Apartment building is falling apart :eek:

[vincenzo]

I saw an old flat building, 3 stories tall. It looks very old, brick, not on a slab, and there are big cracks all over it, visible from the inside & out, and quite a few bricks are loose or missing at various places.

I'm not planning to buy there, but i thought what if i had one of those flats? Is the building gonna get condemned/declared unsafe/demolished before it eventually collapses by itself?

Would insurance cover it if one of the above happened?

If it can be repaired, how would the bill be paid? Body corp fees?

And can the body corp and/or owners decide/vote to knock it down and build a new building?

 

[Celeste]

II'm not planning to buy there, but i thought what if i had one of those flats? Is the building gonna get condemned/declared unsafe/demolished before it eventually collapses by itself?

Would insurance cover it if one of the above happened? I doubt it, as it is lack of maintanance or just old, badly built etc etc

If it can be repaired, how would the bill be paid? Body corp fees? Yes, but the owners have to agree.

And can the body corp and/or owners decide/vote to knock it down and build a new building? Yes, If they have a meeting and all agree.

Hope this helps. I think if I were an owner I would vote to knock it down and sell the land off.....

 

[Ajax]

Was about to buy my first property in 1992 in Manly, Sydney -a large 2 bedroom + sunroom unit on Pittwater Road (so a bit noisey). Real estate agent pushed the price up on me from about 172k to 175k (taking advantage of my inexperience).

I then got a building inspection...was advised not to buy as building had cracks in the rear wall no where near my unit (large 15 unit block) going up an entire 3 storeys and was warning about substantial special levies needed to fix this. Each unit owner would be required to contribute as it would be a body corporate issue. Would have involved underpinning and repairing of cracks. A lot of units/houses built on the flat parts of Manly are built on sand which he said can move causing cracks. I did not proceed and real estate agent was quite p*ssed off.

Same unit would sell for around $650-$700k now..not sure what happened with the cracks in the wall.


Ajax

 

[vincenzo]

I hate real esate agents or any salesman with an attitude, i'm gonna slap the next one that pisses me off

So how much is a substantial levy? Do you know what it would have cost to fix that manly building?

The block i saw had 18 flats in it, and the cracks are throughout the building, rear, middle, front, interior walls & exterior.

Anyone know roughly what repairs would cost for a building like the one i saw?

 

[vincenzo]

I'm guessing the building would need the equivalent of re-stumping, which i assume would at least $200k for a three story 18 flat building?

And i assume the tenants & belongings would all have to be moved out while the repairs take place?

 

[Celeste]

Hi vincenzo

I do not know about $$ to fix the cracks, it would depend on how bad they are, where on the building, access to the site. etc etc etc...

I can tell you this, the apartment building where I am currently doing a reno is 3 stories, 15 apartments on a small skinny block.

We need 12 wooden patio doors replaced and 4 duct doors - see photos.

We had a quote to replace the existing wooden patio doors with the same of
$1000 each and the duct doors at $1000 each, we decided 4 patio doors are urgent.
So, 4 patio and 4 duct doors, equated to a special levy of $550 each apartment. $8000.00

Now, I have had quotes to replace the patio door with sliding aliminium at $1800 each. there are 12 altogether. $21600

Also, the front large windows need fixing and or replacing with aliminium, for this we need scaffolding etc etc There are 6 of these windows at about $2k plus we need scaffolding and sissor lifts etc etc .

So you can see things add up really quickly.

Celeste

 

[vincenzo]

Wow, you own the whole thing? That's awesome!

The photo may be small, but it looks like it's in good nick.
It may be expensive, but either rendering or probably better to get some sort of panelling stuck on would really make it look new!
Are you gonna keep the balcony fence & handrails white? I reckon a darker color, like maybe a tan or reddy/brown would look pretty good, imo anyway.

The place i saw however, looked like there's been an earthquake in the area, almost as if bush invaded or something!

It had me wondering, that if someone bought there, what costs would they be in for? Or would it be possible that the place would get declared unsafe/condemned?
I think the cracked 15 unit building that Ajax saw, cost something like $300k to repair, back in 1991! and the condition of that building sounds not even half as bad as the wreck i saw

 

[Alabex]

Was about to buy my first property in 1992 in Manly, Sydney -a large 2 bedroom + sunroom unit on Pittwater Road (so a bit noisey). Real estate agent pushed the price up on me from about 172k to 175k (taking advantage of my inexperience).

I then got a building inspection...was advised not to buy as building had cracks in the rear wall no where near my unit (large 15 unit block) going up an entire 3 storeys and was warning about substantial special levies needed to fix this. Each unit owner would be required to contribute as it would be a body corporate issue. Would have involved underpinning and repairing of cracks. A lot of units/houses built on the flat parts of Manly are built on sand which he said can move causing cracks. I did not proceed and real estate agent was quite p*ssed off.

Same unit would sell for around $650-$700k now..not sure what happened with the cracks in the wall.


Ajax

As a Manly Real Estate agent why was i not suprised to hear this? There is a building in manly - relatively new (i think it was built about 8 years ago) and it is sinking!!! because it is built on sand like most of the flat of manly.... again it is on Pittwater Road. I know they have already starting talking about the repair bill - i heard a rummour it was going to be about 20k per owner for the 20 odd owners in the block.

 

[Alabex]

I hate real esate agents or any salesman with an attitude, i'm gonna slap the next one that pisses me off

So how much is a substantial levy? Do you know what it would have cost to fix that manly building?

The block i saw had 18 flats in it, and the cracks are throughout the building, rear, middle, front, interior walls & exterior.

Anyone know roughly what repairs would cost for a building like the one i saw?

*ducks* just incase i am the real estate agent who pisses you off

 

[Celeste]

Hi all

Correction, I do not own the whole building, just 1 apartment.

I did however get on the council of owners (mind I got voted president) to push them into doing some upgrading. re-painting / replacing balcony doors, windows etc with aluminium sliding, resurfacing of the carpark area, fixing the plumbing to reduce the repair costs (they spent $4k last year unblocking pipes ..to much...) etc etc etc. Some of these items have become safety issues.... We are also short a couple of carparking spaces, which I will try into get sorted with the re-surfacing of the carpark area. More value....

The balcony railings are that yukky 70's sk blue. I am going to push for gun metal grey / blue repaint. I am figuring out a cost schedule for me to paint all the railings to submit to council.

My aim is to get some work done whilst I own the apartment ie I have organised replacement of some the balcony doors with aluminium sliding already. Voted on levy raised and collected, mine is first.

I hope to have the council set up with a 3-4yr refab plan with special levies all in place when I am ready to sell in 4 weeks.

I will sell the apartment with some of the special levies already paid and play up the capital growth the will eventuate with the buildings refurb etc etc.
I hope to have all the railing painted by then also. It will look so much better.

You need to keep in mind when buying an apartment that you have to deal with other people, those that want to upgrade (spend money) and those that do not and then there are those that want the ins and outs of a dogs dinner before they will decide.......... it can be very frustrating.......

 

[vincenzo]

I'd go for gun metal grey, as i don't think blue would suit the color of the bricks.

A bonus feature of gun metal grey, is that if the windows are left white it will still look good. It would probably look good if the railings and balcony window frames are all painted gunmetal grey, and the outer windows are left white, since they will be more expensive to paint, with the required scaffolding and/or cherry picker.

I like to photoshop various ideas for myself & friends so we can see exactly how they will look, and we can make decisions based not just based on our own opinions, but on the responses of others.
Have you been photoshopping your ideas?

Shame you don't own the whole thing and why sell?

 

[Celeste]

I'd go for gun metal grey, as i don't think blue would suit the color of the bricks.

I like to photoshop various ideas for myself & friends so we can see exactly how they will look, and we can make decisions based not just based on our own opinions, but on the responses of others.
Have you been photoshopping your ideas?

Shame you don't own the whole thing and why sell?

Hi vincenzo

Yep I play around with photoshop, just love it. I will have to post some movie posters I have been working on for our theatre room... Things like the Charlies angels poster starring my 2 daughters and me..... The best one so far is my 6yr old as the 40ft women..........hehehe. actuall, I will post this one now it's brilliant.

As for selling it...well I am in the process of setting up a renovation business and I need a little cash flow.....

 

[Big Tone]

Was about to buy my first property in 1992 in Manly, Sydney -a large 2 bedroom + sunroom unit on Pittwater Road (so a bit noisey). Real estate agent pushed the price up on me from about 172k to 175k (taking advantage of my inexperience).

I then got a building inspection...was advised not to buy as building had cracks in the rear wall no where near my unit (large 15 unit block) going up an entire 3 storeys and was warning about substantial special levies needed to fix this. Each unit owner would be required to contribute as it would be a body corporate issue. Would have involved underpinning and repairing of cracks. A lot of units/houses built on the flat parts of Manly are built on sand which he said can move causing cracks. I did not proceed and real estate agent was quite p*ssed off.

Same unit would sell for around $650-$700k now..not sure what happened with the cracks in the wall.


Ajax

I live quite close to manly...........give me the address and I will let you know how those cracks are going!!!!!!!!!

 

[vincenzo]

Since it's baby photo time, i might as well show what my boy is wasting his pocket money on...

 

[Ajax]

Big Tone,

I think it was 71 Pittwater Road, Manly. Spent a good 12 months looking in Manly in 1992 (every weekend).

Spoke with many agents in relation to many properties, even an agent (Jim Frecklington) who also built horse drawn carrriages for the Queen!

http://www.theage.com.au/news/natio...fit-for-a-queen/2006/07/14/1152637871154.html

When you look on real estate.com.au at a map for most properties in Manly and scoll along Pittwater Road it is marked as 71 (it could be lot 71). It has a large rear yard with a carport for quite a few cars. You would need to walk down the lane behind the units (Kangaroo Lane) to see the back of the building as the problem was with the rear wall. I have no idea what has been done to the building since 1992.

A pity because it was a great unit-very high ceilings. Was the middle one at the front of the building. Had a back door off the kitchen with access via stairs to back yard. 2 bedrooms and a sunroom, kitchen, bathroom, lounge room all unrenovated.

It was middle of the recession (12% unemployment) and I was trying to buy my first PPOR. I was retrenched in early 1993 from my job in the cbd and ended up working in Parramatta-so probably a good thing I did not buy in Manly.

Ajax

 

[wish-ga]

...what if i had one of those flats? Is the building gonna get condemned/declared unsafe/demolished before it eventually collapses by itself?

Would insurance cover it if one of the above happened?

If it can be repaired, how would the bill be paid? Body corp fees?

Buildings deteriorating and insufficient funds to carry out the repairs mean owners get a 'special levy'. Additional pment beyond quarterly body corporate fees. Owners could be hit up for thousands of dollars at a few months notice. Bummer.

To avoid this situation all body corporates (in NSW) must have a business plan. In part it addresses up and coming works making it easier to see if there will be enough money to replace the guttering in two years time (or whatever needs doing).

 

[Houses Now]

71 Pittwater Rd is stand alive and well

Hi Ajax,

We live in an apartment in 71 Pittwater Rd. It's funny to read about it on this forum. We bought here mid 2004 for $505K, and that was cheap at the time. They are fantastic units, just as you said, huge interiors (100m2 +) heaps of character, garages, big lawns etc and very solidly built. There are in fact only 9 apartments in the building.

Your building inspector was correct about the cracks, but it was not terminal. The building is triple brick construction and many of the steel ties which hold the layers together had rusted so the outer layer was moving and cracking. In 2002 some major work was done and new ties were put in, lots of repointing of the mortar and window arch bars replaced. This was before we bought and they spent about $55,000. No special levy was raised.

There's a few small cracks returning, inside and out and the we'd like to repaint the facade so we'll need to spend a bit more money in the near future. We love the building, there are only 2 tenants out of 9 apartments so everyone has pride in the building.

We've been approached by a developer who's interested in the entire property, unfortunately he'd knock it down to make the most of the huge block and duel street access. We've opened up the kitchen/dining and put in a new kitchen, we recently had ours valued around the $750k mark so we're happy with that.

I think if the developer deal falls through then this building will last for another 85 years with a little TLC.