ABC TV Reporter

I'm working on ABC television's new youth current affairs show The Hack Half Hour.
Hosted by Steve Cannane, The Hack Half Hour is a single-issue, 30 minute panel-style program which will air on Monday nights at 8.30pm EST on ABC2.
It aims to be a gritty, raw approach to current affairs using young people's experiences as the focal point. Our core audience are 15 -35 year olds.
I'm producing a show on the property market. The Great Australian Dream is to own your own home. But with prices so high and interest rates increasing this is not looking likely for a lot of people. I'm looking for the following types of people for the discussion because young people feel really torn about what they shoud do:
*Someone who bought and lost
*Somone who bought and won
*Soneone who chose to travel
*Someone who chose to party
*People who chose to rent instead
*Someone who feels they missed the boat
*Siblings or friends who have split the debt
*Still living at home saving
Let me know if this is you or if you know someone who fits the bill.
Thank you!
 
Sounds like a very interesting telecast.

Hi, I am 34 years and have just purchased no. 3 house. I live at home and rent. Could you provide me with more information. Cheers Matthew.
 
Maybe my son (23) went to University and completed a degree; now working but feels he has missed the boat and has calculated he will have to earn around $100,000 pa to buy a fairly standard home. Not renting but is still at home,
 
Righteous - about 30ish is when most people seem to get married, settle down, breed etc. And that usually equates to getting a mortgage. You're just average.

Also, is it my imagination or is the entire freakin internet 32? Did they put something in the water in 1976?
 
Antoinette, I'm wondering what sort of program you'll end up with, since most of the guests appear to be people who have not done it/given up rather than those who have succeeded. Hence its educational value to young people who want to get a place of their own is going to be limited as non-buyers will get most of the air time.

I'm looking for the following types of people for the discussion because young people feel really torn about what they shoud do:
*Someone who bought and lost
*Somone who bought and won
*Soneone who chose to travel
*Someone who chose to party
*People who chose to rent instead
*Someone who feels they missed the boat
*Siblings or friends who have split the debt
*Still living at home saving

From that selection you've got 2 people who did it, 5 people who haven't and 1 who may.

If you want to reinforce the conventional wisdom that young people can't buy property, then the biased line-up above isn't a bad way to do it. The problem is the commercial channels also present this sort of stuff. It's boring and why a lot here don't watch them much.

Why not take a different angle? Instead of 6 people saying how hard it is, why not talk to 4 or 5 who've done it? Then you'll have something like a balanced show with 10 times the ideas. It might even inspire viewers rather than drag them down like the standard Today Tonight offering does.

The sort of background you might need to include is this:

* People talk about 'average' or median house prices with some astronomical/unaffordable figure being given. All the median means is that half the houses are cheaper than that so will be more affordable.

* Take your city's reported median price and halve it. That is your budget. A purchase around that amount is affordable to most and there should still be reasonable choice (though not in all suburbs).

* In Melbourne for instance you can buy an established suburban house in a well-serviced outer suburb for about $180 - $250k. If you want to live closer in or bayside, you'll find units for that amount. If you want cheap, you'll find units starting from around $120k.

* The soft market in many areas means now is a reasonable time to buy as competition is reduced, and in parts of Sydney you may actually pay less than a few years ago.

* Rents are rising, you can't add value to a rented property and you've got less control.

* Sensible borrowing can accelerate wealth accumulation and mean you don't need to wait for the oldies to cark before you catch up with their wealth!

As for the people, the following are examples:

* The single person on below average income who was rejected by the bank for their own home but found they could buy one or more rental properties because the rental income improved their serviceability. They're still renting inner-city but they've done OK with their investment properties. Maybe one day they'll buy a place of their own.

* The guy on a below average income who scrimped and saved and managed to buy something cheap with a good deposit. It might have been in an outer suburb and/or required some work done which they did.

* The trainee graduate who bought a large house near a university and rented the spare rooms to other students to help pay the mortgage.

* The person who did months of research and looking and eventually found something the seller needed to offload quickly and got it for a good price (there are some suburbs where almost no one turns up to auctions).

Wouldn't interviewing 5 people 'who did' be more interesting than talking to 6 who said 'they can't'?

Peter
 
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Excellent post Peter

I'm a fan of the program and would also like to see it take a different angle on this subject to the usual "how hard is it now compared to how it used to be" etc.

We're 32/33, spent 5 years each at uni (no earning capacity then!), bought a few, developed some and won nicely... now there's effectively no personal debt on our own house and it means my wife doesn't have to work and can comfortably stay at home with the kids while they're young... This is worth so much to us... :)

For what it's worth, I don't think it's that much harder than when we started - it's all about having the right expectations... we first lived in cheap dodgy houses in dodgy suburbs (development blocks & 100% land value though! :D but I still remember someone starting a fire at the front of our house and my wife calling to say there was someone in the backyard... :mad:), didn't have a car (borrowed parent's bomb) for quite sometime, slept on a mattress on the floor for quite awhile and we still don't have decent lounge or dining furniture (the kids would just wreck it!). Pushed the limit of what banks would give us but always managed to save extra anyway...

I know that all sounds incredibly tight ar$ed and full of hardship but we also managed to squeeze in a 3 month budget honeymoon around the world and I had another 3 months backpacking in Europe when I was a single man. It wasn't without having fun - our fun was just the cheaper variety IMO. We wouldn't change a thing... other than thinking we should have been more aggresive with our investing! We are still well behind many others on this forum...

A higher income now is a recent thing - most of the property purchasing happened when we were below average income but living frugally to get our feet on the ladder... so forgive me if I get a little jaded when people complain about affordability! Unfortunately it's not necessarily their fault - it's just financial skills are not taught or part of our culture at all. So many don't realise what it takes to succeed with money, let alone property. It would be good to use the program to highlight what's possible rather than how hard it all is... just my 2c.
 
@HiEquity

Have the values of your houses gone up more than inflation / average wage (pick either one, I assume unless you actually lost out the answer is yes for either)? If so it is by definition harder now than it was when you did it isn't it? If you can think of way in which houses costing more by either definition makes the situation the same I will be impressed.

Unless you are saying that people trying now should have lower expectations.

You invested in the biggest property boom of all time and made money, nice luck and fair play to you but are you claiming you could do this now or that your skills when starting out were sufficient to do the same now?

If you are not what are you trying to teach people/ That they could have been lucky too if the were around back then and were willing to take a punt?

Not a lot of use of that were the case I guess.

Living in dodgy accommodation as a student is hardly a stretch for anyone now is it? All of the people I knew at uni that weren't supported by their parents didn't have a car either. Oddly enough most of us had earnings potential though, we worked night jobs. I wonder how you did it with no earnings potential? Must have racked up a chunk of debt there and then I suppose, unless someone else covered your bills...

As for not having a decent lounge now, I assume this is by choice, given that a decent lounge costs all of 1K and you claim to have won nicely I would expect 1K to be a fairly trivial amount. So I guess this is just a bit of personal flavour to add to your delightful anecdote.

Unless you can't convert your winnings to actual cash. An unlikely proposition, who would claim to have won if they can't actually materialise their winnings?

(I hate to break it to you but this does not sound like hardship yet, perhaps you will relate the hardship later in your post, I am still going.)

You went backpacking round europe for 3 months, bugger me, that is indeed some hardship! How did you take it man? Those cheap thrills of 3 months off work with a couple of K flights and all. Next you'll tell me you flew economy! I bet you couldn't afford hotels and had to stay in backpackers too! Talk about salt of the earth, truly your hardships are some that can teach us all a lesson.

Who paid for this? I am estimating mid 90's 3 months backpacking in europe running at on the order of 15K. Did you cash in one of you property ventures, have help from someone else or add some more debt to your pile post uni?

It is obvious from your story though that a better education for our young ones will certainly bring them up to speed so that they also can endure the hardships you went through and make a living buying property and so on.

Just out of interest did you negative gear any of your property? If so you owe me some of your property, you know because there I was like a chump working and paying tax some of which was used to cover your losses.

I am just kidding though.

I have just been doing my taxes and by investing my time into getting better at my job I have had an average payrise of ~24% compounded each year for the past 16 years (top of my head calc, 24K -> 280K in 16 years).

This of course means that in an economic downturn such as we are potentially facing I will probably still be in demand, maybe not at the same stupid pay scale but certainly my skills which are required now will be require din a downturn and being one of the better ones out there I am likely to keep some cash coming in. I am not sure how good you are as a landlord but I suspect you may face a lot of competition.

Unless, of course, you have invested a vast quantity of time into your career alongside your property gambit. Something I think most people would agree is unlikely. Most of us only have time to really invest our time into one aspect of our lives.

If you have invested your time into the property thing you would want to be one of the best to think you have anything to offer to viewers. If you haven't what are you going to tell them? "It was easy I fluked it".

hmmm. I do hope to see some decent material on hack (the TV show) but I suspect you may not qualify.
 
I don't think success stories are relevant unless they are happening in the current economic climate.

It's all well enough to have succeeded having bought prior to the biggest property boom in history, doubled your money and gotten out before the boom ended, it's quite another to be trying to do the same thing now.
 
@HiEquity
hmmm. I do hope to see some decent material on hack (the TV show) but I suspect you may not qualify.

Hmmm, interesting first post Tor. Do feel free to tell us all about your wealth creation story some time so we can all learn... I don't want to be on hack but I would like to see a media story focussed on opportunity rather than whinging for a change...

But seriously, I will answer some of the more serious questions in case they were serious, as follows:

1) Our patches of dirt have exceeded inflation. But the cities I invested in were a fair bit smaller back then - an equivalent house today would be further out of town. That was what I meant by lowering expectations. I couldn't expect to live in a "fringe" suburb of the 1960s either (ie now a blue ribbon suburb). I was just pointing out that we started out living in the bottom 20% of suburbs at the time and anyone can still do that if they wish... they're not that unaffordable (especially for you it sounds!).

2) If it all went to custard we would start again the same way now, with a different strategy for different times but the basics are the same.

3) We didn't purchase anything while we were at uni - we only started after graduating and getting real jobs. So we missed a lot of years that would have been good investing for the sake of a higher income now. The point being that someone starting with a decent trade today would get a good head start!

4) Well done for getting the $280k income and enjoying what you do. You don't know me from a bar of soap so it is interesting to note the assumptions you have made. I didn't specify my income because I don't want to and it isn't relevant to the topic for the reasons mentioned. But I also invest my time in my career (hence the five years at uni). I'm happy for you to take whatever conclusions you like from that. Suffice it to say that investing doesn't have to come at the expense of career at all - I completely fail to see the necessity of that connection.

5) The point about hardships was for those who think you can't do this and have a good time as well. I was only trying to point out those two concepts aren't necessarily mutually exclusive as well...

I don't think there were any more serious questions in there but if I'm wrong feel free to ask away!
 
Hmmm, interesting first post Tor.
Thank you, I am awesome :)
Do feel free to tell us all about your wealth creation story some time so we can all learn...
I told you. I work hard and focus on providing my skills to people, as I get better they pay more. I thought I made that pretty obvious in my post. Perhaps I should reiterate:

1. get skills people want
2. hone those skills
3. do it more and work really hard at it

Personally I can't see anyone doing this with 2 different skills at the same time as mentioned, therefore i make the personal assumption that you chose one of your skills: either what you work at or your property thing.

if it was the thing you work at then your property thing is a much lower regarded skill, it can be successful (hell I have a world championship in a martial art that I sort of pay attention to compared to my work) but it is definitely something you would be cautious about presenting as an expert in (simply because you know how much you suck at that sideline thing compared to your real thing).

Alternatively you focussed on your property thing. That must be a bit scary because, given your time frames, you have never been tested.

My point here is that if you invested all your time in your work thing you may survive an upcoming period of economic "badness" but you are not in a position to offer an opinion about how to invest in property.

Conversely if you invested your time in property you have never been tested and should be nervous about exposing this lack of experience to the world. No one wants to be the next star wars kid after all.

On top of that, being a landlord is not a new job. It is old as hte hills. It hs a bunch of rules in it which appear to have been ignored by people recently (rental yield etc). I always get nervous when someone says something which has been done for decades has a new twist where you get rich for low effort.
[/QUOTE]
I don't want to be on hack but I would like to see a media story focussed on opportunity rather than whinging for a change...
If you don't want to be on hack why were you responding to this post? Just some kind of feel good rah rah rah post? I am sure the serious investors here have no time for that nonsense and will put you on ignore pretty quick if that was the whole point of your post.

That would mean you couldn't ask them for help and surely that is what this forum is for. Perhaps I am mistaken and it is a place for self aggrandisement. I get confused so easily.
But seriously, I will answer some of the more serious questions in case they were serious, as follows:
My questions are always serious, my responses to answers may appear not to be. Personal taste and all.
1) Our patches of dirt have exceeded inflation. But the cities I invested in were a fair bit smaller back then - an equivalent house today would be further out of town. That was what I meant by lowering expectations. I couldn't expect to live in a "fringe" suburb of the 1960s either (ie now a blue ribbon suburb). I was just pointing out that we started out living in the bottom 20% of suburbs at the time and anyone can still do that if they wish... they're not that unaffordable (especially for you it sounds!).
Hmmm. Yes I can buy many places according to the bank. That is kind of irrelevant to the topic though isn't it? (outside of the fact that your good fortune was sponsored in part by my tax dollars, seriously have fun with them, I pay so many that your portion wouldn't make much difference if you gave it back, if all of the property investors did it would but I can't expect that now can I?)

To the point. The dirt you bought has exceeded inflation (and implicitly wage rises although you don't mention it, take it as given for the past 30 odd years).

Is this because you were smart or just good luck?
Have you looked at what the properties available to people in your economic class were in the sixties?
Have you looked at what the properties available to people in your economic class are available now?

Is there a difference? Can it all be assigned to "oh the younger generation are all criminals"

Do you even understand what the implications of this are? If object x is desirable at level y then it doesn't matter what y is.

i.e.

If a person with median income * 30% saving for 5 years can buy object x

and object x doesn't change

then object x is worth median income * 30% saving for 5 years at any point in time.

Follow? Population changes over some 5 years are not enough to explain the "win" that you claim.

2) If it all went to custard we would start again the same way now, with a different strategy for different times but the basics are the same.
What is this different strategy. This of all is probably the most important answer you can make in my opinion. Would it be exactly the same as the previous or would you be shorting the market given that that is where the money is now according to the herd?
3) We didn't purchase anything while we were at uni - we only started after graduating and getting real jobs. So we missed a lot of years that would have been good investing for the sake of a higher income now. The point being that someone starting with a decent trade today would get a good head start!
So some one at uni now should follow the investment strategy of some 5 years ago? You're kidding right?
4) ...I didn't specify my income because I don't want to...But I also invest my time in my career (hence the five years at uni). ...Suffice it to say that investing doesn't have to come at the expense of career at all - I completely fail to see the necessity of that connection.
Don't want to? heh. afraid of being caught in a lie? Hell I have decent security clearance from the federal police, you can mail me seperately, I'll mail you my clearance number. Nice and safe. Lets you prove that your nice win is valid. I will happily fax my tax statement to you.

5 years at uni was a while ago yeah? You may want to consder outting time in now. You are young you will make more money from career building than any other investment you can make.

As for not impacting your career you are either saying that investment and winning over the long term is easy or that you think it is. I suspect there are a few people that will disagree with you. Making money long term is hard, otherwise everyone would do it.
5) The point about hardships was for those who think you can't do this and have a good time as well. I was only trying to point out those two concepts aren't necessarily mutually exclusive as well...
I was trying to point out that your hardships were something many people would consider a pretty damn good lifestyle. You missed that.
I don't think there were any more serious questions in there but if I'm wrong feel free to ask away!
My question you didn't answer was why you think you are in any position to talk about winning? You posted in a thread aimed at advising people and obviously wanted ot encourage people to do what you did but you didn't address whether you were lucky or skilled.

So we have 2 main questions:

Were you lucky or can you act as a landlord and make money in an environment closer to any time in the past 1000 odd years?

If you had to start again would your investment strategy be pretty much the same sector as it was previously (real estate) or would you take advantage of the differences in economic activity to short the market (or something else)?
 
Short questions for Tor:
Were you, are you or will you be a property investor and if so what was/ is/ will be your strategy ?
If not why are you here ?
Regards
 
Short questions for Tor:
Were you, are you or will you be a property investor and if so what was/ is/ will be your strategy ?
If not why are you here ?
Regards

Despite the bifurcation in your questions I will simply answer them all. I doubt my answers will be simple true/false enough to satisfy either branching:

I invest in commercial property via indexing using dollar cost averaging. That probably doesn't count in your eyes.

I have recently bought a house to live in however which is mostly why I am here.

Should a house become available within walking distance of where I live (I don't drive as mentioned previously) and the investment look worthwhile I could certainly be tempted into being a landlord. I do believe the odds of significant capital gain are probably not quite high enough to temp me at the moment as I would have to borrow a chunk of cash to try it. Certainly the rental yield is nowhere near good enough. Given I am currently in debt I am unlikely to do this until I am out of debt, probably a couple of years as mentioned.

On top of that any investment I make (at the moment, I may change my mind) is typically one that has minimum fees. Fees can only ever reduce your return. Any fees paid should be for something infeasible to be done by yourself. Therefore moving into active RE requires a bunch of skills for me.

I do have some skills as an interior decorator and have grown up with my Dad being a landlord whilst I was younger. Hard game to get real rich at but nice and safe money once you get it all in shape. I will certainly be refreshing / upping my skills in the home handyman arena (including, I hope, getting my sparky ticket) over the next decade or so. This ought to put me in a position where being a landlord is a viable option for me.

My life strategy was to save for a couple of years and now is to pay my PPOR off in a couple of years. I am pretty anti debt in my own life, I have no issue with others using it but it is too high a risk for my taste.

My investment strategy (outside of paying off the PPOR very quickly) currently is primarily dollar cost averaging of a couple of indexes. This is because after a lot of looking at the share market I realised it was a game I could not win at because I could not spend the time required to make the good decisions and dollar cost indexing has provided a significantly good return over the long term with zero effort required. Before anyone mentions the recent crash (esp in LPT indexes), yes they were good and exciting. Unfortunately the did not come at the exact perfect time (which would have been before I bought any index) but they did meet my long term hopes which were basically "A crash will come over the next 60 odd years, Would I prefer it at the beginning of my investment plan or at the end".

I am of the opinion that if you are purchasing something (whether investment or just because you want it) you should spend time with the experts and those that consider themselves experts, that time should be commensurate with the price.

Hence I spent a lot of time over the past couple of years talking to RE types and people interested in RE (pro and con). Otherwise I'd have run out and been fleeced.

I do not quite understand the levels of debt being utilised currently in the RE investment market and am nervous that, should it all turn to poo, the people that have taken advantage of this debt (and my tax dollars helping fund it on losing investments) will be looking for some kind of bail out, which will presumably also come from tax dollars.

Of course at another level I am "here" because I enjoy posting on various forums around the place because I enjoy a good argument and "occasionally" get drunk enough to make amusing posts (as in I find them amusing, the targets of my posts sometimes do not).

There, I see you short questions and raise them A Wall Of Text!!! hehehe
 
@HiEquity

Have the values of your houses gone up more than inflation / average wage (pick either one, I assume unless you actually lost out the answer is yes for either)? If so it is by definition harder now than it was when you did it isn't it? If you can think of way in which houses costing more by either definition makes the situation the same I will be impressed.

Unless you are saying that people trying now should have lower expectations.

You invested in the biggest property boom of all time and made money, nice luck and fair play to you but are you claiming you could do this now or that your skills when starting out were sufficient to do the same now?

We bought 2 IP's in the same area, 2 months apart back in 2003 - one was a 2 x 1 unit for $105k and the other was a 3 x 1 house for $151k.
They are now both worth $220k and $300k respectively. I'd say that is more than inflation and the average wage rises.

Now, was it luck? Partly - we didn't expect the level of growth we have received.

But we made our own luck - we researched the area first thoroughly to assess it's cap growth potential; it's long term employment viability; the location of the properties in the area to amenities, the rental demand and rental return, depreciation, tax benefits and so on. And then we acted.

And, they were way below the median price at the time. The area is still going up according to my constant close scrutiny of the area (despite the recent D&G, and our rents have gone up from their original 9% and 9.5% return at purchase). One is now 13.5% and the other is 10.8% - not as good, but it is a long-term GEHA contract, so there has been no vacancy since day 1, so we're happy.

We started buying IP's in 2001 because I knew that over the long term their value went up at a historic average of around 5-6% per annum. We knew we could leverage from one property to two and so on - something you can't do with cash if it is left in the Bank.

The fact that there was a boom about to happen was of irrelevant, and we didn't know it was about to occur anyway - just lucky I guess, but amazingly, every property we have bought since 1985 (PPoR's until 2001) have just kept on goin' up steadily.

Our plan was to go for long term growth, but also get good cashflow in the short term to make them easier to hold. Had the spectacular growth not occurred, and it was only at the historical average, we would still have a property worth more than we bought it, and costing us nothing to hold -two free properties, in effect.

What we have done is not hard. Anyone who can scrap together a deposit for even a $150k property (the $105k ones don't exist now) and get a Bank loan for the rest can do it.

We could do it again today, because the system for buying for us has been cashflow first, cap growth second, which has increased at varying rates. The values could still stagnate or even fall in the short term (and some areas will), but it doesn't matter if the cashflow is there.

People will say "oh, you'll get a better return from gold or cash right now", but this is a fallacy when you compare the leverage effect of property on every after tax dollar you invest in either cash, gold or an IP.

If I have $30k to invest, and my ING account gives me a healthy 8% (today's returns but not so 2 years ago) then after 1 year I'm $2,400 richer before tax and inflation on my capital.

If I put the same $30k into an IP worth $130k plus purchase costs and borrow 80% from the Bank, and the property goes up by 5%, my nett worth before tax is $6,500

Now, that's a better return and if I've bought a cashflow positive after tax property, which means I will have more money coming back to me than I payed out, even after the tax position is accounted for, then the return is even better.

And, if I select the right property in the right areas, then that 5% could conceivably be even more than that. I re-invest this after-tax cashflow back into the IP loan and wait.

After 3 years, I leverage the equity in IP no.1 and do it all over again - this time using no actual cash for IP no.2, with the same result, and the rents have gone up on IP no.1.

NOW what is the return on my original $30k?

This has been our formula to date, and it has cost us pretty much nothing to grow our portfolio to this point. There have been some tougher times along the way, but mostly good.

Mind you, we started from a good position in 2001 through having a good deal of equity already from all our PPoR's that we have kept moving into along the way. But we at least started with a PPoR first. Without that sacrifice; saving the deposit, going without, etc initially; we would not be in our current position.

Meanwhile, my $30k in the Bank has become worth about $25k.

If the average 25 year old earning $50k or so per year can't do this (even just one IP) by the time they are 30, then there is no hope for the planet.

Now, if that show on ABC (which I haven't watched) would have someone like me - an average person not on a stellar income in IT or law etc - on the show to represent the Average Joe who can and did do it, to explain this scenario and how VERY DO-ABLE it is (recent boom notwithstanding), then the younger people of today may just find the incentive to do it.

But they won't do that; it's not good TV and doesn't fit their mantra of always siding with the academics and often financially maligned lefties, or the down-and-out section of society that love to hear re-affirmation from others about why they are so poor.

The problem is, not many of them are willing to give up 20% of their wages to save a deposit, give up their weekends for 3 months to trawl around neighborhoods looking at houses, sit on the internet for 2 hours everyday for 3 months to research an area to find just ONE potential property out of 100's - like we do.
 
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Hello...28/29, am winning....:):):) but haven't won yet...you won't be able to interview me because I am up near Ingham...:)

And here was me thinking you lived near IGHAM
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Abergowrie (near Igham), QLD
Posts: 457
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Dave
 
We bought 2 IP's in the same area, 2 months apart back in 2003 - one was a 2 x 1 unit for $105k and the other was a 3 x 1 house for $151k.
...our rents have gone up from their original 9% and 9.5% return at purchase). One is now 13.5% and the other is 10.8%...
...We started buying IP's in 2001...
2003 or 2001? Don't mean to quibble, maybe it is just a typo. Fairly significantly different periods in the boom though. Seriously a place you bought for 105K either 4 or 7 years ago is renting out for some 270 / week? Even if it was 7 years ago I find that a bit hard to believe. But okay, maybe you spent a bunch on the place making it nice.
...over the long term their value went up at a historic average of around 5-6% per annum. We knew we could leverage from one property to two and so on - something you can't do with cash if it is left in the Bank....
...We could do it again today, because the system for buying for us has been cashflow first...
...compare the leverage effect...
There are many other investment vehicles that have averaged better than that 5-6% over time and also allow leverage. Plus you can buy a lot of them in an index format which makes hitting the market over time much more likely. Maybe if someone had shown you the numbers you would have tried them? Your logic certainly dictates you would have. For example, even after the worst share market crash in a long time if you had invested in the ASX index in 2003 you would have made about a 60% increase in your investment. You could have leveraged that of course. This would involve zero work.
...If the average 25 year old earning $50k or so per year can't do this (even just one IP) by the time they are 30, then there is no hope for the planet....
...how VERY DO-ABLE it is (recent boom notwithstanding)...
You realise what it would mean if the average person owned two houses don't you?
...But they won't do that; it's not good TV...
...academic and often financially maligned lefties...
"financially maligned"? Not sure what you mean there... I'll take a stab in the dark you are trying to say academics don't agree that high leverage is a safe investment strategy? As in they speak badly of the financial strategy. Seriously though, bad phrase. Anyhow I assume you don't watch much tele, every second show for the past few years has been about property investment and I didn't see many scholarly types(I exagerate but you know what I mean). I agree it doesn't make good tele though.
...The problem is, not many of them are willing to give up 20% of their wages to save a deposit, give up their weekends for 3 months to trawl around neighborhoods looking at houses, sit on the internet for 2 hours everyday for 3 months to research an area to find just ONE potential property out of 100's - like we do.

Finally you acknowledge my initial point.

The time spend investing time and energy into learning to invest was excessive. 2 hrs per day + weekends, are we talking 20hrs a week? You realise if you just got a second job that amount of time would have a good return. Even spending that amount of time working at McDonalds would get about 25K annual return at zero risk.

If you had invested in your skill set you would be far better at your job. Your increased skills at your job would be more likely to enable you to weather an economic downturn.

That is the point I tried to make originally.
 
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