Architect has taken us for a ride.

[Luke Benett]

We decided to to use a architect to design an extension on our home which included large open plan living and a second story extension.

On our first meeting we made it clear that his design has to fall within our budget.

He verbally told us he will design something within our budget.



Throughout the plans there were five stages from sketch design to contract documentation.

At the first stage of the plans (sketch design) we requested the architect to run the plans by a builder who he had highly recommended to do our job. They knew each other well and have worked on many projects together in the past.

The architect called us back after looking at the plans with the builder and told us this will fall within our budget.

We decided then to go ahead with the completion of the drawings.

Once the drawings were complete we were very keen to start with the renovations/extension. We paid the architect in full which was over $30,000 not including engineering costs which were a further $6,000.

We then got the architect to get back to the original builder and give us a set price. To our supprise the price went up by $300,000. Throughout the process we did not alter the plans at all.

We then decided to tender the job and all the quotes were approx $400,000 more than our budget.

The way I feel is that the architect has not done what we have paid for. We paid him to design something in our budget and he told us he would.

We have these great plans that we can not use. Yes we can make some changes to shave the price a little but not $300,000.

 

[Kristine..]

Hello Luke

We also paid really serious money to 2 x architects and 1 x draftsman and have nothing whatsoever to show for it

More to the point, we are now nearly two years down the track, and the interest expense on an empty house has meant that the money has been spent on interest - and as you can't spend the money twice, this means that our build budget has been reduced significantly

We, too, were quite clear about the budget and were given assurances by both architects that the job would be within budget, so we kept on with the job and kept paying the invoices as they were presented to us.

Until, of course, the final 'cost estimate' which left us feeling like stunned - and rather stupid - mullets!

About the only thing you can do is contact eg Archicentre and ask them what recourse you have

Good luck. As you have already paid the bill there may not really be much you can do without spending the same amount again on legal fees.


Regards
Kristine

 

[Luke Benett]

Hello Kristine.
Thank you for your reply. Im sorry to hear you are in a similar situation to us.
My heart goes out to you.
The plan was to spend this christmas in our new home, but this is not going to happen.

 

[Aaron_C]

Luke - what was the extension exactly? How big was it (in sqm)? What was your budget? As you've found out the hard way, architects are not cost estimators. In fact, I think they are quite bad at cost estimating.

The architect I used recommended a quantity surveyor to budget the cost of construction early-on so I have a fair/rough idea of what to expect.

I also talked to my own builder, showed him my sketch designs and he came up with a ball-park estimate of costs. Ultimately, you can only trust the architect so-much - he is not a QS so don't expect him to act as one.

 

[Luke Benett]

Hello Aaron.
Our budget was $700,000, which included renovating the existing house and adding a large open plan living with two bedroom upstairs.
Our architect also recommended we have his builder view the designs to give us a approx price. He said the whole project will come in at under $700,000.
This was at stage one of the plans, we were $7k down with the architect. I was happy to loose that money if the plans were going to be over our budget. When the plans were tendered to 3 builders it ranged from $1m to 1.2m.
Yes the architect is not a builder nor can he give a exact price of build, but he should not give misleading information. He should not have told us that he will design our hoe on a budget.

 

[Aaron_C]

Hi Luke,

It's unfortunate that that has happened to you. From the sound of things the actual amount of work involved is quite substantial - probably 300sqm of renovations? Given that you've actually gone to the trouble of engaging an architect I imagine you've included lots of nice features like glass, proper benchtops, nice tiles/floor coverings etc.

Where is the property located? That might also have an impact on how much it costs to build

 

[SeafordSunshine]

So sorry to hear you had a similar experience

Hello,
we had the same thing,
briefed the architect, we wanted to spend $50k, not including kitchen, carpets, internal decorating. he offered free site visits as he lived nearby.

We got a design that cost $170k, and paid quite a bit for something that was nowhere near out brief, just to get rid of them.
It was harassment!
If I have recourse to use someone of that profession again, I will stand over them....
and question everything.
I am sure not all architects are like that
Cheers
SeafordSunshine

 

[Norbulinka]

In The Future.....

Hi All,
I'm an architect and would like to respond to the above stories....
Comments relating to architects not being the best 'cost estimators' are reasonably correct, however an architect should have a rough idea of square meter rates based upon the level of finish that you require. Ideally your architect/ designer will recommend employing the services of a cost planner/ QS from the earlies stages of the job, with updates throughout the design and documentation process. Tracking the budget is vital to a successful outcome. I hope you can achieve your goals, in a realistic way. Getting a realistic price is the preserve of a professional whom you pay to deliver the right service.
Best of luck in achieving your goals. J.

 

[Kristine..]

Hello Norbulinka

Welcome to the Forum

Perhaps you can detail for us how we go about lodging a complaint and making a claim for part or full refund of fees?

If you are a registered architect - as both the architects I paid were and are, you would have knowledge of the complaint process

It would be helpful to have an architect who has done no wrong (you) to be able to provide some information on this process

I was raised to 'turn the other cheek' and I firmly believe that the best revenge is success.

However, these two architects, both of at least 25 years experience, who each told us how experienced they are, simply took us for a ride happily issuing invoices and taking no design or costing responsibility whatsoever

For this lack of responsibility I want them to be held accountable. It is not enough for them to sidestep professional responsibility by making out that 'they just did what the client wanted'. The client has sought a suitably qualified professional person of whom to ask professional advice, and that advise would certainly include pricing guidelines

Ten years ago, we sold a prime block of land because of the architect. Fees at that time came to more than $10,000 and - wait for it - he designed a house with a swimming pool cantilevered out through the living room (we would have had a bridge to cross the pool) and he suggested asking the neighbour for a 'right of way' driveway as our block would have been too cramped for him to fit a driveway in.

He totally ignored our clearly stated budget but again, it all took so long and was such an unhappy and costly process that we ended up selling the block in despair.

Are these the actions of 'professional' people? Of ‘responsible’ people? Not in my definition of professional and responsible

No body wants to be a whinger, but sometimes people just should be asked to explain their actions.

So your information on how to go about making a complaint about an architect would be welcome

Regards
Kristine

 

[evand]

What was the architects reason when you questioned them about the huge over budget?

We decided to to use a architect to design an extension on our home which included large open plan living and a second story extension.

On our first meeting we made it clear that his design has to fall within our budget.

He verbally told us he will design something within our budget.



Throughout the plans there were five stages from sketch design to contract documentation.

At the first stage of the plans (sketch design) we requested the architect to run the plans by a builder who he had highly recommended to do our job. They knew each other well and have worked on many projects together in the past.

The architect called us back after looking at the plans with the builder and told us this will fall within our budget.

We decided then to go ahead with the completion of the drawings.

Once the drawings were complete we were very keen to start with the renovations/extension. We paid the architect in full which was over $30,000 not including engineering costs which were a further $6,000.

We then got the architect to get back to the original builder and give us a set price. To our supprise the price went up by $300,000. Throughout the process we did not alter the plans at all.

We then decided to tender the job and all the quotes were approx $400,000 more than our budget.

The way I feel is that the architect has not done what we have paid for. We paid him to design something in our budget and he told us he would.

We have these great plans that we can not use. Yes we can make some changes to shave the price a little but not $300,000.

 

[veseli]

Im a builder, i priced many many projects which never ended up being built for the exactly same reason. Architects have no idea of the costs, and sqm is guide only, it could go 50k up or down very easily.

Im sure you can sue them for the damages, all Architects must have professional indemnity insurance, and they should be liable for the mistakes, just like i am when something goes wrong.

Your budget of 700k sounds massive for the amount of works you described.
i've done jobs between 200-300k for second storey extension and full house renovation, so for what you are doing it must be huge renovation job, or just difficult one and your approached expensive builders.

 

[Luke Benett]

Hi Evand.
The architects response to the blow out in budget was apparently the location we live in.
Most of his work is in this area so he should have had some idea.
The way I see it, he was paid to design something in our budget but has failed us.

 

[evand]

He knew where you lived before you gave him your brief. And how does your location alter it by that huge amount.

I would be demanding that he re does it in the initial design brief (to your budget) or a full refund.

You arent talking about small change there, dont just accept it.

Hi Evand.
The architects response to the blow out in budget was apparently the location we live in.
Most of his work is in this area so he should have had some idea.
The way I see it, he was paid to design something in our budget but has failed us.

 

[lizzie]

After 10 years of dealing with architects and draftsmen I am very disillusioned with the entire profession.

Time and time again I've had plans drawn up "NOT" to my specification. Even to the point where I provide them with "to scale" plans of exactly what I want - and they still get it wrong. But of course, then they charge you like wounded bulls to redraw their muck up.

My last case was a architect - who was recommended - to draw our new reno's. She took on the job, drew up the CAD plans of existing house then asked to be released from the contract due to personal reasons.

No probs - she'd done the initial CAD work so I paid the bill and she forwarded it on to a draftsman. Turns out every (and I mean every) measurement on the plans was wrong, so the draftsman had to come back, remeasure everything and redraw - at our expense.

I have asked several time for a refund from original architect as they did not supply what they had been paid for. The silence is deafening. For the sake of $2.5k it's not worth legal action - but I am really peeved!

Another black mark against the whole lot of 'em

 

[pieman]

I'm in Brighton and have recent significant work done. There is a definate load up factor in my suburb as there is an assumption made that you have unlimited funds. We used a designer who had completed a fair amount if work in the area so had ideas on costs per sqm. Sounds like your architect should have known this as well. I'd be seeking some return on all the money you've paid as they seem negligent to provide a drawing that is not to the clients scope of work. You outlined your budget from day 1, correct?
Btw must be a nice reno, we did an additional story for our house for about 360 but had quotes to mid 4's

 

[Dazz]

Our budget was $700,000, which included renovating the existing house and adding a large open plan living with two bedroom upstairs. When the plans were tendered to 3 builders it ranged from $1m to 1.2m.

Builders / architects and literally all trades who delve into the renovations arena apply a huge mark-up for the "unknown" factor of retro-fitting to an existing place, especially when a 2nd storey is involved.

My only suggestion would be, put a bulldozer through the existing house, go straight to a builder who does 2 storey cookie cutter homes and chop out the architect altogether.

For your 700K budget, you can certainly get many builders who will build you a very nice brand spanking 2 storey home....probably with more features and better fittings than what you are attempting to modify now.

 

[wylie]

I agree with Dazz on this one. Whilst we love our house, for the cost of adding a living level under the existing footprint, we could have bulldozed and built again. There can be so many hiccups when renovating or adding to an older house that it can be just as cheap to build a whole house.

 

[pieman]

Any heritage overlay on your property?
May have been forced into using the facade.

 

[wylie]

Any heritage overlay on your property?
May have been forced into using the facade.

DCP but our house was built in 1959 so no problems there. Neighbours had to keep their facade, but they had no plans of knocking down and rebuilding. Neither did we, but with hindsight, it would have been possibly better to do so.

 

[pieman]

sorry, was referring to the original poster.
Friends of ours have ended up spending 1m on a reno of an edwardian on a small block round the cnr. There is no way known you could bulldoze the whole house as the street is all HO, so they were left with the challenge of upgrading and building around a poor floorplan although it would have been much cheaper to start again.