, I do remember the ATO getting involved with individuals when assets were deemed to be triggered when transferred.

Case in point. Family home bought in 1965 and held ever since. Not subject to CGT as pre-85. Children receive the house as an inheritance, but the transfer activates the CGT clock, and the asset value is deemed at what it is, and this forms the CGT cost base. Thereafter, if the children sell, it will attract CGT for the period they owned it.

Eventually, this legislation will trawl all non CGT assets into the CGT net eventually....just a matter of time.

So - obviously when you're dead, not you won't have to care a jot - but the people left behind - maybe a widow an dependent children will probably be interested if you have a big portfolio and the debts you've racked up whilst LOE might be of interest. Of course, the Bank extending the finance might also have a bit of a re-think and pull the plug.

Anyway, I'm talking out of my a$$ cos I've never LOE. :)
 
Is it as simple as that though ??

When doing our testamentary trust paperwork, I do remember the ATO getting involved with individuals when assets were deemed to be triggered when transferred.

Case in point. Family home bought in 1965 and held ever since. Not subject to CGT as pre-85. Children receive the house as an inheritance, but the transfer activates the CGT clock, and the asset value is deemed at what it is, and this forms the CGT cost base. Thereafter, if the children sell, it will attract CGT for the period they owned it.

Eventually, this legislation will trawl all non CGT assets into the CGT net eventually....just a matter of time.

So - obviously when you're dead, not you won't have to care a jot - but the people left behind - maybe a widow an dependent children will probably be interested if you have a big portfolio and the debts you've racked up whilst LOE might be of interest. Of course, the Bank extending the finance might also have a bit of a re-think and pull the plug.

Anyway, I'm talking out of my a$$ cos I've never LOE. :)

Agreed there will a mess left behind but I'm sure the recipients of the inheritance will end up better off after the smoke has cleared.

Cheers,

Bazza
 
"For ease of calculation lets say we buy a property for $250k, so in 10 years its now worth $500k. Now lets say we do that each year for the next 7-10 years. Now you can quit the rat race.

So in year 11 ( 10 years since your 1st Ip) you have 250K equity in IP1 you can draw out (up to 80%) Tax free to fund your lifestyle or invest with. In year 12 you do exactly the same but instead of drawing it from IP1 you draw it from IP2. In year 13 you do the same to IP3, in year 14 to IP4, etc etc etc. You systmatically go right through your portfolio year by year until you have redrawn from each property up to year 20.

So what do you do after you get year 20 I hear you say ?? hmmm..well thats where it all falls into a deep hole - You have to go get a JOB - nope only joking!

You simply go back to that first IP you purchased as its been 10 years since you drew upon it first time around and its now doubled in value ($1M) yet again - so you complete the entire cycle once again. Infact chances are you never drew each property up 80% lvr max , so not only have you got entire property cycle of growth to spend you still have what you left in it first time round that compounded big time. Now you wealth is compounding faster than you can spend it! What a problem to have

Well thats the Basic Big Picture of CGA. Once its set up its a self perpetuating, TAX FREE Income Money Machine."


Okay, I get the theory but I have a question which I have not yet got my mind around yet.

If you take out a LOC and start using the money from your equity via the LOC doesn't this just increase your loan and require bigger repayments? So how can you withdraw the cash via the LOC and still keep up with bigger loan repayments?

If anyone can clear this up for me I would be very grateful,

Leilah
 
If you take out a LOC and start using the money from your equity via the LOC doesn't this just increase your loan and require bigger repayments? So how can you withdraw the cash via the LOC and still keep up with bigger loan repayments?

If anyone can clear this up for me I would be very grateful,

Leilah

Because the value of your properties keeps going up, so your equity increases. Theoretically, as long as your withdrawals are smaller than your property appreciation, you're ok.
alex
 
Because the value of your properties keeps going up, so your equity increases. Theoretically, as long as your withdrawals are smaller than your property appreciation, you're ok.

Leilah,

Just to add to Alex's post, your rents are also increasing. You redraw upon an individual property once every 7-10 years or every property cycle.

So you will have a complete cycle of growth to utilise plus a complete cycle of rent increase on the property to cover your redraw costs also.

Hope this helps.
 
Also, Leilah, when you're doing LOE you're probably not drawing a 80% LVR up to 90% LVR and then waiting until the value goes up before drawing down again.

You're more likely to be around 50% LVR, drawing down another 10% and so on. LOE is very dangerous if you already have a high LVR.
Alex
 
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